Financial Security or Personal Freedom?

Financial Security or Personal Freedom? (Full Version)

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TreasureKY -> Financial Security or Personal Freedom? (1/4/2011 11:01:10 AM)
Reading Hertz's thread about making money on the internet, I got to thinking about the time Firm and I put into our business and just what our "hourly" income might be. To be honest, I still can't say for sure as I really have no way of knowing what our time investment is. Often I'm working from the time I get up until bedtime, and it doesn't matter what day of the week it is. Weekends, or even days off, are sometimes unheard of for long stretches of time. Of course, I still have household duties (and always have... even when I worked for someone else), so that's really nothing new. The big difference now is that I essentially have the freedom to make my own schedule. Firm and I can take off whenever we want... and we do quite often. Mind you, we have to make up for it when we do; and typically when we do take time off, our laptops go with us. While we don't spend any significant vacation time working, we do watch emails and will spend a few minutes here and there taking care of issues that come up. If I want to spend three days redecorating the spare bedroom, I no longer have to "beg" my employer to let me tack an extra day onto my weekend... either forgoing the pay or using a vacation day. If I want to do my grocery shopping on Tuesday mornings or get my nails manicured every week on Thursday afternoon, I have the freedom to do so. I admit that I wouldn't voluntarily give that freedom up for anything now, but it isn't all a bed of roses... I have strong work ethics... you do your work first, then you play. With working from where I live, I have a hard time relaxing and "playing" (ie, read a book, watch a movie, engage in some hobby) when I know that there is work in the other room that needs to be done. When we are busy (as we quite often are), it is easy for me to burn out. There's no leaving work at work. There's also the small matter of dependable income. When I worked for someone else, I knew every two weeks I would have a check and how much it would be. I didn't have to worry about budgeting beyond one month and I didn't have to deal with tax and social security withholdings. There were also benefits in the way of medical and dental insurance that I could rely on, as well as knowing that for the most part I would receive some kind of pay increase every year. While I don't have to worry about being fired for needing time off, I do still have to contend with no pay if I'm not working. Owning your own business means giving up such things as paid sick days and paid vacations... not to mention paid holidays. Business also isn't guaranteed. While we do very well over the year, there are times when work does slow down... and we don't get advanced notice of when that's going to happen or when it's going to end. During "fat" times, we have to carefully plan to cover expenses during the "lean" times... however long the lean times last. So... my question is, which you would prefer? Would you rather risk working for yourself... perhaps making just enough for your needs but having the freedom? Or do you prefer the security that a job working for someone else provides?

ricken -> RE: Financial Security or Personal Freedom? (1/4/2011 11:20:26 AM)
I am coming off almost 10 years of being self employed, and I can say this: Working for someone else is no more dependable than working for yourself, the past companies I have worked for have closed with little or no notice. The last, last one was the smallest about 50 people. They closed in a way that didn't even allow us to carry on our insurance with cobra. When that company closed I was so pissed off I couldn't go to a job interview, when I got that stupid question "where do you see yourself in five years?" I once answerd "Not answering stupid questions about where I will be in five years" , no I didn't get called back. I failed in my buisness for many reasons, one of them it was in construction, another issue , I couldn't find (honest) people that wanted to work. Not saying there isn't honest people out there, I just had bad luck... ANYWAY I am now working for someone else...Just long enough to find a new buisness that is less dependent on labour. So for me ....FREEDOM of self employment

sexyred1 -> RE: Financial Security or Personal Freedom? (1/4/2011 11:24:29 AM)
There is no security in either being self employed or working for others. As the poster above me said, most companies are "at will" employers and even if you perform over expectations, you can be fired at any time for any reason. Working for yourself is better only in that you control your own destiny; but you also need to find a hole in a particular market to fill that hole; so finding work to promote on your own is another challenge. I have a very good friend who has experienced the same things as me in working for others, being the top salesperson and still losing jobs. We talk weekly about what kind of business we could start and have not been able to come up with anything doable.

TreasureKY -> RE: Financial Security or Personal Freedom? (1/4/2011 11:45:35 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: ricken Working for someone else is no more dependable than working for yourself, the past companies I have worked for have closed with little or no notice. quote: ORIGINAL: sexyred1 There is no security in either being self employed or working for others. As the poster above me said, most companies are "at will" employers and even if you perform over expectations, you can be fired at any time for any reason. Oh, don't get me wrong. I'm not saying that working for someone else is without risk. I'm just referring to more of the steady and dependable income of a paycheck versus not knowing when your next customer will come along.

