so youre not a submissive then, or you are, which is it.

so youre not a submissive then, or you are, which is it. (Full Version)

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lally2 -> so youre not a submissive then, or you are, which is it. (7/6/2010 10:25:58 AM)
i happen to be quite proud to identify with who i am and what i am - submissive and whilst i might not be submissive to everyone all of the time, my nature is to be giving and i tend to put other people first out of prefferance we had a discussion a while ago about how can a slave consider herself a slave if she's without a Master - the responses were mixed, but generally speaking the self identified slaves felt that they were of a slave type simply waiting for their Dominant to come along some time (hopefully soon). so im curious, why is it that some submissives appear to ditch their submissive identity and only identify as sub when with a Dominant. if we accept that subs are not weak, helpless creatures and that in some respects they may even have to be stronger in order to get through life on their own and if we accept that the overt submission expressed with a Dominant is specific to that Dominant and not everyone is given the insight into who we are otherwise - why is it that to say we have a submissive nature or a submissive personality or that we are submissves living outside of a Ds dynamic makes people twitch and switch about and try to find some other explanation for themselves. id love to understand this. thank you xx

myotherself -> RE: so youre not a submissive then, or you are, which is it. (7/6/2010 10:38:12 AM)
In my day to day working life, I'm very dominant. I control my work, and that makes me happy and secure. But it's a lot of pressure, and when I'm in a relationship I yearn for the times when I can go home and let someone else shoulder the burden. I identify as submissive, and with the right Dominant, I absolutely am. With everyone else, I guess I wear my 'work face' - I'm in control of my life until I'm lucky enough to find someone who wants to take over for me.

juliaoceania -> RE: so youre not a submissive then, or you are, which is it. (7/6/2010 10:45:44 AM)
quote: so im curious, why is it that some submissives appear to ditch their submissive identity and only identify as sub when with a Dominant. Because I am only submissive to a man that brings this out in me, and I do not feel generally "submissive" in any other way. Hell, who knows, I may never feel that way again....

AquaticSub -> RE: so youre not a submissive then, or you are, which is it. (7/6/2010 11:42:52 AM)
~Fast Reply~ I really don't know. Being heterosexual doesn't mean that you are attracted to everyone of X gender or that you are always looking for a sexual/romantic relationship - simply that when you want one, you look for someone that is X gender. I tend to see submissive/dominant as the same thing. Just because I'm submissive doesn't mean I'm always looking for a dominant. Just because I'm poly doesn't mean I'm always looking for new partners. They are simply terms that describe what I want when I'm looking, or if Fate decides to bless me, the sort of person that can appear out of the blue to sweep me off my feet. As always, others see things differently. This is just how I see them.

WestBaySlave -> RE: so youre not a submissive then, or you are, which is it. (7/6/2010 12:36:23 PM)
If we're speaking of submission outside of a relationship with a dominant? Sometimes. If you're a friend who wants to go to a restaurant I may not be a fan of and say "sure", then I suppose I am submissive. If you're trying to get me to stand down on an issue I see as an important matter of principle, then I am not submissive in the least. My submission is always conditional and situational. It's never a simple case of "on" or "off".

lally2 -> RE: so youre not a submissive then, or you are, which is it. (7/6/2010 12:47:09 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: juliaoceania quote: so im curious, why is it that some submissives appear to ditch their submissive identity and only identify as sub when with a Dominant. Because I am only submissive to a man that brings this out in me, and I do not feel generally "submissive" in any other way. Hell, who knows, I may never feel that way again.... ill agree that i dont feel submissive towards people in general and i reserve submission for the man im with but just because i dont feel submissive or im not in submission to a Dominant, does not mean that i have stopped being who i am. i totally respect what youre saying here - and thank you for writing back and what youre saying is pretty much what myotherself and aquaticsub are saying too. so let me ask this, if youre not submissives ordinarily are you then vanilla - the reason i ask is that when most submissive types identify with who or rather how they want to be in a relationship, as a choice it is generally as a sub. if they wanted vanilla they wouldnt be here looking for a Dom. so at some point the identification of a prefferance must surely have some bearing on orientation. isnt it possible then that our orientation is submissive (though i take on board that you would say not and you may never feel this way again) but im asking everyone i suppose, i just picked on youre post. [:D]

