RE: US Tries to Make It Easier to Wiretap the Internet (NY Times) (Full Version)

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willbeurdaddy -> RE: US Tries to Make It Easier to Wiretap the Internet (NY Times) (9/28/2010 2:13:43 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy


quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife


The problem with this is it does not just target terrorism.

It is opening the door to the same abuses we saw with the Patriot Act.



What abuses?


If you have a point to make then make it, but I'm no longer wasting any time and effort on your two-word posts.

It's been well-documented, look it up.







Bullshit. There have been allegations, nothing has been documented as being an actual abuse.




pogo4pres -> RE: US Tries to Make It Easier to Wiretap the Internet (NY Times) (9/28/2010 2:20:01 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam

A nation that will exchange liberty for security deserves neither-----------Thomas Jefferson




"Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety deserve neither Liberty nor Safety"  Benjamin Franklin.

This was also said in a slightly  different form by Jefferson who makes it clear he was quoting Franklin.  I have always heard the attribution as being Franklin as the original source.   Never-the-less, the point is valid no matter whom is quoted.



Historically,
Some Knucklehead in NJ




hertz -> RE: US Tries to Make It Easier to Wiretap the Internet (NY Times) (9/28/2010 2:26:49 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy

The real problem with this approach is that it wont work. Technology will always be a step ahead of the government snoopers, so the only people they will be able to effectively monitor are those that dont need to be.


I think this is right. It's a Darwinian thing. As soon as the environment changes enough to create difficulty for the organism (in this case the free flow of private information) then the organism will adapt to survive the threat.

I remember when PGP first came out. The spooks didn't like that at all. It's only a question of time before someone comes up with a really easy to use way of transmitting data in an encrypted, intercept-free form with some sort of security at both ends. It'll have to be something open-source though. Would you trust anything the government might have a back door into?




tazzygirl -> RE: US Tries to Make It Easier to Wiretap the Internet (NY Times) (9/28/2010 2:30:18 PM)

spooks?




mnottertail -> RE: US Tries to Make It Easier to Wiretap the Internet (NY Times) (9/28/2010 2:32:17 PM)

ghosts, undercover operatives; clandestine.... like that.




rulemylife -> RE: US Tries to Make It Easier to Wiretap the Internet (NY Times) (9/28/2010 2:34:20 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy


quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy


quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife


The problem with this is it does not just target terrorism.

It is opening the door to the same abuses we saw with the Patriot Act.



What abuses?


If you have a point to make then make it, but I'm no longer wasting any time and effort on your two-word posts.

It's been well-documented, look it up.


Bullshit. There have been allegations, nothing has been documented as being an actual abuse.


Then when I prove there have been you will abandon the thread and pretend that you weren't proven wrong.

No thanks Willbeur, I'm tired of your games.

But if you are really confident in your position why don't you prove it, just for shits and giggles.




pogo4pres -> RE: US Tries to Make It Easier to Wiretap the Internet (NY Times) (9/28/2010 2:34:39 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

spooks?


Spook in this case means SPY, not a racial slur tazzy.  Spies have been called "spooks" or "ghosts" because if they do their job right they are as ephemeral as a "ghost"


Spookily,
Some Knucklehead in NJ




hertz -> RE: US Tries to Make It Easier to Wiretap the Internet (NY Times) (9/28/2010 2:37:10 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

spooks?


Mossad.  /joke. honestly...




tazzygirl -> RE: US Tries to Make It Easier to Wiretap the Internet (NY Times) (9/28/2010 2:48:20 PM)

thank you pogo.

depending on where one grows up, it has different connotations.




tazzygirl -> RE: US Tries to Make It Easier to Wiretap the Internet (NY Times) (9/28/2010 2:49:31 PM)

~blows a kiss and grins

Is there anything you dont know, Master Ron?




mnottertail -> RE: US Tries to Make It Easier to Wiretap the Internet (NY Times) (9/28/2010 2:49:58 PM)

Um.............I don't know..........




tazzygirl -> RE: US Tries to Make It Easier to Wiretap the Internet (NY Times) (9/28/2010 2:55:16 PM)

LOL




rulemylife -> RE: US Tries to Make It Easier to Wiretap the Internet (NY Times) (9/28/2010 3:04:54 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy

Bullshit. There have been allegations, nothing has been documented as being an actual abuse.


I said I wouldn't, but it's just so hard to resist proving you wrong.  Yet again.

Do you think that the admission of the director of the FBI and a Justice Department report qualifies as documentation?



