Submission without pain... is it possible?

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jbcurious -> Submission without pain... is it possible? (10/5/2010 6:22:49 AM)
As some of you who know me are aware, I was in a gas explosion a few months ago. As I've been healing, I've started lurking and browsing through the site and more and more what I notice is the emphasis placed on pain. The level of pain that I have experienced in the past few months and what I go through daily makes me think that I could never voluntarily accept pain, that it could not be a part of a successful relationship for me. I rarely come across a profile that doesn't list canes and crops in the" lives for" or" loves" category. So many of the profiles I read use terms like "use and abuse" "pain slut" etc. The emphasis of what so many people seem to be looking for is based on what a sub will accept from her Dom, to what lengths she will go to prove her submissiveness to him... and I have to ask why? Possibly I wouldn't be considered a "true submissive" by many... but my reality is that if I admire, respect and love you enough to be in a relationship with you... then you are the boss and the care and attention I put into making your life as good as it can be, of being nurturing and supportive of the decisions you make in our lives, of being yours... Isn't that enough? While getting blown up has changed me in some ways... it hasn't changed the fact that for a relationship to be successful for me, I need a man who deserves to be in charge but have to wonder if that is even a possibility without the ability to endure pain. I appreciate all your thoughts and comments on this... and don't get all sappy on me!

leadership527 -> RE: Submission without pain... is it possible? (10/5/2010 6:32:18 AM)
shrugs Well, I exist. I'm a non-sadist master. I figure if there's one, there's more. Insofar as other doms wanting to see "what lengths she will go to to please them"... uh... yeah. you already know the answer to the "why" on that one I'd suspect.

agirl -> RE: Submission without pain... is it possible? (10/5/2010 6:42:56 AM)
It'll be enough for anyone that is after that. It possibly won't be enough for someone who actively wants bdsm in their lives. The fact that you don't care for a bdsm aspect in any relationship you might want is down to your desire. Many people do want that and get a great deal out of it. D/s doesn't have to include bdsm unless you want it to. There's a lot of emphasis on bdsm because it's a bdsm site as well. It's got nothing to do with being submissive. agirl

LuneRune -> RE: Submission without pain... is it possible? (10/5/2010 6:56:26 AM)
I am really sorry to hear about your accident and I think it's fantastic that you are healing up and doing well in your recovery. good luck with that! As far as your question goes, While I do see quite a few who like the use of canes, paddles, crops etc I have also seen quite a few who are less into administering pain and have other motivations that drive them, so I do think it's very possible to meet a dominant that would be able to handle your particular needs. You are service oriented, and I read plenty of profiles from dominant men looking for service oriented subs. For those of us who are looking, it can and is frustrating at times when it seems like it aint never gonna happen. But I think you need to keep your focus positive and be patient with it. The number one thing is to be true to yourself. It's not easy to find a match under any circumstance and when lifestyle needs get thrown into the mix it makes pairing up all that much more complicated.

LadyPact -> RE: Submission without pain... is it possible? (10/5/2010 7:26:20 AM)
S/m isn't a requirement of an authority based dynamic. There are a number of Dominants that have no interest in sadism, just as there are sadists that have no interest in power dynamics. It really is an individual thing. At the same time, I would have to say that most of the folks that I know are interested in both to at least some degree. One thing that I would say to you is that you had a horrific experience. It would be almost impossible to say if the way you feel about the subject now is the way you are always going to feel about it. A few months of constantly living with this life changing event must have had a huge impact. Who can say if you will feel the same way about it five years from now, ten years from now, or twenty years from now? You might and then again, you might not. There will be a lot of self examination on your part to know the answer.

VaguelyCurious -> RE: Submission without pain... is it possible? (10/5/2010 7:33:02 AM)
Lovely to see you posting [:)] There's a Domme who was in Bristol at the same time I was who had an ankle injury-she was very adamant that she didn't want anything to do with painplay, because there was enough pain in her life. So I know the possibility is most definitely out there.

DesFIP -> RE: Submission without pain... is it possible? (10/5/2010 7:38:41 AM)
We're not into pain. Kinkwise, it's bondage that does it. But being in our mid to upper 50's even that has a definite shelf life to it. The skin gets less and less resilient, the joints get stiffer and so on. But the core relationship I hope will always still be there. He will always be happier as the leader and me as the follower. He will still possess his great decision making skills, we will still have the same moral values.