TreasureKY -> RE: Financial Security or Personal Freedom? (1/4/2011 11:48:37 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: ricken ... another issue , I couldn't find (honest) people that wanted to work. Not saying there isn't honest people out there, I just had bad luck... Amen and that could be an entirely separate thread all on its own. [8D]

anniezz338 -> RE: Financial Security or Personal Freedom? (1/4/2011 12:21:13 PM)
I've had enough of corporate America to last me several lifetimes. My last boss had the ethics of a serial killer. I wouldn't let someone like him lick dog shit off of my heels, much less have the power to wreck my career. Yes, I despised him....lol. Just because you have a job today, does not mean you will have one tomorrow. I'd take feast or famine any day of the week, I don't care how many or how few hours I have to put in. I could eat mac and cheese for a few months. Cooked on a campfire. Naked.

mummyman321 -> RE: Financial Security or Personal Freedom? (1/4/2011 12:40:29 PM)
I really like the thought of working strictly for myself. And while I do have a successful side business my main job is coporate america. I love my job and would not think of trading it in to run my own business, at least not yet. I am very lucky to have what I have and I know that. I travel globally on the company's dime. I get to meet a lot of people and experience different cultures. I would not get this experience if I owned my own company. I am not a suit and tie guy, I wear jeans and a polo shirt on most of my trips. I work as an engineer and travel to plants across the world. I get to meet the work force of the world (not the stuffy corporate managers LOL). I get to buy them a beer or two after work and talk with them about the cultural difference between me and them. I have to say its pretty nice. So while owning my own company sounds like fun it just does not compare to what I have now.

FirmhandKY -> RE: Financial Security or Personal Freedom? (1/4/2011 2:01:46 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: mummyman321 I really like the thought of working strictly for myself. And while I do have a successful side business my main job is coporate america. I love my job and would not think of trading it in to run my own business, at least not yet. I am very lucky to have what I have and I know that. I travel globally on the company's dime. I get to meet a lot of people and experience different cultures. I would not get this experience if I owned my own company. I am not a suit and tie guy, I wear jeans and a polo shirt on most of my trips. I work as an engineer and travel to plants across the world. I get to meet the work force of the world (not the stuffy corporate managers LOL). I get to buy them a beer or two after work and talk with them about the cultural difference between me and them. I have to say its pretty nice. So while owning my own company sounds like fun it just does not compare to what I have now. Damn. I think I know you! Do you "really" live in Cincinnati? Firm

mummyman321 -> RE: Financial Security or Personal Freedom? (1/4/2011 2:19:16 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: FirmhandKY Do you "really" live in Cincinnati? Firm Yes, I am really stuck in this dreadful town!

ricken -> RE: Financial Security or Personal Freedom? (1/4/2011 2:29:51 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: mummyman321 I really like the thought of working strictly for myself. And while I do have a successful side business my main job is coporate america. I love my job and would not think of trading it in to run my own business, at least not yet. I am very lucky to have what I have and I know that. I travel globally on the company's dime. I get to meet a lot of people and experience different cultures. I would not get this experience if I owned my own company. I am not a suit and tie guy, I wear jeans and a polo shirt on most of my trips. I work as an engineer and travel to plants across the world. I get to meet the work force of the world (not the stuffy corporate managers LOL). I get to buy them a beer or two after work and talk with them about the cultural difference between me and them. I have to say its pretty nice. So while owning my own company sounds like fun it just does not compare to what I have now. This to me, sounds like the best of both worlds. You are not totally tied to your employers money to survive, and not having to fight and sell and struggle and worry at every turn that you will have a customer tommorow. I wish I had the ability to see that route when I was employed full time before.

allthatjaz -> RE: Financial Security or Personal Freedom? (1/4/2011 3:45:44 PM)
I/We would always prefer to work for ourselves. We travel around because we want to and not because of work. Living on a boat means we can hang around the UK shores or take off to the Med or the Caribbean which means working for someone else would be near on impossible. Being self employed (if you pick the right business) can give you a lot more freedom. I have to say though, we don't work particularly hard and earn just enough to sustain the sort of lifestyle we want to live. That lifestyle includes lots of time to do the things that we want to do together in life. Life is too short and too many people spend their entire life working hard only to find they don't know what to do with their time when they reach retirement age. We don't let work rule us or consume us and we are both very happy with that.

littlewonder -> RE: Financial Security or Personal Freedom? (1/4/2011 3:49:15 PM)
I'm exactly at that point in my life and have been giving a lot of tremendous thought to it. I have a normal 9-5 job, same amount paycheck every two weeks, very secure...but I absolutely hate it and feel tied down and I hate the area where I live. So now that my daughter is on her own and an adult I've been thinking I would now like to have more personal freedom instead of the security of what I have now. I don't need a lot and can live off of very little. It's a bold, big step for me and makes me a bit fearful but I know if I don't take this leap now I never will.