F.B.I. Head Admits Mistakes in Use of Security Act



March 10, 2007 WASHINGTON — Bipartisan outrage erupted on Friday on Capitol Hill as Robert S. Mueller III, the F.B.I.
director, conceded that the bureau had improperly used the USA Patriot Act to obtain information about people and businesses.

Mr. Mueller embraced responsibility for the lapses, detailed in a report by the inspector general of the Justice Department, and promised to do everything he could to avoid repeating them. But his apologies failed to defuse the anger of lawmakers in both parties.

“How could this happen?” Mr. Mueller asked rhetorically in a briefing at the headquarters of the Federal Bureau of Investigation. “Who is to be held accountable? And the answer to that is I am to be held accountable.”

The report found many instances when national security letters, which allow the bureau to obtain records from telephone companies, Internet service providers, banks, credit companies and other businesses without a judge’s approval, were improperly, and sometimes illegally, used.

Moreover, record keeping was so slipshod, the report found, that the actual number of national security letters exercised was often understated when the bureau reported on them to Congress, as required.







hertz -> RE: US Tries to Make It Easier to Wiretap the Internet (NY Times) (9/28/2010 3:09:11 PM)

In the UK, local councils have used powers granted under the prevention of terrorism act to prevent a photographer from taking photographs of Christmas decorations. If the power is there, someone will misuse it. It's almost inevitable.




willbeurdaddy -> RE: US Tries to Make It Easier to Wiretap the Internet (NY Times) (9/28/2010 3:38:32 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy


quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy


quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife


The problem with this is it does not just target terrorism.

It is opening the door to the same abuses we saw with the Patriot Act.



What abuses?


If you have a point to make then make it, but I'm no longer wasting any time and effort on your two-word posts.

It's been well-documented, look it up.


Bullshit. There have been allegations, nothing has been documented as being an actual abuse.


Then when I prove there have been you will abandon the thread and pretend that you weren't proven wrong.

No thanks Willbeur, I'm tired of your games.

But if you are really confident in your position why don't you prove it, just for shits and giggles.



Yes, I will abandon the thread, because you are unable to substantiate your intial positive claim that there have been abuses. As always.




rulemylife -> RE: US Tries to Make It Easier to Wiretap the Internet (NY Times) (9/28/2010 4:19:08 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy

Yes, I will abandon the thread, because you are unable to substantiate your intial positive claim that there have been abuses. As always.


Gee Willbeur, gosh darn it but I thought I did.

Let's count together.

Your reply is post #35, my initial post was #26.

Somehow you just happened to skip over #33.

Probably just a coincidence.

Mistakes happen.

But I'm sure now that you are going to look at it and respond appropriately.

Because that's just the kind of stand-up guy you are.






Hippiekinkster -> RE: US Tries to Make It Easier to Wiretap the Internet (NY Times) (9/28/2010 4:27:14 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy

Yes, I will abandon the thread, because you are unable to substantiate your intial positive claim that there have been abuses. As always.


Gee Willbeur, gosh darn it but I thought I did.

Let's count together.

Your reply is post #35, my initial post was #26.

Somehow you just happened to skip over #33.

Probably just a coincidence.

Mistakes happen.

But I'm sure now that you are going to look at it and respond appropriately.

Because that's just the kind of stand-up guy you are.



Yep, your post #33 is definite proof of your assertion. Which is more proof than Wilbur ever gives for his assinsertions.




willbeurdaddy -> RE: US Tries to Make It Easier to Wiretap the Internet (NY Times) (9/28/2010 4:28:07 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy

Yes, I will abandon the thread, because you are unable to substantiate your intial positive claim that there have been abuses. As always.


Gee Willbeur, gosh darn it but I thought I did.

Let's count together.

Your reply is post #35, my initial post was #26.

Somehow you just happened to skip over #33.

Probably just a coincidence.

Mistakes happen.

But I'm sure now that you are going to look at it and respond appropriately.

Because that's just the kind of stand-up guy you are.





Nothing you posted constitutes "abuse". Who was harmed? Why havent they sued?




Hillwilliam -> RE: US Tries to Make It Easier to Wiretap the Internet (NY Times) (9/28/2010 5:14:51 PM)

Just because someone doesnt sue doesnt mean they arent harmed.........What kind of liberal nutbag believes that every time you are harmed, you must SUE?




rulemylife -> RE: US Tries to Make It Easier to Wiretap the Internet (NY Times) (9/28/2010 5:27:13 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy

Nothing you posted constitutes "abuse". Who was harmed? Why havent they sued?


Willbeur please stop.

For the love of God stop, before you hurt yourself and I end up feeling guilty.







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