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Guess who's Jewish now? - 10/9/2010 4:47:18 PM

DarkSteven

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Bizarre story - http://www.cnn.com/2010/WORLD/europe/09/23/poland.jewish/index.html

I cannot imagine hating a people for a lifetime and then finding out you're one of them...

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"You women....

The small-breasted ones want larger breasts. The large-breasted ones want smaller ones. The straight-haired ones curl their hair, and the curly-haired ones straighten theirs...

Quit fretting. We men love you."

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RE: Guess who's Jewish now? - 10/9/2010 5:06:33 PM

Aneirin

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Quite simply, religion aside people are what they are, if they bring their belief into their religion, then it is a case of different interpretation of that religion.

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Everything we are is the result of what we have thought, the mind is everything, what we think, we become - Guatama Buddha

Conservatism is distrust of people tempered by fear - William Gladstone

(in reply to DarkSteven)

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RE: Guess who's Jewish now? - 10/9/2010 5:13:06 PM

popeye1250

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Steven, yes that is odd! Can you imagine one of those "Grand Kleigal" guys finding out he's related to Michael Jackson? Or "Erkel?"lol

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RE: Guess who's Jewish now? - 10/9/2010 5:14:06 PM

DarkSteven

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It's not exactly a religion as much as a blend of a race and a religion.

_____________________________

"You women....

The small-breasted ones want larger breasts. The large-breasted ones want smaller ones. The straight-haired ones curl their hair, and the curly-haired ones straighten theirs...

Quit fretting. We men love you."

(in reply to Aneirin)

Post #: 4

RE: Guess who's Jewish now? - 10/9/2010 5:16:40 PM

Aneirin

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From: Tamaris
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My apologies, but that maybe where I am confused with regards to the Jewish religion, for I always took it as a religion, not a race.

_____________________________

Everything we are is the result of what we have thought, the mind is everything, what we think, we become - Guatama Buddha

Conservatism is distrust of people tempered by fear - William Gladstone

(in reply to DarkSteven)

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RE: Guess who's Jewish now? - 10/9/2010 5:18:03 PM

TribeTziyon

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It's an extreme one for sure. There has been cycles of coverage on people discovering the Jewish connection/

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RE: Guess who's Jewish now? - 10/9/2010 5:22:45 PM

TribeTziyon

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In all sects of Judaism, you are considered a Jew if there is an unbroken maternal line of Jews You are in the count whatever banner you're flying according to their thoughts. Reform in the US will take those with male Jewish lineage only if child is raised Jewish.

Typos fixed- need better glasses

< Message edited by TribeTziyon -- 10/9/2010 5:25:34 PM >

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RE: Guess who's Jewish now? - 10/9/2010 6:15:43 PM

DarkSteven

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You are a Jew if:

1. Your mother was Jewish.
2. Your father was Jewish, for some reform congregations, or
3. You convert.

There are some people who are agnostic or atheist that still identify with the Jewish heritage even though it is not their religion, and there are also the Messianic Jews (Jews for Jesus) that are not Jewish by religion.

Yeah, it's confusing.

_____________________________

"You women....

The small-breasted ones want larger breasts. The large-breasted ones want smaller ones. The straight-haired ones curl their hair, and the curly-haired ones straighten theirs...

Quit fretting. We men love you."

(in reply to TribeTziyon)

Post #: 8

RE: Guess who's Jewish now? - 10/9/2010 7:09:37 PM

TribeTziyon

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Conversion is not a blanket coverall for being accepted as a Jew by all sects. You convert Reform or Conservative, the Orthodox aren't going to recognize you as a Jew. There is even infighting on the Orthodox level of things. There has been a recent hubalu over the acceptance of some Orthodox conversions made outside of Israel.

< Message edited by TribeTziyon -- 10/9/2010 7:11:38 PM >

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RE: Guess who's Jewish now? - 10/9/2010 8:09:16 PM

rulemylife

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I don't mean to make a joke of a serious topic but I couldn't help thinking of this when I saw your post.

Frontline - Clayton Bigsby - Chappelle's Show

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RE: Guess who's Jewish now? - 10/10/2010 2:03:03 AM

hertz

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Maybe there is hope for Ahmadinajad?

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RE: Guess who's Jewish now? - 10/10/2010 5:48:51 AM

Hillwilliam

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Didn't Hitler also have some Jewish blood? I think I remember hearing that once?

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RE: Guess who's Jewish now? - 10/10/2010 6:18:20 AM

pahunkboy

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam

Didn't Hitler also have some Jewish blood? I think I remember hearing that once?

I never heard of him.

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RE: Guess who's Jewish now? - 10/10/2010 9:53:08 AM

thornhappy

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam
Didn't Hitler also have some Jewish blood? I think I remember hearing that once?

It looks like a collection of rumors and bad history. A lot of them stem from the fact that Hitler's father was illegitimate. His mom was allegedly working in a Jewish household and the rumor went that a son in the household was really Hitler's father. However, his mother never lived in that town.

It may never be absolutely ruled out, but the existing rumors appear to be bupkis.