lally2 -> RE: so youre not a submissive then, or you are, which is it. (7/6/2010 12:55:28 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: WestBaySlave If we're speaking of submission outside of a relationship with a dominant? Sometimes. If you're a friend who wants to go to a restaurant I may not be a fan of and say "sure", then I suppose I am submissive. If you're trying to get me to stand down on an issue I see as an important matter of principle, then I am not submissive in the least. My submission is always conditional and situational. It's never a simple case of "on" or "off". hi WBS, yes, we are. [:D] - and i agree with you - my nature is such that ill follow the prevailing wind pretty much, but if its to make a stand on something i believe in i will - but im pretty consistant with that in or out of a relationship. depends on the issue of course. and i agree with you, i dont see submission as an 'on' or 'off' thing either, hence this post. whether in submission or not, surely our orientation remains with us if only as a prefferrance.

pyroaquatic -> RE: so youre not a submissive then, or you are, which is it. (7/6/2010 1:03:51 PM)
For now I will be content with survival. For now I will be content with nothing. Dominance, Submission.... All I want is happiness at this point. And cuddling.

SimplyMichael -> RE: so youre not a submissive then, or you are, which is it. (7/6/2010 1:11:24 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: juliaoceania quote: so im curious, why is it that some submissives appear to ditch their submissive identity and only identify as sub when with a Dominant. Because I am only submissive to a man that brings this out in me, and I do not feel generally "submissive" in any other way. Hell, who knows, I may never feel that way again.... What she said...

marie2 -> RE: so youre not a submissive then, or you are, which is it. (7/6/2010 1:11:25 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: lally2 so im curious, why is it that some submissives appear to ditch their submissive identity and only identify as sub when with a Dominant. For me, it's not a matter of "ditching" it, since I can't ditch something that I don't consider myself to have. While I am submissive oriented within a relationship, I don't consider myself to be a submissive. In other words, it's an equal and opposite, and very personal part of a relationship dynamic for me, rather than a way that I self-identify. Outwardly, you know, out in the regular world (with friends, co-workers etc), I can be described as a helpful and caring person, also very compromising, passive unless I have to make a stand, and in general kind of on the shy and reserved side. I do realize that these personality traits can be broadly and generally common amongst those who consider themselves submissives, however, in my case I simply see it more as incidental, rather than a definition and conclusion that I am "a submissive". On the other hand, when I want, and need to be, I can also express what could be considered loosely as "dominant" traits. It makes me uncomfortable when I have to stand up to someone, confront and correct something, but I can, will and have done it under certain circumstances. So I don't ditch anything at all. I'm actually all of me in my different facets depending upon the situation, relationship, or circumstances. The submission in the relationship is a part of me, however it is not my self-identity in general.

juliaoceania -> RE: so youre not a submissive then, or you are, which is it. (7/6/2010 1:19:35 PM)
quote: so let me ask this, if youre not submissives ordinarily are you then vanilla - the reason i ask is that when most submissive types identify with who or rather how they want to be in a relationship, as a choice it is generally as a sub. if they wanted vanilla they wouldnt be here looking for a Dom. so at some point the identification of a prefferance must surely have some bearing on orientation. I am living out on my own, no kids, no mate, no one but me, for the first time in my life... for the last year. I do not have to think of anyone but me for most of the time.I consider my own needs first. I kinda like it. Now I might get tired of it down the road, but thinking of my needs first has been rather empowering. I do not have to wait for someone else to take care of my needs. I do not have to worry that I am not doing what I should be doing.... and this in some ways is delicious... It has caused me some identity crisis... perhaps I am not really submissive anymore? I don't know, I don't care, I do not value myself based upon my submissiveness, or lack thereof anyways. I like my hair pulled, I still fantasize about being sexually dominated. So it is not completely gone, but for the most part, I am enjoying my freedom and my life and I just want to be happy and to be me... What label gets attached to that doesn't matter, the happiness and enrichment in my future relationship is what is most important to me... however we define that

lally2 -> RE: so youre not a submissive then, or you are, which is it. (7/6/2010 1:23:08 PM)
thank you marie2 - im begining to understand this much better now - though not sure where it leaves me [:D] - since i do identify as an s'type - not as a label i hasten to add, but as a type. during times when ive not been in a relationship that side of me doesnt float off into the ether, i dont suddenly become vanilla and start dating them and i dont suddenly become dominant and change my personality to being fully in charge of my environment (i wish [&:]).

