Blech's "I have a dream, too" speech: A Black Man reminisces

Blech's "I have a dream, too" speech: A Black Man reminisces (Full Version)

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Hippiekinkster -> Blech's "I have a dream, too" speech: A Black Man reminisces (9/1/2010 4:09:51 AM)
"You know what, I Have A Dream, myself: I want Alveda King to get a real day job and quit exploiting her last name for personal gain." "Every now and then some guy would walk over and pat me on the back (as if to say "See, we welcome black folks too! The Tea Party isn't racist!) out of nowhere, which felt strangely condescending. I got random smiles from others. I also got my fair share of paranoid "Is he an infiltrator" looks, especially when I was taking photos." " The Metro was no more/less crowded than your typical Saturday when I got on my usual Red Line stop in suburban Maryland. Despite Tea Party instructions to avoid this end of the Red Line at all costs (for reasons of personal safety!), there were quite a few folks on my train downtown, carrying lawn chairs (not the 4 legged collapsing ones you see at the beach. They had the huge, old school "folding chairs") and sporting their finest "Anti Social-ist" Tea Party regalia. The irony of riding government funded transportation, heading to a government maintained park, and watching a speaker being protected by government funded policemen was apparently lost of these folks." http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2010/8/28/897086/-What-Happens-When-A-Liberal-Black-Man-Goes-To-Glenn-Becks-I-Have-A-Dream,-Too-Speech!

Sanity -> RE: Blech's "I have a dream, too" speech: A Black Man reminisces (9/1/2010 4:22:19 AM)
Im not going to argue the silliness of your claiming public transportation for socialists except to point out how socialists dont hesitate to access all the wonderful things that capitalists provide which make all our lives so much better than the muddy trails (etc) we would have to live with on if we were forced to rely on socialism alone.

tazzygirl -> RE: Blech's "I have a dream, too" speech: A Black Man reminisces (9/1/2010 5:28:50 AM)
No more silly then a group of people demanding less government while standing on government property, after gaining access to that property while riding on government roads, many utilizing government funded transportation, declaring they are within their government granted rights to do what it is they are congregated on government property to do, while using government controlled airwaves to televise their government bashing political ideology while under a government granted permit to congregate on government property.

Sanity -> RE: Blech's "I have a dream, too" speech: A Black Man reminisces (9/1/2010 6:02:18 AM)
"government granted rights"? quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl No more silly then a group of people demanding less government while standing on government property, after gaining access to that property while riding on government roads, many utilizing government funded transportation, declaring they are within their government granted rights to do what it is they are congregated on government property to do, while using government controlled airwaves to televise their government bashing political ideology while under a government granted permit to congregate on government property.

tazzygirl -> RE: Blech's "I have a dream, too" speech: A Black Man reminisces (9/1/2010 6:03:34 AM)
I checked... yup.. i spelled that right. Comprehension problems again?

Sanity -> RE: Blech's "I have a dream, too" speech: A Black Man reminisces (9/1/2010 6:09:02 AM)
Thats exactly it taz, comprehension problems again. [;)] quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl I checked... yup.. i spelled that right. Comprehension problems again?

tazzygirl -> RE: Blech's "I have a dream, too" speech: A Black Man reminisces (9/1/2010 6:10:21 AM)
LOL thought so!

Archer -> RE: Blech's "I have a dream, too" speech: A Black Man reminisces (9/1/2010 7:11:45 AM)
tazzy, I think the comprehension problem comes from your idea that the government grants rights. It is generally held that you have rights and the government either recognizes them or doesn't, but that they don't grant you rights. (noted this is christian centric but the general idea is "endowed by their creator with inalienable rights" I seem to recall that being somewhere in those founding documents as a concept) The idea that small government folks use government services and that somehow invalidates their claims is a strawman tactic. Small government does not mean no government, a few things that would make your position far less weak. Remove claims about government controlled airwaves, because the news would still get out and TV would still be on the air if the government did nothing more than determine who had license in how large and area to broadcast on what frequency. That is after all the only real service they (the government) provide for radio and TV industries. The rest is all tilted towards what the government requires from them to grant them that license. Remove the idea that the roads are somehow an issue with small government folks because roadways are always one of the things that small government folks believe to be a legitimate function of government. You kight be able to get away with the public transportation, however since most of them are LOCAL GOVERNMENT that argument kinda falls flat too. Because smal;l government folks are generally less worried about local government being out of control. National Park functions really? you're going to stand up that argument as something that small government folks are protesting against? Yeah cause we see those close the national parks signs all the time at Small Government protests. LOL Small government doesn't mean no government most of us are not anarchists, most of us recognize that government is a necessary evil. But we don't ever want to forget that it is evil by nature. That the government will always seek to increase it's power and that power has to come from somebody elses freedoms being curtailed. Edited to add: Now this should not be construed to be anything like support for Beck personally. Because I find the man lacking in many ways. I actually have to change channels and radio stations when he's on. I find him an opportunist at best.

