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RE: Monogamy Agonistes - 8/28/2010 9:36:36 PM   
SylvereApLeanan


Posts: 8275
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From: Hell
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Wow. You are seriously demented if you think I am in any way agreeing with you.

And my name is Sylvere. Ms. ap Leanan to you. Please address me in an appropriate fashion.
Thank you.


_____________________________

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(in reply to masterpdg)
Profile   Post #: 141
RE: Monogamy Agonistes - 8/28/2010 9:38:29 PM   
Twoshoes


Posts: 1218
Joined: 7/27/2010
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SpiritedRadiance
heres a fact for you your not as intelligent as you claim.


Who ever is?

quote:


twoshoes,

I generally to not want to descend into emotion especially when basically in a 50 on one situation (which sounds like fun normally).


Are you saying I'm using dirty tricks? Alright, I admit it; I'm a filthy scoundrel!

But consider what you could accomplish if you could word anything you don't care about any way you like! You could convince everyone to use fountain pens again. And those annoying garden gnomes people have in their yards? Gone, forever.
I think you should reconsider "descent into emotion".

quote:


Your phrasing however was very nice.

(Thanks for the compliment. I enjoy being appreciated for what I can provide. You might want to try that approach with others!)


quote:


I am a man of great humor or I wouldnt be typing away tonight under massive assault. I am in the end fascinated how owmen react to a man honest about these issues.

Well, I hope you're entertained. It's definately entertaining watching people respond to you, as illustrated below.

quote:


I AM the dominant Polyamorous guy with the pan-sexual Poly sub/wife who is a voyeur and enjoys watching me have sex with other women whenever I feel like it that you wish you were.
Don't hate me because I am and have everything you want... hate me because I think you're an idiot.


Just ...
Can you sign my t-shirt? Also, one for my cousin.


Disclaimer: My previous post was purely for educational and entertainment purposes. I actually claim nothing, besides not being sure about this topic.

(in reply to SpiritedRadiance)
Profile   Post #: 142
RE: Monogamy Agonistes - 8/28/2010 9:42:22 PM   
masterpdg


Posts: 50
Joined: 5/20/2010
Status: offline
very entertaining

(in reply to Twoshoes)
Profile   Post #: 143
RE: Monogamy Agonistes - 8/28/2010 9:44:20 PM   
masterpdg


Posts: 50
Joined: 5/20/2010
Status: offline
you seriously don't realize that by saying it is your choice, you are agreeing with the fundamental kernel of my argument.

(in reply to masterpdg)
Profile   Post #: 144
RE: Monogamy Agonistes - 8/28/2010 9:45:56 PM   
masterpdg


Posts: 50
Joined: 5/20/2010
Status: offline
Ok, this has been a terrific bit of fun as I enjoy being in the minority and being attacked from all sides.
Nevertheless, we all must sleep and as your augments were so powerful I have decided that all of you are right and I must have been taken over by an evil spirit. Monogamy is natural, always has been for eternity in all religions. Submissives should not really submit they should negotiate (so romantic), and women don’t have their hearts ripped out by this unachievable standard society sets.....and Sarah Palin is presidential material.

On a serious note, I enjoyed the thoughtful comments even those I disagreed with and can not help but wish everyone the best of luck on what is often a difficult journey. Even if I find some of the difficulty self-inflicted, I am aware of the shortage of good intelligent mature men able to handle intelligent women (strange how no one commented when I talked about that) and intelligent women are always the greatest turn-on and their submission the only one of value. I tried to not use any ad hominem arguments and hope I succeeded in that. May you all have a wonderful weekend. :-)

Love,
Patrick

(in reply to masterpdg)
Profile   Post #: 145
RE: Monogamy Agonistes - 8/28/2010 10:01:52 PM   
Elisabella


Posts: 3939
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: masterpdg

I am talking to women who self identify as submissive.


I thought you were talking about slaves?

(in reply to masterpdg)
Profile   Post #: 146
RE: Monogamy Agonistes - 8/28/2010 10:12:45 PM   
Lockit


Posts: 11292
Joined: 5/7/2007
Status: offline
I hope someone has a day job... because the other he is attempting is a huge fail.

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Profile   Post #: 147
RE: Monogamy Agonistes - 8/28/2010 10:48:52 PM   
WyldHrt


Posts: 6412
Joined: 6/5/2008
Status: offline
quote:

Wyld --
First of all some examples of men do not want other women are wonderful, but they do not disprove the general trend anymore than a short man disproves that men a generally taller than women.

Apparently we differ here, as I couldn't care less about 'general trends' when it comes to my own relationships. The very idea that I should compromise, settle for less, find some 'slave mindset' and just deal... essentially twist myself into knots trying to be something that I'm not for the sake of a relationship, is laughable. I did that once, and it cost me nearly a decade of my life (before you go there, no, cheating was not the issue). I'm much happier alone than in a relationship that does not work for me. Yes, a submissive is fully capable of taking care of hirself outside a relationship. We don't actually founder around, lonely and lost, until some 'Master' scoops us up.