(in reply to Hillwilliam)

Post #: 14

RE: Guess who's Jewish now? - 10/10/2010 11:38:27 AM

Hillwilliam

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quote:

ORIGINAL: DarkSteven

Bizarre story - http://www.cnn.com/2010/WORLD/europe/09/23/poland.jewish/index.html

I cannot imagine hating a people for a lifetime and then finding out you're one of them...

I cant imagine hating someone just because of their heritage/race/color/preference/... but that's just me.

(in reply to DarkSteven)

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RE: Guess who's Jewish now? - 10/10/2010 2:27:13 PM

Moonhead

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Not even Dubya's daughters?

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RE: Guess who's Jewish now? - 10/10/2010 2:44:58 PM

LadyRian

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead

Not even Dubya's daughters?

Oh come on, who could hate a nice Texan mail carrier and a lonely librarian who's husband didn't have a dick? Oh wait a minute, he did one named Cheney.

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"Dodging bullets since 2010"

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RE: Guess who's Jewish now? - 10/11/2010 3:05:44 AM

Rule

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Everybody has one or more Abrahamic Jewish ancestors. I have an Abrahamic Jewish ancestor. No big deal. If one goes back eight hundred years, everybody is related to everybody else.

Lots of Abrahamic Jews also have non-Jewish ancestors - and some of them deny it. I know one blond, blue-eyed, university educated maiden who insists that she has no Christian ancestors whatsoever.

This proves that at least one university educated person is extremely stupid.

(in reply to DarkSteven)

Post #: 18

RE: Guess who's Jewish now? - 10/11/2010 6:33:56 AM

hertz

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Rule
Everybody has one or more Abrahamic Jewish ancestors. I have an Abrahamic Jewish ancestor. No big deal. If one goes back eight hundred years, everybody is related to everybody else.

This comment seems to me to make very little sense. If everybody is related to everybody else, then how can one claim that everybody has an Abrahamic Jewish ancestor, especially so when the description 'Abrahamic Jewish' is not a biological description? Do you mean Ashkenazi Abrahamic Jewish, or Sephardic Abrahamic Jewish? Or both? Or neither? Or do you mean literally descended from the fictional figure of Abraham? And how did this Jewish ancestor manage to stay Jewish when everybody is related to everybody else? And when you say 'related', do you mean simply that the everybody who is related to everybody else share some genes, but not necessarily the same genes? Or do you not mean genetically?

I'm not trying to be a smart-arse, but surely, if you can see (as you evidently can) that the biological concept of race is a bit of a nonsense, can't you also see that saying we have a specific race (whatever that is) in our heritage is a bit wrong too?

(in reply to Rule)

Post #: 19

RE: Guess who's Jewish now? - 10/11/2010 7:40:38 AM

Rule

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quote:

ORIGINAL: hertz
If everybody is related to everybody else, then how can one claim that everybody has an Abrahamic Jewish ancestor

How not? All it takes is one non-Jewish woman deciding to have intercourse with an Abrahamic Jewish male.

quote:

ORIGINAL: hertz
If everybody is related to everybody else, then how can one claim that everybody has an Abrahamic Jewish ancestor, especially so when the description 'Abrahamic Jewish' is not a biological description? Do you mean Ashkenazi Abrahamic Jewish, or Sephardic Abrahamic Jewish? Or both? Or neither?

Indeed: I invented the concept of Abrahamic Jews to describe a biological significant and functional characteristic, as those in these forums who are familiar with my definition of Abrahamic Jews are well aware. To wit: Those populations that circumcise the penis of their males are Abrahamic Jews. That includes Muslims, the USA Christian population, those professing one of the Jewish religions and perchance other circumcising populations.

quote:

ORIGINAL: hertz
Or do you mean literally descended from the fictional figure of Abraham?

Ha! Abraham was not fictional, be assured of that.
I prefer not to answer this question, for an (to me) obvious reason.

quote:

ORIGINAL: hertz
how did this Jewish ancestor manage to stay Jewish when everybody is related to everybody else?

I have no idea what you are talking about. If an Abrahamic Jew has a circumcised penis he has a circumcised penis. The amputated organ does not grow back. People ain't salamanders.

quote:

ORIGINAL: hertz
when you say 'related', do you mean simply that the everybody who is related to everybody else share some genes, but not necessarily the same genes? Or do you not mean genetically?

Not necessarily so. For example, a male might confer 23 chromosomes upon a male progeny, but that male progeny might not confer any of those chromosomes upon his own progeny.
Everybody, incidentally, has the same genes; it is the allele frequency that distinguishes populations from each other.

quote:

ORIGINAL: hertz
I'm not trying to be a smart-arse, but surely, if you can see (as you evidently can) that the biological concept of race is a bit of a nonsense, can't you also see that saying we have a specific race (whatever that is) in our heritage is a bit wrong too?

Indeed, having a background in biology I oppose the race concept. Biologists instead use the concept of populations, much like mathematicians use the concept of collections in Venn diagrams: the population of horse traders, for example.

< Message edited by Rule -- 10/11/2010 7:47:57 AM >

(in reply to hertz)

Post #: 20

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