gobsmack -> RE: Financial Security or Personal Freedom? (1/4/2011 6:47:15 PM)
I completely get the financial security vs personal freedom thing. I've been self employed since graduating from college and every once in a while I wonder if I should trade the uncertainty of being my own boss for a steady paycheck. I know having a job today doesn't guarantee it would be there tomorrow, but the idea of knowing there would be money coming in every two weeks is kind of nice. If I went into work and played Farmville all day (and not get caught), I still get paid for my time. If I did that being self employed, I won't get fired, but do it long enough, money would stop coming in. Another thing I miss is being able to stop thinking about work once the workday ends. In addition to employer provided medical/dental insurance, there is also retirement. Companies that match what employees put into a 401k? That's like free money. Or a pension for the rest of my life upon retirement? Awesome! Being self employed, retirement is all on me and I know better than to count on social security. The side effect of this uncertainty is I don't do debt. If I can't pay for it in full, I don't buy it. I'll probably buy a house eventually, but right now I can't see myself paying a mortgage for 15 or 30 years when I don't know what is going to happen a year from now. That said, I don't think I'll ever give up the freedom of self employment. I may work a lot, but I work on my own terms. If I want to sleep in late or take a day off, I'll do it. One bonus of not being tied down to a job is I've taken to traveling to a new place and living there for a while until I get bored and then I move on to the next place. It's almost like being retired or on vacation, but I am working while doing it. How many times have you heard the story of that guy who worked all his life, all the while looking forward to the things he can do and the places he can go upon retirement only to be unable to do those things once he retired? I resolve not to be that guy.

TreasureKY -> RE: Financial Security or Personal Freedom? (1/4/2011 7:08:11 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: littlewonder It's a bold, big step for me and makes me a bit fearful but I know if I don't take this leap now I never will. When I was laid off and I moved in with Firm... knowing that I'd eventually learn and help him with his business... that was one of the scariest things for me. I'd always worked for a regular paycheck and the idea of not knowing when you'll get the next check was frightening. I knew that Firm did okay financially, but I wasn't intimately involved with his finances at that time and I had a lot of uncertainty. I'd like to say that I've completely gotten over that... particularly in light of the fact that with me helping him we've grown to the point where we bring in about four times more that I ever did with my "regular paycheck". However, even though I'm a lot more confident I do still have my moments of worry; particularly when we take on new responsibility. It's hard to break a lifetime habit. One of the things I had in the back of my mind when I started this thread was to explore whether or not people were generally willing to work more hours for enough money to get by (at least enough for the necessities), in exchange for the freedom and control over your own livelihood. I don't think I'm too unusual in that I'm more than willing.

mummyman321 -> RE: Financial Security or Personal Freedom? (1/4/2011 7:22:30 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: TreasureKY One of the things I had in the back of my mind when I started this thread was to explore whether or not people were generally willing to work more hours for enough money to get by (at least enough for the necessities), in exchange for the freedom and control over your own livelihood. I don't think I'm too unusual in that I'm more than willing. Treasure, What I think you will find is that people who enjoy what they do for a living, do not necessarilly care that they put more hours in. If you enjoy your job and its pleasurable, you tend not be be a clock watcher. In fact you want to get the job and you work to that end regardless of the hours. Many people with owning their own company love what they do. They do not see it as work per say. Even thought I am not self employed, I really enjoy what I do. If I where to calculate the dollars per hour I make, it would be no suprise that many people make more per hour than I do. But then again its nothing for me to work 80 hours per week when I am on the road. I do not mind it because I am treated well, I work with all kind of interesting people and I learn something new all the time. So I guess what I am saying is that if you love what you do for a living, you do not mind putting in a lot more hours than to 40 hour/week guy/gal.

allthatjaz -> RE: Financial Security or Personal Freedom? (1/5/2011 1:46:23 AM)
Your absolutely right mummyman, enjoyable work is hardly work at all. I spent a lot of my life working as a horse trainer and I woke up every morning feeling like it was my birthday. I worked 12 hour shifts and came home each day feeling exhilarated. I always said though, if I ever wake up and feel like I don't want to go into work, its time to give this up. Unfortunately that happened eventually. You can't do that sort of hard physical work year after year without it having a negative effect on your personal life and health. I still look back on those times fondly but I couldn't do it now. I have worked in the city and done the 3 hour commute every day. I'm really not cut out for cutthroat work. The only time I really got in debt is when I was earning seriously good money. They say you live to your means but when I was earning a lot I was spending way beyond my means. Perhaps that's a sign of unhappiness? All I can say littlewonder is, be brave and go for it. We had to plan what we were willing to sacrifice and believe me it was a lot but our life is now filled with other riches that far outweigh what we previously considered important. So many friends say 'I would love to live your sort of life' but they aren't brave enough to make that jump. So long as you plan ahead you can do it.

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