Ravensnake -> RE: Submission without pain... is it possible? (10/5/2010 7:39:59 AM)
I've been down the bdsm pain route and was in the scene as a professional submissive. That was then. Now I seek submission without pain but then these days I'm more into sex and submission rather than bdsm per se.

jbcurious -> RE: Submission without pain... is it possible? (10/5/2010 7:55:16 AM)
I forget that there is a difference between a D/s relationship and a BDSM relationship... I still like the kink but can't take the pain, I like a man in charge but was never much of a masochist... I did enjoy a bit of spanking, light flogging, nipple clamps, etc but I really don't know if i can go that route again. As regards to bondage it's something I've always loved but even that will have to be approached carefully because of the delicacy of my skin. As you say Lady P. I don't know how I'll feel down the road but I'm 50... I don't have 20 years! [8D]

jbcurious -> RE: Submission without pain... is it possible? (10/5/2010 7:57:17 AM)
Thanks VC smooches

MstrPBK -> RE: Submission without pain... is it possible? (10/5/2010 8:14:54 AM)
First my deepest respect for the experience you have passed through jbcurious. I doubt that few would pass through such a harrowing experience without be changed somehow. The question that you (jbcurious) raises shall be one that I meditate on for awhile. While I would rather not inflect pain with the slave/sub; the expectation seems to be there by the sub/slave. In the past I have viewed the pain as a means to keep the slave in line ... in check as it were. I will have to consider how the balance is kept without pain.

lovingpet -> RE: Submission without pain... is it possible? (10/5/2010 8:24:19 AM)
Yes, of course there are lovely D/s and M/s relationships that do not include the use of pain as part of their interactions. This is a matter of compatibility and, let's face it, anything that puts a limit around what you seek means it that the field of candidates has been narrowed. It may take time. It might not, but such partners are out there as evidence by some of the responses you have received. I am sorry to hear about the accident you were involved in and all the pain you have dealt with on a daily basis. I can see easily why you would think or even demand that pain have no further place in your life. I hope you can heal and not live this way for much longer. I know what it is to be in significant daily pain and I wouldn't wish it on anyone. That being said, I have no idea what your reality is. I have dealt with my condition for most of my life and have not been through the sheer suddenness and intensity you are experience, but rather a more constant type of pain that has become just a part of doing life for me. Needless to say, it came as quite a shock when I realized that there were things about being hurt by my partner that I enjoy and even crave. It makes no sense. Why would I EVER want to add to what I already deal with? I can't give you the why. I can only say that pain with a purpose and pain with an end I can reasonably believe exists is a whole different thing from this other kind of pain I deal with. I've said before and I will say again that it's not necessarily really the pain that I enjoy, but allowing my body to accept love the way he expresses it. There's more to than that, but in the moment that is probably the clearest thought I have. I can't fathom stopping him because it would be like telling him not to love me more. In addition to the thoughts surrounding pain is the biology of it. Oddly enough, in the days to up to two weeks after, I may be squirming in my seat from the marks, but this daily, constant pain? It's gone or nearly gone. After the initial post scene slump, I have more energy. I sleep better. In other words, I actually benefit from it on the whole. Certainly you know your mind and your body, OP. And there are those who suffer pain for whom taking on additional pain just is not something they can or will accept. What I am saying is that keeping an open mind and accepting yourself even when it doesn't make sense is important. It may not be pain that you wind up accepting. It may be anything. Just don't be too quick to discount a need or type of play. You might be missing out on something very special...and you may be selling your partner short too. Mine knows what I have to work through in order to play the way I do with him and is honored by my submission because he knows it's no easy thing. Whether or not you wind up walking away from pain play, I read your words here and believe you have a lot to give to the person who fits what you need. Your desire to make that person's happiness the center of your whole world is what many forget in the rush to go beat someone or get beaten, but it is one of those things that is bedrock to ANY good relationship. When we put the needs of each other ahead of ourselves we can't help but have a happy and successful relationship. Start with compatibility and and open mind and see what comes your way. Then just stick to what you know and treat that person with all the love, respect, and trust you have to give and make their life the happiest one possible. I wish you all the best in this and know you can do it! Take care and I hope you are feeling better soon. lovingpet

jbcurious -> RE: Submission without pain... is it possible? (10/5/2010 8:27:17 AM)
...and that is a question I have had for quite some time, are the majority of subs out there so unruly or disrespectful to their Dom that they need to be kept" in line" or is that just part of the dynamic that they choose to have whether consciously or not that makes punishment part of the equation? If I choose to submit to a man I do so because I desire it, I give it freely and lovingly... if some one tries to force that with threats of punishment is that truely submission?