xxblushesxx -> RE: so youre not a submissive then, or you are, which is it. (7/6/2010 1:23:46 PM)
We are multi-faceted personalities. Different people/situations bring out certain reactions, submissive or no.

lally2 -> RE: so youre not a submissive then, or you are, which is it. (7/6/2010 1:29:51 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: juliaoceania quote: so let me ask this, if youre not submissives ordinarily are you then vanilla - the reason i ask is that when most submissive types identify with who or rather how they want to be in a relationship, as a choice it is generally as a sub. if they wanted vanilla they wouldnt be here looking for a Dom. so at some point the identification of a prefferance must surely have some bearing on orientation. I am living out on my own, no kids, no mate, no one but me, for the first time in my life... for the last year. I do not have to think of anyone but me for most of the time.I consider my own needs first. I kinda like it. Now I might get tired of it down the road, but thinking of my needs first has been rather empowering. I do not have to wait for someone else to take care of my needs. I do not have to worry that I am not doing what I should be doing.... and this in some ways is delicious... It has caused me some identity crisis... perhaps I am not really submissive anymore? I don't know, I don't care, I do not value myself based upon my submissiveness, or lack thereof anyways. I like my hair pulled, I still fantasize about being sexually dominated. So it is not completely gone, but for the most part, I am enjoying my freedom and my life and I just want to be happy and to be me... What label gets attached to that doesn't matter, the happiness and enrichment in my future relationship is what is most important to me... however we define that i can completely relate to that [:D] - i had a hiatus for a time and it was wonderful. i questioned whether or not i wanted to go back into an Ms or Ds relationship purely on the strength of the fact that i was having a wonderful time pleasing myself. the thing is that i dont equate my orientation with whether or not im in a relationship - a relationship doesnt define me. in that hiatus there was a brief second, well one date, when i went out with a vanilla. i knew before i went out with him that i was wasting his time. i knew it wouldnt go to a second date because my orientation doesnt swing that way. i preferred to be on my own rather than be with a vanilla. i dont like labels either, but im not really approaching this as a label thing. its either an orientation or it isnt surely. whether youre in a wonderful, selfish place right now, and i know how much fun that is!!! - it maybe doesnt alter youre orientation

juliaoceania -> RE: so youre not a submissive then, or you are, which is it. (7/6/2010 1:35:33 PM)
quote: dont suddenly become vanilla and start dating them and i dont suddenly become dominant and change my personality to being fully in charge of my environment (i wish ). lally, I do not know much about your history... but have you ever had a long term D/s relationship end on you? I think part of my answer is because I am still healing from my last one. I still love him, and he says he still loves me, and while I am not going to go into it here I have to say that when you have a relationship that was really important to you, and it ends, this kinda leaves you reconfiguring what you want to do in the future in your next relationship. I don't know what I want to give next time around. I don't know how it should be. I think that feeling this way is fairly "normal", and no, I don't view my entire existence as a human being as being a submissive. I am much more complex than I stereotype of submissiveness... whatever the ideation of what "submissive" even is anyways.... Most of the characteristics I see as being labelled "submissive" I don't think are. I do not think serving people is a submissive thing, for example. I do not think of "giving" as a submissive trait... these are personality traits that GOOD people have, not just "submissive"people. So when you say are you "submissive" all the time, well no, I am a good, empathetic, kind, giving person... you have labelled that as "submissive", me not so much

