quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53

Laughable.....you keep posting nonsense and still cant see the wood from the trees. If you had half a brain you would see that your own posts give you plenty of different definitions.

Previously ( and on more than one occassion) you have insisted America is still owned by the Crown. Yet here we have it, your own myriad of posts showing alternative meanings of the word Sovereign. Your posts are a laughing stock, which is why others have you hidden, frankly I dont blame them. Maybe, just maybe, people would take you seriously if you didnt keep trying to insist ancient laws, long since changed in the UK, have any relevance to what you jokingly call facts.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Charles6682

Um,maybe more lawmakers should be protecting themselves.Congressman and Congresswoman are out in the public spotlight many times.The reality is,there will always be some looney tunes nutjob like the shooter at Tuscon who dosent need a reason to do what they do.THEY ARE NUTS!!Its that simple.Judges,lawmakers,they are out in the public spotlight.They need to protect themselves.

quote:

quote:

ORIGINAL: DarkSteven

The Giffords shooting has caused a lot of soul searching, and a lot of hysteria.  My take:

7. Maybe I'm out of line here, but I'm pissed off that the Congresspeople and Senators are starting to introduce legislation aimed at protecting themselves from attacks like this.  What about the rest of us who also have to worry about random violence?  If they want to introduce legislation to make themselves safer, I want it to apply to me as well.

quote:

1.01 State sovereignty and jurisdiction.

The sovereignty and jurisdiction of this state extend to all places within the boundaries (unless your name is United States that means OVER YOU lol) declared in article II of the constitution, subject only to such rights of jurisdiction as have been or shall be acquired by the United States over any places therein; and the governor, and all subordinate officers of the state, shall maintain and defend its sovereignty and jurisdiction.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne

well as you can see you do not need a very high IQ to see that the state declared itself the king over everything with its jurisdiction.

All that this person sees is that the state declared itself as having the authority to make and enforce its own laws. Which is one definition of "sovereignty" (self-government), but has nothing to do with kings. The state declared itself in charge of everything that goes on in the state, subject only to the federal government, which in turn is subject to international law. i'd say it's really exaggerating to call the state's ability to make and enforce laws "kingship" or "monarchy". (A better word would be "republic", because it's based on election and not hereditary priveledge). But, for the purposes of this discussion, okay. Go ahead, call it that. So that state is "king" of what goes on in the state, provided that it doesn't go against what the federal "kings" have said. Likewise, the local governments are "kings" of their own domain, subject to the state and federal "kings".

Do you think that states should NOT have the authority to make and enforce laws? Or that city and local governments shouldn't? If local law didn't exist, would you be just as mad at the federal government for imposing ITS laws? Are you mad at international law? How dare the United Nations declare its sovereignty (excuse me, "kingship") over YOU? Are you really just mad about having to follow any laws at all? Why do you think we (read: society) makes laws? Is there a reason? Or is it just to piss you off?

It is snot an accident that you are born IN the state of and your car is "registered" IN the county of and kept IN the city of and your property is IN the county of and so forth and so on. It is how they claim jurisdiction over you and can take your kids from you and everything else.

It's not an accident that your passport says "United States" either. Another word for that is "citizenship". You are born a citizen of your state and country. U.S. citizenship is considered granted at birth (for those who are born here), but your state and local citizenship are determined by residency. Being a citizen of a state or city means you pay taxes in exchange for the benefits that their "sovereignty" provides you. Benefits such as: schools, police, the maintenance of roads, sanitation workers, the local courts, etc.

You really don't want to be under the city's jurisdiction? Okay, but how will you feel when your house is burning down, and they just look at you and say, hey buddy, that's your problem. How would you like disposing of your own sewage? Digging your own well? Generating your own electricity. Setting up your own IV fluid as you drive to the hospital yourself? Assuming there even is a hospital. What happens when there's an earthquake? A hurricane? A flood? And they just look at you and shrug. Also, generally they don't take people's kids away unless there's a good reason.

Your ability to contract overrules the constitution and when you contract with the devil, that is the government you sell your soul and "CONVERT" your rights to priviledges and only if you are are a court meister do you stand a snowballs chance in hell of getting away from their clutches because you are a beneficiary of the city they built. 

Actually, the 10th Amendment grants sovereignty to state governments to preside over matters within their own borders. The only provision is that the state make no law that violates federal law. So those "kings" are completely constitutional.

Doesnt matter that they are a beneficiary of you being there and that their taxation scheme in history was called slavery and in an unconscionable contract, that does not matter.

Who called it that, out of curiosity? What state or local governments do you know of that are being run for profit, rather than being run to exactly use up the money in their yearly budget?

You were dumb enough to be born!
If you have no figgered it out look again!

i have looked at your arguments various times and i still haven't "figured it out".

section 1.01 states that all the officers of the state are chartered to PROTECT THE STATE NOT YOU!

Yes, because "the state" represents millions of people, and not just you. State governments are empowered to act for the greater good, not for the good of one person or another.

That was the whole point of my posting that in the first place.

Can you give any examples of a state deliberately acting contrary to the wellbeing of its own people?

You are not chartered to be protected yet you are paying for it and the whole purpose of government was to protect your life liberty and pursuit of happiness NOT SELL YOU FIRE AND WATER SERVICES!!!  and all the other horsecrap they have on the tax roll!