BTW, I was just speaking with a Dom I'm very close to, and mentioned your post. He thought it hilarious, as the last thing He wants is a stable of slaves. He is looking for a partner, one woman who will follow his lead. This is not uncommon amongst experienced male Doms, IME.
quote:

I do not think most unattached women over 30 are 'losers' for lack of a better word. In fact just the opposite. Most are highly educated and interesting, and therefore they intimate the masses of men who are unconfident and justly so. I think on average single women in their late 30s or 40s are generally far superior to their male counterparts.

I assume you mean 'intimidate' rather than 'intimate'. As for the thought, why is that, exactly? I'm guessing it is because you think that any man worth his salt will never be divorced, and if he is, it is somehow his fault. Hate to break it to you, but sometimes the woman involved really is a bitch, not a victim, and they guy finally gets out from under. Shit happens on both sides of the fence.
quote:

I know a lot of people are very big on the semantic distinction between sub and slave; I am less so. Submitting means placing yourself under someone and isn't a radically different concept. Conditions limit the eroticism of the concept.
For you, perhaps. But *clue-by-four* you aren't the keeper of other people's relationships, nor do you have any right to impose your personal criteria on anyone else. Your OP was seriously flawed, with assumptions out the ass. You are now reaping what you have sown, which is largely amusing to many of us, judging from the number of post in this thread.


_____________________________

"MotherFUCKER!" is NOT a safeword!!"- Steel
"We've had complaints about 'orgy noises'. This is not the neighborhood for that kind of thing"- PVE Cop

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(in reply to masterpdg)
Profile   Post #: 148
RE: Monogamy Agonistes - 8/28/2010 11:29:35 PM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: SorceressJ

What this man needs is a Gorean kajira, or the closest relative approximation thereto that Urth, I mean Earth can offer him. Kajirae are as fully into the whole He's-always-right-and-can-do-whatever-he-wants-and-can-have-other-slaves-and-this-girl-is-only-here-to-serve-and-be-his thing as any I have had the odd furtune to know. Srsly, and said with zero insult intended to the OP or to any girls with such inclinations. To each their own happiness, IMO.



Whoa! Who fed you that load of crap?

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to SorceressJ)
Profile   Post #: 149
RE: Monogamy Agonistes - 8/28/2010 11:42:04 PM   
WyldHrt


Posts: 6412
Joined: 6/5/2008
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quote:

Never so recent that I get tired of hearing it.
Love you and miss you.

*smooch and hugs... and long hair to play with when we see each other again*
OP- I have no doubt that the former exchange was completely lost on you, which is a shame.




< Message edited by WyldHrt -- 8/28/2010 11:44:35 PM >


_____________________________

"MotherFUCKER!" is NOT a safeword!!"- Steel
"We've had complaints about 'orgy noises'. This is not the neighborhood for that kind of thing"- PVE Cop

Resident "Hypnotic Eyes", "Cleavage" and "Toy Whore"
Subby Mafia, VAA Posse & Team Troll!

(in reply to LadyPact)
Profile   Post #: 150
RE: Monogamy Agonistes - 8/28/2010 11:54:16 PM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline
Lets see, OP.

You stated...


quote:

ORIGINAL: masterpdg

Not when one is slave agrees to it and its open. that is very judgmental of all poly relationships


post 115

You gained the agreement of your own slave, but state the rest of us should just submit and do as he wants.

Here is a twisted question for you. Your wife/slave... what if she had said no?

Here is another...

You state you like intelligent women. I happen to have some level of intelligence, or so i like to believe. And i adore sex... right along with many, many of the other women.. and men... on this site and around the world.

The question is... do i love sex enough to die for it?

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to masterpdg)
Profile   Post #: 151
RE: Monogamy Agonistes - 8/29/2010 12:17:45 AM   
Zevar


Posts: 801
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: masterpdg

A few words on monogamy because they seem necessary. It is difficult to think of an idea that has been more damaging to women in this lifestyle particularly. From a theoretical perspective it undermines dominance and submission as it is the slave/sub placing a jealously and selfishness above her owner’s desires. It is an attempt by property to limit her owner’s pleasure, use and training. Indeed, breaking the deeply ingrained societal bias towards this historically recent concept is crucial to the proper training of a woman. Ultimately, a slave lives and wants to live for her owner’s pleasure not to retard that pleasure and when she can accept that it is normal for any man, let alone an owner of women, to seek numerous pleasures and conquests, she will gain a deeper is not broadly appreciated joy of knowing her surrender is without strings and that she did not have to limit her owner’s pleasure to find her happiness.

