RE: State's that are still blue (Full Version)

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FirmhandKY -> RE: State's that are still blue (11/5/2010 11:33:26 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Edwynn

quote:

and what you have is people with an urge to emerge from the lunacy.


Right.

Escaping from the Libertarian inspired lunacy of passage of the Banking Modernization Act and of the Commodity Futures Modernization  Act (s) of 1999-2001 which begot the whole financial meltdown to begin with by "escaping the lunacy" of whatever impossibly workable solutions by unfortunate following parties.

Right.

Now there's some tea party comprehension and integrity for ya!

PS

I actually like the Libertarians at the extremes, just not in the middle.

The tea partiers are just posers who were enjoying themselves famously  watching sports while 80,000 Iraqi civilians were being slaughtered and Goldman Sachs were chopping the legs off of hundreds of pension and retirement plans around the globe, then all of a sudden woke up at just the last moment to save us all.

Thank goodness for black Islamic terrorist Marxist presidents to wake them up or else we'd never have been aware of now what the tea partiers were themselves unaware of and completely oblivious to for over a decade.

Thank goodness somebody has come to save the day!

Edwynn,

Welcome to the forums.

I'm gonna cut you some slack because you're new.  Just a friendly bit of advice: when you start painting "all" of a group a certain way, it generally illuminates more about you, than about them.

Firm



truckinslave -> RE: State's that are still blue (11/6/2010 12:59:10 AM)

quote:

Thank goodness for black Islamic terrorist Marxist presidents

Thank goodness somebody has come to save the day!


Can you figure out what 4 false adjectives you used in this bit of comedic glory?
Thank us later, though. We.re nowhere near halfway through.



popeye1250 -> RE: State's that are still blue (11/6/2010 1:07:47 AM)

Elections are fun!
We just had one but I want to do it again!



Edwynn -> RE: State's that are still blue (11/6/2010 2:23:00 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: FirmhandKY

I'm gonna cut you some slack because you're new.  Just a friendly bit of advice: when you start painting "all" of a group a certain way, it generally illuminates more about you, than about them.
Firm


"New" to what? to stale paradigms? New to the media's  illumination of their own ignorance and informing of society thuswise by over-generalizations as a matter of course? All I've done is present something new to the ill-informed, for whom it might be "news"  the fact that the tea party are financed and ideologically steered by the far right, via the Koch brothers, e.g. Unless you mean  "new" in that I actually research what is behind the the curtain rather than blithely accepting whatever tripe the media vomit into our laps? I stand guilty as charged on the last point.

Sorry if it causes you disturbance.






Edwynn -> RE: State's that are still blue (11/6/2010 2:51:49 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: truckinslave

quote:

Thank goodness for black Islamic terrorist Marxist presidents

Thank goodness somebody has come to save the day!


Can you figure out what 4 false adjectives you used in this bit of comedic glory?
Thank us later, though. We.re nowhere near halfway through.


The false adjectives are not mine, rather a parroting of the parrots. I'm nowhere near that funny or stupid on my own.

I can't disagree though that we're hardly halfway there. The so-called "financial reform" has plenty of loopholes in it to all but guarantee  that another meltdown is not far down the road. And a few more buckets of cash from the treasury to the billionaires, as the tea party advocate, should be sufficient nail in the coffin of this country. And the few that actually pay attention to things know that the current president is only there for show, to present the laughable falsehood of a twisted sense of "balance" and leave some semblance of a scapegoat for the disaster yet to come.



Charles6682 -> RE: State's that are still blue (11/6/2010 3:52:58 AM)

Financial reform is really what this country need's to prevent this economy from going further downhill.I do support the free market but the scary fact is,there does need to be some government intervention.Call it socialism,I really don't care.To let the financial market run only by fat cat's on Wal-street is not the way.We see how well that one has worked out.The European's were right on this.



Edwynn -> RE: State's that are still blue (11/6/2010 3:53:15 AM)

PS

Thank you FirmhandKY for the welcome. I'm not actually new to the site, just to the forums.

Sorry for me getting carried away there, but I'm one of those for whom reading the news is like giving sugar cubes to a toddler for breakfast.

I know I should stay away from it but I slip up every once in awhile, and even if trying to avoid it, the political stuff is impossible to escape at election time when that's all you hear for the few weeks surrounding the event.

About 40-60% of 'liberals' hate me too> Just give me a few more posts.

Ha.



StrangerThan -> RE: State's that are still blue (11/6/2010 6:11:38 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Edwynn

quote:

and what you have is people with an urge to emerge from the lunacy.


Right.