angelikaJ -> RE: Submission without pain... is it possible? (10/5/2010 8:29:07 AM)
jb, I rejoice at your posting again. Submission is in the mind. Pain play can be an extension of that but it need not be. For one so inclined towards sensation play, when you are healed, in the areas where you are sensitive things like silk gliding across the skin can be exquisite, and someone else is controlling the where, the when...how fast, or slow...no pain, only pleasure. Submission is in the mind, the heart, the soul... the body is just a vehicle. Pain is not a requirement. You have been through a terrible trauma and traumas take time to heal. That you are thinking of this again is a good sign that you are healing...and you have shown an amazing and extraordinary determination. Be gentle with yourself. edit: goofy brain X3

lovingpet -> RE: Submission without pain... is it possible? (10/5/2010 8:35:21 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: jbcurious ...and that is a question I have had for quite some time, are the majority of subs out there so unruly or disrespectful to their Dom that they need to be kept" in line" or is that just part of the dynamic that they choose to have whether consciously or not that makes punishment part of the equation? If I choose to submit to a man I do so because I desire it, I give it freely and lovingly... if some one tries to force that with threats of punishment is that truely submission? I can only speak for us, but punishment and pain play aren't the same thing. I have been punished exactly once and it had nothing to do with pain. Pain is something reserved for playtime and is a positive activity. On the other hand, despite no physical pain being involved, I should hope to NEVER need to be punished again. I do my best to honor our relationship and to find that I have fallen short of that in nothing less than failure and extremely painful (emotionally). That is not something I relish. It's is submission alright. There are "submission" moves in wrestling that are all about quitting so the pain will stop. There are the stories of rape victims that submitted to their rapist simply to survive. The moment real fear deep seated enough to induce submission when it is not desired occurs, the relationship is one I'd run from because although it is submission, it certainly is not dominance. It is abuse. Healthy submission is freely given as you described. It may not be easily given, but it is an act of love, not fear. lovingpet

sigh4ualone -> RE: Submission without pain... is it possible? (10/5/2010 8:39:35 AM)
I'm so glad to have found/read this! As a non-pain loving submissive (ok, maybe a LITTLE pain) I too have been chided for not being 'real.' I AM real, and like all of us, I have my own favorite kinks. I've done the S/M part of BDSM, and found that pain detracted me from the part I love, the B/D. It was hard for me to submit my heart to someone who had physically hurt me. I think it's all a learning curve, and totally individual--and making sure we don't let anyone tell us whether or not we are 'really' a submissive. We're the keepers of our hearts, and only we, as individuals, know what that heart needs.

Zevar -> RE: Submission without pain... is it possible? (10/5/2010 8:44:30 AM)
quote: I need a man who deserves to be in charge but have to wonder if that is even a possibility without the ability to endure pain. The above quoted comment of yours generated a few questions as follows: 1] How do you determine if a man deserves to be in charge? 2] What does a man that you determine deserves to be in charge have to do with the possibilities of enduring pain? It appears to me that perhaps you may have lumped submission, pain and dominance into one huge cauldron and are stirring it without even considering that submission takes on various expressions that surely can exclude pain as does dominance take on various expressions without the need of inflicting pain. I for one, could not imagine inflicting sadistic pain on any lady that I loved. Dominance is not something that is exact for everyone who identifies as dominant. I do realize that individuality plays a prominent role in defining dominance and submission. Much like inflicting pain is not necessarily related to submission in unison with dominance. At least not how I personally define dominance. Take care!

leadership527 -> RE: Submission without pain... is it possible? (10/5/2010 8:44:51 AM)
LOL... I suspect most people would agree that I'm a "fake top" and you're a "fake bottom". Well, we would be fake if we made any claims whatsoever about being top/bottom. Insofar as submisiveness, I had thought that most people separated D/s from T/b. Perhaps I'm wrong though.

LadyPact -> RE: Submission without pain... is it possible? (10/5/2010 9:08:05 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: leadership527 LOL... I suspect most people would agree that I'm a "fake top" and you're a "fake bottom". Well, we would be fake if we made any claims whatsoever about being top/bottom. Insofar as submisiveness, I had thought that most people separated D/s from T/b. Perhaps I'm wrong though. You're not especially "wrong". There are some factors that contribute to the confusion of the situation. 1. There are some people out there who just plain don't know the difference. They interchange the terms bottom and sub to mean the same thing, even though they are different. 2. This happens because there is so much overlap. Topping and bottoming are very common within D/s. I wouldn't put an estimate on it, but in My opinion, it's a large majority. 3. People also confuse topping and bottoming to automatically assume it is a situation of pain play. That's not the case. Most sensual play isn't even what most sadists and masochists would connect with pain. 4. It isn't just the S/m part that people confuse this about. It's also the Discipline. People get this notion in their head that obedience and discipline have to include some type of corporal punishment. That's the hype and often not at all what many of us consider discipline to be.

jbcurious -> RE: Submission without pain... is it possible? (10/5/2010 9:53:09 AM)
In answer to your first question... that he meets or exceeds my abilities to make good decisions and problem solve, that the person he is, is someone that I respect and admire, that his own house is in order before he attempts to put mine in order... In answer to the second question... it's simply a matter of reading profiles and posts that have led me to believe that the majority of Dominants also seem to have a fairly healthy sadistic streak or a need for some type of CP to be a part of the dynamic, that or a need to take a sub where she doesn't want to go in order to prove her submissiveness. Your post is a refreshing change to the majority of profiles that I read, thanks for that.

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