That was, of course, a theoretic discussion of power dynamics. There are equally important pragmatic concerns. Initially, many men who agree to the idea of monogamy are simply appeasing (a bad quality in Chamberlin or a Master) and will stray when opportunity presents itself (this is not unique to BDSM obviously although as many into the lifestyle are a touch hypersexual, it may have greater frequency although I have not studied the issue). Where as a man who is honest and upfront about requiring the true submission of his slaves, will most likely be much more honest in general. Moreover, a woman understanding her place and properly trained will not suffer the heartbreak extremely common to women who limited their owner and discovered that his honor was lacking (indeed, has anything caused women more emotional pain than this unnatural expectation?)

Another pragmatic concern is desirability of older single men, and this related most directly to women seeking experienced men above 30 or so. Men who have unable to acquire ownership of a woman by this age will often (not always of course) have failed for legitimate reasons. A single man of forty on this site may well be one or more of the following, live with his mother, be unemployed, have an action figure collection, speak Klingon, read comic books or be overwhelmingly unappealing physically (of course, there are exceptions). My general view of this lifestyle has always been because of the extreme vulnerability slaves are always apt to find themselves in, the quality of the owner is paramount and the conventionality of the situation secondary if not tertiary. Often divorced men will have less negatives at least in traditional dating, but in the lifestyle there is the concern that they have had a woman they could not train and that may sometimes speak to their skills as a Master.

I have met some very nice woman among an amazing amount of frauds on this site, but have also been told by those seeking total slavery and submission that they do not do ‘poly’ or want monogamy. They only dilute the pool of potential owners to exclude the most desirable and talented, set themselves up for almost inevitable heartbreak and undermine the thing they think they are offering. I hope these words help woman, even if just a bit, that the quality of the owner is determined by his honestly and his dominance not his conventionality.



Let me guess….

Preparatory stand up comedy act routine for Vegas? No, Reno?

Seriously, get a day job, keep it & refrain from speaking for anyone but yourself. "Dilute the pool of potential owners..." AKC owner of a pedigree poodle, right? Lose the act ok, just lose it! Enough said!

P.S.
If you care to debate from a clinical perspective the foolish jargon you have cited do advise. If so, I might engage & be willing to refute your position(s), since I am a bona fide clinically trained professional. It clearly appears that you have done nothing but embarrasses yourself with baseless generalizations that are not whatsoever confirmed with clinical studies or cited in any Human Sexuality Journal that I am aware of. Present your evidence if you are indeed a professional/teacher.

Seriously noted!


< Message edited by Zevar -- 8/29/2010 12:36:34 AM >

(in reply to masterpdg)
Profile   Post #: 152
RE: Monogamy Agonistes - 8/29/2010 12:45:35 AM   
TwistedHeart74


Posts: 722
Joined: 9/17/2009
Status: offline
Boy, this sure makes me glad I'm not a slave! I mean, if I read the op correctly, that would mean if my Sir wanted to go around sleeping with multiple women I would have to just take it and deal with it, because to have a bitch fit about it and boot his ass out the door would mean I wasn't a good slave. Wow...poor doormats...er...slaves.

Come on dude, really? True, there are various places on the planet where monogomy isn't the norm, it's the exception. In the lifestyle it's more the norm (in my experience). I personally am wired to monogomy. The way I look at it is if I'm not enough for himself sexually, then he can mosey on down the road and find him some somewhere else. Totally different outlook about play though, because there are things he may want to do that are hard limits of mine. I wish him joy in doing those things, unless it involves his dick. Does that make me less submissive? I don't think so. I think it shows I KNOW myself and where my uncrossable lines are. I'm not wired poly. Tried it a couple of times and it only worked once. Pity that a move had to wreck that. I believe, in some cases, that poly is a thing a person comes up with to have free reign to screw around. Now before the poly peeps jump down my throat, I said in SOME cases, not ALL. Sometimes poly works just fine.

Also, part of the negotiations I have gone through with himself was the discussion about poly and many, many other things. Just because I have no scat, watersports, animals, under 25's as limits doesn't make me less submissive. I have reasons for those limits. Most people who have limits have reasons for them. Again, doesn't make them less a slave or a submissive.

I don't understand why you went on this tangent to begin with, if your wife has no issue with you being poly. I am curious though, what would you get out of it? And don't throw that whole "Men are wired to want to fuck around" thing out there, because that is utter crap.