Escaping from the Libertarian inspired lunacy of passage of the Banking Modernization Act and of the Commodity Futures Modernization  Act (s) of 1999-2001 which begot the whole financial meltdown to begin with by "escaping the lunacy" of whatever impossibly workable solutions by unfortunate following parties.

Right.

Now there's some tea party comprehension and integrity for ya!

PS

I actually like the Libertarians at the extremes, just not in the middle.

The tea partiers are just posers who were enjoying themselves famously  watching sports while 80,000 Iraqi civilians were being slaughtered and Goldman Sachs were chopping the legs off of hundreds of pension and retirement plans around the globe, then all of a sudden woke up at just the last moment to save us all.

Thank goodness for black Islamic terrorist Marxist presidents to wake them up or else we'd never have been aware of now what the tea partiers were themselves unaware of and completely oblivious to for over a decade.

Thank goodness somebody has come to save the day!


There's only one real truth in politics that I know of.

This is it.

Escaping from the Libertarian inspired lunacy of passage of the Banking Modernization Act and of the Commodity Futures Modernization  Act (s) of 1999-2001 which begot the whole financial meltdown

It's not that this sentence is true, it is that blame always belongs in another basket. It is a type of truth that can and usually is bolstered by round upon round of supporting statements, actions, statistics, vitriol and rhetoric. It's not only how you get red-blue coloring books, but more so, how they become so entrenched many wouldn't escape them if they could, not even if the teacher dropped a whole new 64 color Crayola box on the floor beside them.

What I like about the tea party isn't so much its politics. They are unabashed conservatives. Like any other group in America, conservatives don't have the blanket answer for everyone. It is a movement driven by a bulleted outline. It is one to which some reality will come. Which way it goes, I don't know. I don't know if the lines will soften or harden.

What I like about them is what they did, and the voice they gave to people who felt disenfranchised by government. I like the fact that with tiny amounts of money in some cases, they unseated entrenched establishment people. I like the fact they rose in a way that would put a smile on every one of the wig-topped faces of the founding fathers. I like the fact they've promised death to the Republican party if it doesn't be the party its constituents expect it to be.

What I like most about it however, is that it embodies a concept that flies directly in the face of the truth noted above. That truth, accomplishes one thing quite well. It allows all of us to avoid responsibility. Libertarians weren't the cause of the financial crash. Neither really were Democrats or Republicans.

We were because we allowed it to happen. Because we sat on the sidelines and spouted party lines. Because somewhere along the way, America lost sight of the fact that public servants are supposed to serve, not rule. USA Today listed 30 tea party victories. It is enough perhaps to roil some waters.

Do I hope they do? Fucking A I do. I'm just as tired of two-color coloring books as anyone else. The truth is though, if they governed instead of spent their time trying to get re-elected, and governed in some way that represented sanity and common sense, I and a good portion of other folks would happily go back to ignoring politics.

One result of this election has been to harden the lines already. The democrats still in power have a more liberal face. The republicans who gained power have a more conservative slant. That's a good thing in my mind. If I'm sick of anything it is extremists hiding out in the pockets of parties who then become driving forces for those parties. I'd much rather know up front what I'm dealing with than the those standing out front spinning shit all over the place to cover the fact that they're doing their best to walk the line between keeping a base and doing what's right.



truckinslave -> RE: State's that are still blue (11/6/2010 7:43:57 AM)

Damned fine post.



thishereboi -> RE: State's that are still blue (11/6/2010 7:51:35 AM)

quote:

Thank goodness for black Islamic terrorist Marxist presidents to wake them up or else we'd never have been aware of now what the tea partiers were themselves unaware of and completely oblivious to for over a decade.


Well, he is black, so you got 1 out of 4 right. Now please explain, why I should take anything you say seriously after that post? It's just more of the same old "all <insert your party here> are Baaaaaaaaad bullshit.



Malkinius -> RE: State's that are still blue (11/6/2010 9:39:12 AM)

Greetings Edwynn....

quote:

ORIGINAL: Edwynn
The false adjectives are not mine, rather a parroting of the parrots. I'm nowhere near that funny or stupid on my own.


Want a cracker?

Be well....

Malkinius



servantforuse -> RE: State's that are still blue (11/8/2010 6:10:33 PM)

The 60 + House seats that were picked up by the republicans is just part of switch from blue to red. The republicans picked up 682 state legislative seats nationwide.



thompsonx -> RE: State's that are still blue (11/27/2010 2:57:49 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Charles6682

I do agree with libertarian's alot.



Perhaps you might want to read a little more about the full picture of libertarian philosophy. It contains responsibilities as well as rights.





