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ORIGINAL: truckinslave

"...you will need to amend the US constitution and modify the 14th amend. "

There is a growingly pervasive legal argument to the contrary. At the very least it is clear that the prevalent interpretation today is not what was intended by those who wrote the 14th Amendment

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ORIGINAL: MrRodgers

Well better get busy kinkroids, if you want to change the terms of citizenship (all historical SCOTUS rulings) ...you will need to amend the US constitution and modify the 14th amend.

The 'states' are irrelevant. The legal definition of citizenship is codified by the constitution, changed only by beginning with a vote on such a change, in the US congress.

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ORIGINAL: Elisabella

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ORIGINAL: DomKen
Do you think you would be a citizen under that rule? It is certain that most americans wouldn't.

Well I would be. Both my father and my mother's grandparents immigrated to the US legally (so my mother, and her parents, are the children of two legal citizens) How do you suppose most wouldn't be?

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ORIGINAL: popeye1250
Mr Rogers, the 14 th Amendment was written to give "full citizenship" to freed slaves.
I've read it and nowhere in there does it say you can sneak into the U.S. illegally and get U.S. Citizenship for your illegal children. It's not even a "loophole.

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All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside

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ORIGINAL: DomKen

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ORIGINAL: Elisabella

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ORIGINAL: DomKen
Do you think you would be a citizen under that rule? It is certain that most americans wouldn't.

Well I would be. Both my father and my mother's grandparents immigrated to the US legally (so my mother, and her parents, are the children of two legal citizens) How do you suppose most wouldn't be?

You can of course present their entry visas, issued by a US consulate or embassy before they left their home countries, then? If not they entered the country without legal permission. So under the theory being promulgated most of the nation are not citizens and I am all for deporting all of them as soon as we start changing birth right citizenship.

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ORIGINAL: Lucylastic

if the 14th amendment is about to be amended(GAH) Maybe its time that the equal protection clause , prohibit discrimination based on gender or sexual orientation.Just to make sure that EVERYONE Is covered..not just  white het men? yanno women might appreciate that, to say the least
not that I have any way of addressing the proceedings, but it just seemed like a good idea Discrimination based on gender or sexual orientation is a disgrace in the 21st century

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ORIGINAL: Lucylastic

if the 14th amendment is about to be amended(GAH) Maybe its time that the equal protection clause , prohibit discrimination based on gender or sexual orientation.Just to make sure that EVERYONE Is covered..not just  white het men? yanno women might appreciate that, to say the least
not that I have any way of addressing the proceedings, but it just seemed like a good idea Discrimination based on gender or sexual orientation is a disgrace in the 21st century

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ORIGINAL: DomKen

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ORIGINAL: popeye1250
Mr Rogers, the 14 th Amendment was written to give "full citizenship" to freed slaves.
I've read it and nowhere in there does it say you can sneak into the U.S. illegally and get U.S. Citizenship for your illegal children. It's not even a "loophole.

Its actually the very first line:

quote:

All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside

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ORIGINAL: popeye1250

quote:

ORIGINAL: MrRodgers

Well better get busy kinkroids, if you want to change the terms of citizenship (all historical SCOTUS rulings) ...you will need to amend the US constitution and modify the 14th amend.

The 'states' are irrelevant. The legal definition of citizenship is codified by the constitution, changed only by beginning with a vote on such a change, in the US congress.

Mr Rogers, the 14 th Amendment was written to give "full citizenship" to freed slaves.
I've read it and nowhere in there does it say you can sneak into the U.S. illegally and get U.S. Citizenship for your illegal children. It's not even a "loophole.
It says nothing about bank robbery in there either but you can't do that either.
I'd welcome a constitutional convention on this but it's really not neccessary, just clarify the language so that both parents have to be in the U.S. legally.
After that they can deputise tens of thousands of military veterans to go after the people who are in our country illegally and deport them and arrest the employers who hired them.
You don't let foreigners determine our immigration laws!

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ORIGINAL: MrRodgers
The 14th amend. says it all right here in the first line. "Section 1. All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside."

As for truckinslave and this being very expensive, yes somewhat but there is somewhat of a return to on those that grow up and work and I suspect not much more and maybe even cheaper than immigration law enforcement. The fact of the matter is that our politicians have failed miserably for 30 years on setting up any resonable govt. network to legitimately process people.

But as the courts will quickly advise...the jurisdiction is theirs and they have ruled this amend. to mean what it says..."ALL persons born..."

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ORIGINAL: Elisabella

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ORIGINAL: DomKen

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ORIGINAL: Elisabella

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ORIGINAL: DomKen
Do you think you would be a citizen under that rule? It is certain that most americans wouldn't.

Well I would be. Both my father and my mother's grandparents immigrated to the US legally (so my mother, and her parents, are the children of two legal citizens) How do you suppose most wouldn't be?

You can of course present their entry visas, issued by a US consulate or embassy before they left their home countries, then? If not they entered the country without legal permission. So under the theory being promulgated most of the nation are not citizens and I am all for deporting all of them as soon as we start changing birth right citizenship.

For my father, yes. For my great grandparents, not sure. But since I believe that one citizen parent is enough to give automatic citizenship, my father's papers would be good enough for me XD

Either way though it's irrelevant, because the theoretical requirement being discussed is citizenship, not legal entry. If I had to, I'd be able to show when and where my father and my great-grandparents became legally naturalized citizens.

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ORIGINAL: InvisibleBlack

quote:

ORIGINAL: MrRodgers
The 14th amend. says it all right here in the first line. "Section 1. All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside."

As for truckinslave and this being very expensive, yes somewhat but there is somewhat of a return to on those that grow up and work and I suspect not much more and maybe even cheaper than immigration law enforcement. The fact of the matter is that our politicians have failed miserably for 30 years on setting up any resonable govt. network to legitimately process people.

But as the courts will quickly advise...the jurisdiction is theirs and they have ruled this amend. to mean what it says..."ALL persons born..."

Just to play Devil's Advocate - law is based on nuances of meaning. If you look at the way it's worded...

"Section 1. All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside."
 
...there's another clause there. That was put there so that if you were born to French citizens working in the French Consulate in the United States, you would not be granted U. S. citizenship, you would be regarded as a French citizen. A case could be made that if your parents are citizens of another country, and have not emigrated to the United States and you just happen to be born on United States soil, you would not qualify for citizenship as you're not "subject to the jurisdiction" of the United States.

That's not the case currently, it's not interpreted that way ... but it could be.

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ORIGINAL: Elisabella

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ORIGINAL: DomKen
Do you think you would be a citizen under that rule? It is certain that most americans wouldn't.

Well I would be. Both my father and my mother's grandparents immigrated to the US legally (so my mother, and her parents, are the children of two legal citizens) How do you suppose most wouldn't be?

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ORIGINAL: subexploring
Getting rid of birthright citizenship brings its own set of problems. You end up with the kind of "guest worker" problem they have in many European nations, where people are in a country for generations but have no citizenship and no rights. That's an issue to me. Better to address immigration by doing the one thing corporations won't allow to happen -- introducing true sanctions on employers who hire illegals.