RE: 8 Immediate Cost Benefits of Health Care Reform

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RE: 8 Immediate Cost Benefits of Health Care Reform - 9/26/2010 10:18:54 PM

truckinslave

Posts: 3897
Joined: 6/16/2004
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quote:

The problem is cost.

And the problem with increasing costs is that they are largely driven by technology.
Want to control, almost freeze insurance costs? Forbid insurance companies to pay for new technologies and treatments.
Want to lower costs? Legislate the purchase of insurance across state lines, reaffirm the law of contracts, and allow custom policies.
Want to pay double or triple? Put the government in charge.

_____________________________

1. Islam and sharia are indivisible.
2. Sharia is barbaric, homophobic, violent, and inimical to the most basic Western values (including free speech and freedom of religion). (Yeah, I know: SEE: Irony 101).
ERGO: Islam has no place in America.

(in reply to Termyn8or)

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RE: 8 Immediate Cost Benefits of Health Care Reform - 9/26/2010 11:19:45 PM

joether

Posts: 5195
Joined: 7/24/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: truckinslave

quote:

The problem is cost.

And the problem with increasing costs is that they are largely driven by technology.
Want to control, almost freeze insurance costs? Forbid insurance companies to pay for new technologies and treatments.
Want to lower costs? Legislate the purchase of insurance across state lines, reaffirm the law of contracts, and allow custom policies.
Want to pay double or triple? Put the government in charge.

Yes, the goverment does run a health care system. Its in the Commonwealth of Massachusetts, called 'Mass Health'. Do you know how much it costs to cover every Man, Woman, and Child, who is both a resident and US Citizen? $700 Million. You know deep of a cost that is, to the Mass budget? Just 0.02% of the total budget. So if it doubles, it'll cost the commonwealth....*gasp*.....a whole 0.04%! Mass residents don't even complain about it (except for the really clueless Tea Partiers). The program is run, pretty well; if there are problems, there are mechanisms to correct it. If something has to be retooled, that is what state representatives are there to do. Its a system 'of the people, by the people, for the people. It isn't perfect, but you have a better shot of getting the medical treatment you need.

Go check every insurance company, and examine their CEO's package benefits, and his upper level executives too. You, the individual person, are paying for those guys to have outragious salaries and bonuses. Either directly, or through your employeer. As not a single CEO of a medium sized company (let alone a national, or multi-national) earns less then $15 million/year in salary, benefits, and bonuses. And your paying for that, slave! You have very little if any say in the matter, so go ahead, keep bitching. It keeps falling on deaf ears, by the guys laughing out loud....all the way to the bank!

Want to lower costs? Allow a goverment option. A base line, that is handled by administrators who report to Congress. The CEO and his upper executives of the private company can laugh in your face if you try to keep them accountable. But Senators and Represenatives, have to get re-elected. And voters tend to have long memories. A Goverment Option, while not 'bells & whistles', would give incentive to private insurance to lower their costs, or risk losing customers. Allow that option, to take the form of what goverment employees (including the President and Congress) has access to. You will quickly find, those companies shedding excess perks for their upper level management, in favor of not screwing around with their customers.

(in reply to truckinslave)

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RE: 8 Immediate Cost Benefits of Health Care Reform - 9/27/2010 5:06:11 AM

truckinslave

Posts: 3897
Joined: 6/16/2004
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I didn't think there was anyone left who would take this dog hunting.

Healthcare costs in Mass went up 52% in less than two years. 52%

_____________________________

1. Islam and sharia are indivisible.
2. Sharia is barbaric, homophobic, violent, and inimical to the most basic Western values (including free speech and freedom of religion). (Yeah, I know: SEE: Irony 101).
ERGO: Islam has no place in America.

(in reply to joether)

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Post #: 23

RE: 8 Immediate Cost Benefits of Health Care Reform - 9/27/2010 6:58:09 AM

MrRodgers

Posts: 10542
Joined: 7/30/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy
Impose lifetime limits or caps on health coverage

so you think it makes sense to spend 10s of millions to prolong a life a month? millions to prolong a life a week? if you wrote the check for someones terminal care and understood the cost, you wouldnt support no limits either. The ultimate result MUST be denying coverages because of cost, like the FDA delisting a proven effective cancer treatment that was already being paid for by insurance companies because they dont want to bear the cost when we ultimately wind up with single payer.