StrangerThan -> RE: Blech's "I have a dream, too" speech: A Black Man reminisces (9/1/2010 8:14:10 AM)
Nice post. Somewhere along the line the concept of not wanting government fingers in every aspect of life gets twisted into hate-mongering, right wing fanaticism. I must be in a tiny minority of folks who mostly want government to leave me the fuck alone and operate with its intended manner, that being for the people, by the people and of the people.

tazzygirl -> RE: Blech's "I have a dream, too" speech: A Black Man reminisces (9/1/2010 9:02:01 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Archer tazzy, I think the comprehension problem comes from your idea that the government grants rights. It is generally held that you have rights and the government either recognizes them or doesn't, but that they don't grant you rights. (noted this is christian centric but the general idea is "endowed by their creator with inalienable rights" I seem to recall that being somewhere in those founding documents as a concept) Guess what is written in the Constitution and upheld by the SC is just there from the beginning and is inalienable rights... yeah... im sure thats it. [;)] quote: The idea that small government folks use government services and that somehow invalidates their claims is a strawman tactic. Small government does not mean no government, a few things that would make your position far less weak. Remove claims about government controlled airwaves, because the news would still get out and TV would still be on the air if the government did nothing more than determine who had license in how large and area to broadcast on what frequency. That is after all the only real service they (the government) provide for radio and TV industries. The rest is all tilted towards what the government requires from them to grant them that license. Government is still in that context, by your own admission. So the point stands. quote: Remove the idea that the roads are somehow an issue with small government folks because roadways are always one of the things that small government folks believe to be a legitimate function of government. You kight be able to get away with the public transportation, however since most of them are LOCAL GOVERNMENT that argument kinda falls flat too. Because smal;l government folks are generally less worried about local government being out of control. Ah, so now its down to federal vs state government... lol. Public transportation such as buses and subways run on the state dole as well. May wanna look that up. quote: National Park functions really? you're going to stand up that argument as something that small government folks are protesting against? Yeah cause we see those close the national parks signs all the time at Small Government protests. LOL Did they not need a permit and permission to gather at that spot? Try again. quote: Small government doesn't mean no government most of us are not anarchists, most of us recognize that government is a necessary evil. But we don't ever want to forget that it is evil by nature. That the government will always seek to increase it's power and that power has to come from somebody elses freedoms being curtailed. Edited to add: Now this should not be construed to be anything like support for Beck personally. Because I find the man lacking in many ways. I actually have to change channels and radio stations when he's on. I find him an opportunist at best. Taken piece by piece, you may have an argument on some parts Taken as a whole, and its a bit silly that this group of people use the system when it benefits them and decrys it when they think so one is watching.

tazzygirl -> RE: Blech's "I have a dream, too" speech: A Black Man reminisces (9/1/2010 9:03:46 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: StrangerThan Nice post. Somewhere along the line the concept of not wanting government fingers in every aspect of life gets twisted into hate-mongering, right wing fanaticism. I must be in a tiny minority of folks who mostly want government to leave me the fuck alone and operate with its intended manner, that being for the people, by the people and of the people. And if it wasnt for the federal government sticking its nose into where you think it doesnt belong, you would not have the right to say what you just said.

RacerJim -> RE: Blech's "I have a dream, too" speech: A Black Man reminisces (9/1/2010 9:23:57 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: StrangerThan Nice post. Somewhere along the line the concept of not wanting government fingers in every aspect of life gets twisted into hate-mongering, right wing fanaticism. I must be in a tiny minority of folks who mostly want government to leave me the fuck alone and operate with its intended manner, that being for the people, by the people and of the people. Don't forget us racist, radical right-wing terrorists! You are in the ever-increasing majority of "We the people..." who simply want all levels of government, but especially the Federal government, to abide by the U.S. Constitution.

StrangerThan -> RE: Blech's "I have a dream, too" speech: A Black Man reminisces (9/1/2010 9:26:38 AM)
taz, you are a poster child in argument for something like the Tea Party to exist.