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(in reply to Zevar)
Profile   Post #: 153
RE: Monogamy Agonistes - 8/29/2010 12:56:28 AM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline
lol... we sure aint doormats, as much as the OP hates to believe that. Nor would i become a slave to a man who takes the cheap shot of... if you dont agree, your not a slave.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to TwistedHeart74)
Profile   Post #: 154
RE: Monogamy Agonistes - 8/29/2010 2:51:26 AM   
LisaOfShades


Posts: 4
Joined: 8/28/2010
Status: offline
I came here to post a question about if BDSM and monogamous couples is actually posible, or once you get deviant, you just become a greedy whore all the way automatically. As far as I know, people becoming middle age bcome insane with insecurities. Losing their youth and half their life have that effect. To reassure themselves they date girls who could be their daughter, which is, even when legal, like being paedophiles to me since they could father them. They get sport cars, or just can't get enough or appreciate one thing. Like obese people unable to stop porking themselves. It seems that it's also true about women. You can train a slave all you want, think it's your object all you want, but it will never make her become a plastic doll who can get tired of you and leave for a more devoted master. I can guess that every people, especially slaves, have that need to please in every possible way. Meaning that if you go to someone else, it's like telling your woman that she can't possibly succeed to please you. Which has a more devastating effect than breaking her in half.

I think you have the right to have more than one woman, but if you choose the type of woman who want to suceed in making you happy on her own and doom her to be a failure, you're a fucking asshole.

Guys must really be even more insecure than women to prove themselves worthy by needing more than one seduction.

(in reply to WyldHrt)
Profile   Post #: 155
RE: Monogamy Agonistes - 8/29/2010 3:56:20 AM   
BonesFromAsh


Posts: 1362
Joined: 6/17/2010
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: masterpdg

Can people please stop assuming the existence a few counter example disproves a general point. I always have to work on this with my students I dont want to do it here.


It must be difficult when your "students" expect you to prove your point. If you plan to spout opinions on a certain topic, it behooves you to have the approriate data to back up your statements. Otherwise, who looks to be the uninformed fool?

I notice you seem to be quite proficient in the art of avoidance. How would you grade a student who used the same tactics you have employed to present their topic?

The only thing, in my opinion, that you've succeeded in proving is you inability to be seen as an honorable individual who not only stands by his words, but is able to substantiate his claims with actual evidence and, when unable to, is open-minded and mature enough to accept the successful existience of examples outside his small scope of experience.

Fail.

(in reply to masterpdg)
Profile   Post #: 156
RE: Monogamy Agonistes - 8/29/2010 4:12:49 AM   
thishereboi


Posts: 14463
Joined: 6/19/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: masterpdg

Can people please stop assuming the existence a few counter example disproves a general point. I always have to work on this with my students I dont want to do it here.


And do you allow your students to present an idea with nothing to back it except their opinion that it is right?

Now I feel real bad, that you can't seem to find a new little playtoy to suck you off on command and I think it is just peachy that you and your wife have an open relationship. But coming on CM and trying to convince everyone else that poly is the way to go isn't going to get you far. The fact is, there are a lot of people out there who are happy with a monogamous relationship and have no desire to play with multiple people. I am not sure why this bothers you so much, but it seems to. Maybe you should concentrate more on the ones in your family and let the rest of the world decide how they want to live their lives.


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This here is the boi formerly known as orfunboi


(in reply to masterpdg)
Profile   Post #: 157
RE: Monogamy Agonistes - 8/29/2010 4:18:20 AM   
thishereboi


Posts: 14463
Joined: 6/19/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: masterpdg

Not everyone has to be like me. But if you say you belong or want to belong to a person completely, then you have to. Thats is all.


No, if they want to belong to you then they have to. If they want to belong to someone else, then they have to do what ever that person wants them to do.


_____________________________

"Sweetie, you're wasting your gum" .. Albert


This here is the boi formerly known as orfunboi


(in reply to masterpdg)
Profile   Post #: 158
RE: Monogamy Agonistes - 8/29/2010 4:31:31 AM   
DarkSteven


Posts: 28072
Joined: 5/2/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: masterpdg

Can people please stop assuming the existence a few counter example disproves a general point. I always have to work on this with my students I dont want to do it here.


OP, there are three levels of evidence:

1. No evidence.
2. Anecdotal evidence.
3. Hard data.

You are implying that the anecdotal evidence you're presented with is not strong enough to trump your unsupported opinions.  The reverse is true, actually.  If you want to trump the anecdotal evidence presented, get hard data.


_____________________________

"You women....

The small-breasted ones want larger breasts. The large-breasted ones want smaller ones. The straight-haired ones curl their hair, and the curly-haired ones straighten theirs...

Quit fretting. We men love you."

(in reply to masterpdg)
Profile   Post #: 159
RE: Monogamy Agonistes - 8/29/2010 5:27:40 AM   
Firebirdseeking


Posts: 477
Joined: 9/3/2006
Status: offline
OP:

Let's just say that your dominance would be seriously questioned.

I got tired a long time ago of men who questioned my submission because I disagreed with them, or would not do ridiculous things for them like kneel on cam.  What I learned over time is that the man who disagrees with my submissiveness is simply not strong enough for me. 

(in reply to masterpdg)
Profile   Post #: 160
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