CallaFirestormBW -> RE: State's that are still blue (11/27/2010 5:34:20 PM)

quote:

Given the choice between the two, unreasonably sized government wins every time for me. I want a President Obama, not a Rupert Murdoch. I want a government that will protect me and mine from the greedy and powerful. That sort of suggests a government with enough teeth to bite big business on the butt when it intrudes into my life.


To this, I have to say life is not safe-- while our government should be providing basic security for our nation as a whole, the matter of economic progress must be determined by the population at large. If you disagree with a particular corporation, stop giving them money (by buying their stuff) and convince all of those with whom you associate to do the same. Support small, local businesses, and encourage the development of NEW small local businesses to meet the supply-chain needs of the companies that you -do- want to do business with. Invest in one another through funding cooperatives (that's what Savings and Loans used to be for, before we let someone else do all the dirty work... and launder all the fundage).

Unfortunately, all of this is a BUTTLOAD of work, and nobody wants to put that much effort into life any more. They'd rather just whine on their way to buy a new Samsung 40" big-screen TV to watch the evening propaganda on.

Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety.   AND Sell not virtue to purchase wealth, nor Liberty to purchase power. (Benjamin Franklin/Poor Richard)

Calla



Brain -> RE: State's that are still blue (11/27/2010 7:19:45 PM)


Jindal: As Rove says, GOP is on probation because it failed the last time around
http://www.dailykos.com/tv/w/002771/


quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

It wasnt that they fell for the tea party slogans, its that those who voted were angry at the government as a whole. The GOP sees this as a win for them. But im willing to state for the record that if this turns into a legal fest for the GOP party, as threatened, the party of no continues with no, no advancement in the way of jobs or the economy is realized, we will see an even bigger wave of anger come 2012.




thompsonx -> RE: State's that are still blue (11/27/2010 9:14:11 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: CallaFirestormBW

To this, I have to say life is not safe-- while our government should be providing basic security for our nation as a whole, the matter of economic progress must be determined by the population at large. If you disagree with a particular corporation, stop giving them money (by buying their stuff) and convince all of those with whom you associate to do the same.


If one buys a car one buys that car from one of about a dozen corporations.
If one buys tires for that car one would have the choice of about five corporations.
If one buys fuel for that car one would have the choice of about a half dozen corporations.
If one buys food one buys from one of about a dozen food producers.
It is called capitalism sweetie and those who control it answer to no one certainly not the government...they even got the government to make "ficticious entities" legal people.



Support small, local businesses, and encourage the development of NEW small local businesses to meet the supply-chain needs of the companies that you -do- want to do business with. Invest in one another through funding cooperatives (that's what Savings and Loans used to be for, before we let someone else do all the dirty work... and launder all the fundage).

Whom do you suppose supplies all the commodities to all of those small local businesses?

Unfortunately, all of this is a BUTTLOAD of work, and nobody wants to put that much effort into life any more. They'd rather just whine on their way to buy a new Samsung 40" big-screen TV to watch the evening propaganda on.

It aint ever gonna work as long as corporations are legal.

Calla





CallaFirestormBW -> RE: State's that are still blue (11/28/2010 6:44:06 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx

If one buys a car one buys that car from one of about a dozen corporations.

Perhaps consider buying a USED car from a private individual, or reduce the expense footprint and purchase alternative transportation (for example, I opted for a combination of carpooling and a small motorbike) -- or (for those fortunate enough to live within 10 miles of where they work) forgo the car entirely and buy a bicycle. There are a large number of small bike companies that still make custom bikes.

quote:

If one buys tires for that car one would have the choice of about five corporations.

Again, the solution is to get as far out of the system as one can manage. Yes, my bike and my motorbike use tires, and they're probably made by the same corporations -- but I have minimized both the cost to ME and the amount of money I am dumping into those corporations by reducing... and further, I do so while supporting local businesses with their roots in our community by being particular about how and where I make such purchases.

quote:

If one buys fuel for that car one would have the choice of about a half dozen corporations.

True -- so the solution is to use LESS fuel. See above.

quote:

If one buys food one buys from one of about a dozen food producers.


This is absolutely NOT true. There is an active and thriving Local Food movement out there. Local farmers who produce for local economies and who use sustainable methods to raise and tend their farms. Food from these folks is a little more expensive, but good menu planning and a little research can allow the average family to increase their food costs by about 5% and eat 85-90% of their food from local producers. I know. House Bladewing uses this method for food purchasing as one of our House Tenets in 5 states and 3 countries.

quote:

It is called capitalism sweetie and those who control it answer to no one certainly not the government...they even got the government to make "ficticious entities" legal people.