NorthernGent -> RE: so youre not a submissive then, or you are, which is it. (7/6/2010 1:40:53 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: lally2 thank you marie2 - im begining to understand this much better now - though not sure where it leaves me [:D] No more than having a different take on life to Marie. I can relate to Marie's take on it.....I have no wish to dominant anyone outside of my relationships.....as it happens I think it's an absolute must to adhere to the contract at work.....and as far as I know there's nothing in there that says: "you're the dominant...show them how it's done"...and by no stretch of the imagination do I exude a dominance as I walk down the office that would keep the mob from hunting me down where I didn't keep my wits about me.....I'd say the reason why I've been successful in my career is due to being balanced and reasonable.....among other things...rather than expecting and aspiring to having colleagues tow the line set by me. And with my mates....I'll go with the flow...no wish to be 'the leader of the pack'...I'm probably anything but the leader.....quite happy to have a beer a chat and let others decide what's going on........I'm a big fan of attaining the dominant role with a woman with whom I'm in a relationship......that is the essence of it for me....as opposed to with mates or family or acquaintenances.....would be far too much time and energy wasted....and probably friends lost....by running round thinking I'm in charge.... In sum....I don't see a disconnect....there's a relationship and then there's public life...two entirely different spheres of life.... And to answer your question.....which relates to 'a submissive nature'.....is that possible? surely in some area you're telling someone how it is? But then....take all of the above as the words of someone who doesn't believe in an enduring self....so my post is all couched in that underlying premise...and I'm sure others will see it differently.

lally2 -> RE: so youre not a submissive then, or you are, which is it. (7/6/2010 1:46:22 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: juliaoceania quote: dont suddenly become vanilla and start dating them and i dont suddenly become dominant and change my personality to being fully in charge of my environment (i wish ). lally, I do not know much about your history... but have you ever had a long term D/s relationship end on you? I think part of my answer is because I am still healing from my last one. I still love him, and he says he still loves me, and while I am not going to go into it here I have to say that when you have a relationship that was really important to you, and it ends, this kinda leaves you reconfiguring what you want to do in the future in your next relationship. I don't know what I want to give next time around. I don't know how it should be. I think that feeling this way is fairly "normal", and no, I don't view my entire existence as a human being as being a submissive. I am much more complex than I stereotype of submissiveness... whatever the ideation of what "submissive" even is anyways.... Most of the characteristics I see as being labelled "submissive" I don't think are. I do not think serving people is a submissive thing, for example. I do not think of "giving" as a submissive trait... these are personality traits that GOOD people have, not just "submissive"people. So when you say are you "submissive" all the time, well no, I am a good, empathetic, kind, giving person... you have labelled that as "submissive", me not so much the hiatus i went through was after a big relationship that meant lots to me hit the rocks - so i went off too and licked my wounds and asked myself if i ever wanted to give that much of myself ever again - so i do know what youre talking about. im not sure what the stereotype sub is either - we are all complex people. im a single mother, business woman, sailor, writer, artist, equestrian - none of which label me any more than my knowing that my orientation is submissive sexually and psychologically. if my D and i hit the rocks and i never went out with another D ever again, my orientation would remain the same and i doubt very much id end up with a vanilla - because it wouldnt work.

kiwisub12 -> RE: so youre not a submissive then, or you are, which is it. (7/6/2010 2:38:27 PM)
I'm submissive in my professional life, in that , if someone acts as if they know what they are doing, i go along with their plan. I admire people who are leaders - because that is so not me. I also admire women who can be confrontational with their spouses - because i couldn't do that either. Submissive is part of my nature and the way i react to people. It doesn't change if i am in a relationship - well, its a bit more overt when i'm in a relationship. But the basic part of my personality is always the same.

Missokyst -> RE: so youre not a submissive then, or you are, which is it. (7/6/2010 2:43:36 PM)
I don't know about anyone else, but for me I am submissive by nature and I am dominant by necessity; I excel at what ever the path I walk because control is part of my mental makeup. I could not live in a world without rules and if that means I must dictate them, so be it.

sexyred1 -> RE: so youre not a submissive then, or you are, which is it. (7/6/2010 2:48:47 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: juliaoceania quote: so im curious, why is it that some submissives appear to ditch their submissive identity and only identify as sub when with a Dominant. Because I am only submissive to a man that brings this out in me, and I do not feel generally "submissive" in any other way. Hell, who knows, I may never feel that way again.... Ditto. What a strange question....as we all know, we are all different types of people, therefore different types of submissives.

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