StrangerThan -> RE: Blech's "I have a dream, too" speech: A Black Man reminisces (9/1/2010 9:28:32 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl quote: ORIGINAL: StrangerThan Nice post. Somewhere along the line the concept of not wanting government fingers in every aspect of life gets twisted into hate-mongering, right wing fanaticism. I must be in a tiny minority of folks who mostly want government to leave me the fuck alone and operate with its intended manner, that being for the people, by the people and of the people. And if it wasnt for the federal government sticking its nose into where you think it doesnt belong, you would not have the right to say what you just said. Bull shit.

Archer -> RE: Blech's "I have a dream, too" speech: A Black Man reminisces (9/1/2010 9:34:11 AM)
Tazzy your points don't even sit up let alone stand. LOL Rights in the constitution, show me one founding document that says the government grants rights as opposed to recognizing the people have them already. I provided the quote supporting my point you could at least do the same. Airwave point doesn't exist in that your contention that the government does anything to provide them is stupid beyond belief. Without the government would a TV station be able to broadcast? The answer is YES. Would a radio station be able to broadcast without the government. Well lets see do Pirate Radio stations exist? Yep they sure do. So the idea that the government provides nothing except restrictions when it comes to broadcast is proven. They don't provide frequencies, they don't provide amplitude, they don't provide the transmitters, they don't provide the receivers. Public trans point I ceded so the may want to look it up shot shows your ignorance, and the weakness of your point that you want to hit where I had ceded a point to begin with. "you might be able to get away with the public transporation" being the point where I ceded the idea BEFORE you decided it would be cool to take a personal shot with the may want to look that up line. Try again on the national park and permit non sequiter, you'll have to explain how my point that small government folks don't protest national parks somehow applies to the idea that you cite their need for a permit. Your mischaracterization of their points is the very definition of a strawman argument. Small government doesn't mean and never has ment, except when changed by partisan hacks into a hyperbolic strawman of no government.

Archer -> RE: Blech's "I have a dream, too" speech: A Black Man reminisces (9/1/2010 9:41:13 AM)
The right to freedom of speach is not provided by the first ammendment, tazzy it is protected by it, but not provided by it. Again you'll have to cite a source in some founding document that counters my "endowed by their creator..." idea for where rights come from to make any argument stick claiming that rights are provided by the constitution. Congress shall make no law abridging, the right to freedom of speech or the press. the statement is clear that the right exists and that the government is not to change that previously existing right. Because in order to be possible for the government to abrige the right the right has to ALREADY EXIST.

tazzygirl -> RE: Blech's "I have a dream, too" speech: A Black Man reminisces (9/1/2010 9:43:15 AM)
And if it were not protected by it, what do you believe would happen? Your refusal to admit that the federal government so many seem to rail against is also that federal government that allows you the freedom to rail. Its really not that hard to understand.

Archer -> RE: Blech's "I have a dream, too" speech: A Black Man reminisces (9/1/2010 9:58:00 AM)
Protecting it from whom? Who is the likely cuprit trying to restrict my freedom of speech??????? The only folks I ever see trying to restrict speech have always been GOVERNMENTS. The Government doesn't allow me the freedom torail the government is RESTRICTED FROM preventing it. That may be a concept too difficult for you to grasp. But the whole of the Bill of Rights was put there to RESTRICT THE GOVERNMENT from removing the people's rights. (given to them by: god, their creator, the universe, the act of being born human) The Constitution is about controlling Government.

StrangerThan -> RE: Blech's "I have a dream, too" speech: A Black Man reminisces (9/1/2010 9:58:59 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl And if it were not protected by it, what do you believe would happen? Your refusal to admit that the federal government so many seem to rail against is also that federal government that allows you the freedom to rail. Its really not that hard to understand. Lol. You went to school after they quit teaching history didn't you? So you tell me, what happens if the federal government stops obeying the Constitution.

tazzygirl -> RE: Blech's "I have a dream, too" speech: A Black Man reminisces (9/1/2010 10:04:10 AM)
quote: So you tell me, what happens if the federal government stops obeying the Constitution. Eventually, it ends up before the SC, another branch of that federal government many tend to look too when they feel their rights have been abridged... another part of that government so many are railing about. What happens if the ferderal government changes it? And, btw, is it your only defense to lower yourself to pot shots and belittling comments? Cant you argue a point without them?

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