Bullshit.

My old policy had a $1 million lifetime limit. I need dialysis 3 times a week, each one bills for $1500. That's $234,000 a year just for dialysis. I've seen the nephrologist every month since March, only $250 per office visit another $1750 total, plus blood and urine tests before each visit, cost varies based upon which tests low was $80 the high was $600 total is just over 1200. My meds are just over $1k per month.

So I would have hit the lifetime limit in about 4 years, assuming prices stayed put. I'm told you can live indefinitely on dialysis.

They who oppose Obamacare do not wish by now...to grasp the concept. America's culture is a culture of money who has it and who doesn't. In America our first consideration is the 'investor class' so everything...everything individually is about a profit. So if 'reform' isn't also first...first about a profit...it's unAmerican. Where we have gone wrong is not making health care a national program and single payer insurance same as the FDIC for banks.

The capitalist (investor class) is out to make some money by God and they will make money on your health care...come hell or high water. The net result is that Americans pay over twice as much as other industrialized countries per capita for enough less care that we die about 3-4 years...younger.

< Message edited by MrRodgers -- 9/27/2010 7:00:27 AM >

(in reply to DomKen)

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RE: 8 Immediate Cost Benefits of Health Care Reform - 9/27/2010 12:03:34 PM

rulemylife

Posts: 14614
Joined: 8/23/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy

quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

This is a question for those who want the health care legislation repealed.

Can you please explain to me why any of the listed items are a bad thing?

8 Immediate Cost Benefits of Health Care Reform

Under the new law, health care insurers will no longer be able to do the following:

Deny coverage to children with pre-existing conditions

you have the provision wrong. They cannot exclude pre-existing conditions from policies they issue. Result: They stopped issuing the policies altogether in several states.

So what you are saying Willbeur is that we are in a no-win situation unless we pass a single-payer system.

Otherwise the insurance companies can do what they will to preserve their profits regardless of who gets harmed in the process.

quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy

quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

Impose lifetime limits or caps on health coverage

so you think it makes sense to spend 10s of millions to prolong a life a month? millions to prolong a life a week? if you wrote the check for someones terminal care and understood the cost, you wouldnt support no limits either. The ultimate result MUST be denying coverages because of cost, like the FDA delisting a proven effective cancer treatment that was already being paid for by insurance companies because they dont want to bear the cost when we ultimately wind up with single payer.

Let me ask Willbeur, is it your view that lives are expendable? Somehow I just can't wrap my mind around equating a person's life to the economic cost.

quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy

quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife
Cancel a policy without proving fraud

I assume you also mean while premiums are being paid. Policies arent cancelled under those conditions now, and if they are the insured can sue for the coverage and damages.

What fantasy world are you living in?

One of the primary reasons for health care reform was denial of coverage and insurance companies arbitrarily cancelling policies.

And the insurance companies are able to get away with this because the people they deny do not have the resources to fight health problems and their insurance company at the same time.

quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy

quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife
Deny health claims without giving you a chance to appeal the decision

also doesnt happen

Well, that sure as fuck cleared that up for me Willbeur.

If Willbeur says it doesn't happen then who am I to argue?

So speaketh the Willbeur.

quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy

quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife
Free preventative health services

broad based PH doesnt work. Targeted PH are lifestyle choices that the individual should bear for themselves.

Do you go to the dentist regularly Willbeur?

Do you still have you own teeth or do you wear dentures?

Whatever the answer is I think you can see the value of preventive health care.

As far as being something that the individual should bear for themselves, do you not see the reduction in overall health care costs from preventive care?

quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy

quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

Young adults can stay on parent's plan until age 26

why 26? why not 36? 56? At some point children are responsible for themselves. 26 is far beyond that age.

Because people in that age group are the most likely to go without insurance, and when they do have accidents or illnesses the cost falls on everyone else.

quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy

quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

Choose a primary care doctor and pediatrician

already can and do

Nope.

I really have to do this more often.

The Willbeur style of debate.

I can just answer in one word without explaining myself or offering any proof.

It's so freeing.

quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy

quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

Use the nearest emergency room without penalty

what penalty?

Gosh Willbeur, let me think.

Could it be possibly be that going to a non-network provider will cost you more?

< Message edited by rulemylife -- 9/27/2010 12:12:27 PM >

(in reply to willbeurdaddy)

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