And for those who choose to sit back and whine and not DO anything about it through personal decision making, it will never change. For the rest of us, we take responsibility for the things we CAN change, and minimize our consumption of the things we CAN'T change, so at least we're not continuing to contribute to the problem.



quote:

Whom do you suppose supplies all the commodities to all of those small local businesses?


Depends on the business. Most of the businesses that I frequent either produce their own commodities or purchase from local producers. The biggest exception (and I admit that there ARE exceptions -- we've let control FAR out of our hands, and it's going to take some diligent work and persistent action by a much larger percentage of people than are now participating to do so) is energy -- and in the energy arena the corporations do kind of have us by the short hairs (please forgive my vulgar turn of phrase)... however, there are STILL options to improve things, even if we can't fix them. The local companies and producers that I support minimize their dependence on external energy systems by intentional conservation and efficiency. While it isn't perfect, it's a damned sight better than doing nothing and just bitching and moaning about how the poor corporations are taking our country away from us.

quote:

It aint ever gonna work as long as corporations are legal.


Please do feel free to continue to nay-say and whine. IN the meantime, I'll continue to take action, thank you very much.

Calla






thompsonx -> RE: State's that are still blue (11/28/2010 8:35:40 AM)

You seem to have missed my point completely.
Used cars tires bicycles etc were all originally produced by corporate monopolies.
I do not disagree with your concept of saving money and reducing your carbon footprint...my point was and is that there is no competition because of corporate monopolies.
You may not be aware of what exactly commodities are. A little research will help you to see what these commodities are who controls these commodities.
You might also want to check and see what percentage of us food comes from corporate farms vs. private farms of less than 1000 acres.
I point out factual data and you characterize that as whining...



popeye1250 -> RE: State's that are still blue (11/28/2010 9:16:46 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: thishereboi

quote:

Thank goodness for black Islamic terrorist Marxist presidents to wake them up or else we'd never have been aware of now what the tea partiers were themselves unaware of and completely oblivious to for over a decade.


Well, he is black, so you got 1 out of 4 right. Now please explain, why I should take anything you say seriously after that post? It's just more of the same old "all <insert your party here> are Baaaaaaaaad bullshit.



No, he got that one wrong too, Oblunder is only half black.



CallaFirestormBW -> RE: State's that are still blue (11/28/2010 3:25:08 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx

You seem to have missed my point completely.
Used cars tires bicycles etc were all originally produced by corporate monopolies.
I do not disagree with your concept of saving money and reducing your carbon footprint...my point was and is that there is no competition because of corporate monopolies.
You may not be aware of what exactly commodities are. A little research will help you to see what these commodities are who controls these commodities.
You might also want to check and see what percentage of us food comes from corporate farms vs. private farms of less than 1000 acres.
I point out factual data and you characterize that as whining...


You do realize that, as long as there are multiple corporations producing the same item and selling it in the same markets, that does NOT constitute a "monopoly", right? Just because a company is large does not mean that it has no competition... and a monopoly is defined as having no competition... ie, "Monopolies are thus characterised by a lack of economic competition for the good or service that they provide, and a lack of viable substitute goods."

Yes, factory farms currently produce about 90% of our nation's food. Another 6% by total value is imported from other countries (higher in some types of foods than others, with fish being one of the highest percentage imports at nearly 80% imported). However, the local food movement has increased its share of the market from a mere .03% five years ago to around 4% in just five short years. That sounds substantively more than "useless".

Commodities: iron ore, crude, coal, salt, sugar, corn, soybeans, cotton, coffee, aluminum, electricity...basically, base materials that are not differentiated between suppliers.... coal is coal is coal. These are traded on a common market and their value is determined NOT by the market but by the value of certificates (futures) which IMPLY ownership of percentages of all of the available (or producible) quantity of that item. Things with smaller available quantities tend to trade at higher values, simply because what exists is highly limited. OTOH, things like cotton, corn, and soybeans have a volatile market that depends on speculation about potential upcoming supply -- and if anything throws off the supply, whether by excess (surplus) or insufficiency (shortage), the anticipated value of any futures sold AND the market as a whole will be affected.

Now... that being said, I still hold that it is possible and beneficial for companies to choose how and where they purchase the actual RAW MATERIALS (since we are not speaking of commodity futures here, but of actual materials), and to do so as much as possible from local producers with whom they have established a healthy and mutually beneficial relationship that is NOT bound to the fluctuations of an artificially manipulated commodities market. People have been doing this for years, and somehow, it works out. As I mentioned in my earlier post, one big stickler is energy -- and even then, a larger and larger percentage of individuals is taking the issue of energy into their own hands and choosing to generate at least a portion of their own energy... so explain to me again how this is not realistic and I'm missing "the point".

Calla



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