Like, as i mentioned above, emergency services, sanitation, police, public schools, jails, etc.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Termyn8or
jlf, does RealO have a fucking problem with you ? Then why do you have a problem with him ? Has he or Hunky or anyone recommended that you seek psychiactric help, get locked up or even shut the fuck up ?"

quote:

ORIGINAL: Termyn8or

jlf, does RealO have a fucking problem with you ? Then why do you have a problem with him ? Has he or Hunky or anyone recommended that you seek psychiactric help, get locked up or even shut the fuck up ?"

The fucking problem is your's. The only problem I have is when he starts the tax shit, and I have a fucking reason. You Sir are trying to quell those with whom you disagree.

You say that shit, and my take on it is that you are exactly the kind of person who is the antithesis of what MY country is all about.

How's them apples ?


T^T

quote:

ORIGINAL: Termyn8or

jlf, does RealO have a fucking problem with you ? Then why do you have a problem with him ? Has he or Hunky or anyone recommended that you seek psychiactric help, get locked up or even shut the fuck up ?"

The fucking problem is your's. The only problem I have is when he starts the tax shit, and I have a fucking reason. You Sir are trying to quell those with whom you disagree.

You say that shit, and my take on it is that you are exactly the kind of person who is the antithesis of what MY country is all about.

How's them apples ?


T^T

quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne

ah..... I have seen this happen on a lot of boards....

These guys butts are so pinned in the corner because they cannot refute this stuff using law they either go deep into denial and cognitive dissonance posture or sometimes they are precisely that, the anti thesis to what this country was hoped to become.

Anyway I feel his pain, in fact that last post I laughed so hard I had tears in my eyes...  LOL   

He can never attack the post or the case citings with counter-law just continues to attack me personally LOL

When that happens you got em by the balls! 

I feel his pain!  Really I do!

(Nah just foolin!)  LMAO

quote:

ORIGINAL: gungadin09

quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne

well as you can see you do not need a very high IQ to see that the state declared itself the king over everything with its jurisdiction.

All that this person sees is that the state declared itself as having the authority to make and enforce its own laws.

By the "state" you mean who though?  There are no records of actual ballots or referendums that the free inhabitants ever voted to create the constitution for my state, just certified votes from the county "electors".  In fact in my state there was huge opposition to the creation of a "state".

Which is one definition of "sovereignty" (self-government), but has nothing to do with kings.

Sure it does, read Blackstones commentaries on the king.  the king = sovereign = state.

You have a ruler over you either way that trumps the republic.   Show me even one law that gives one man or a group men (democracy), (people), to rule over another?  That is called slavery.

The state declared itself in charge of everything that goes on in the state, subject only to the federal government, which in turn is subject to international law.

I will go along with that, that a group gave themselves a label state and started making rules for everyone else and they are enforced at the tip of a barrel of a gun and does not make a crap that you consent or not.  If you can be sited in you are a viable target.  Thats the reality.

i'd say it's really exaggerating to call the state's ability to make and enforce laws "kingship" or "monarchy".


Do you need me to get blackstone for you to show you that its the same thing?

(A better word would be "republic", because it's based on election and not hereditary priveledge).

No!

That is not the elements of a republic at all!  Remember the ben frank joke about the 2 wolves and a sheep with a gun?

People have been grossly misinformed on what a republic is starting in the shitty schools we have.

Here is the core and root of a republic........  ok in a pure republic you have land with people living on it.  Thats it.   JUst land with people living on it and no government at all zippo nadda. BUT BEFORE YOU SCREAM ANARCHY!!!!!....... you also have law ok.....  The reason why is you need a means to settle disputes between people.   So you put together a temporary democracy (jury) to "vote" in their best judgment who should prevail in the dispute.  The jury dismantles and you are back to your pure republic.  THAT is a republic.

Now if you want a pure democracy it takes 3 people.  You need a minimum of 3 to have a democracy and by parlimentary rules that is called a "quorum" which is lawful in most states some require 5.  Ok that said using 3, the reason it is a democracy is that 2 people can use FORCE against the other one and with that force take everything he has and screw his wive and there is not a damn thing he can do about it except watch and get beat up or shot if he tries to stop them.

That said a democracy represents FORCE of many OPERATING under one NAME.

State of new york versus State of South Carolina.  That means all the people in new york are under one name suing all the people of SC.

Which can be taken quite lightly but what about when its all the people of New York suing the citizen of New York?  Or the State of New York wrongs the citizen and uses it sovereign authority and tells the citizen to go fuck himself he has no standing to sue the SOVEREIGN.

Talk about cognitive dissonance it is impossible to have more authority then is legitimate and its complete lunacy to think that the sovereignty lies in the people only at the voting both to chose their master.  If the sovereignty lies in the people jointly they also have it severally!

How can people govern a state if they are incapable of governing themselves in the same capacity?   See the disjointed logic you have been taught?

But, for the purposes of this discussion, okay. Go ahead, call it that. So that state is "king" of what goes on in the state, provided that it doesn't go against what the federal "kings" have said. Likewise, the local governments are "kings" of their own domain, subject to the state and federal "kings".

No a sovereign is a king, and americans are sovereign in that they have no subjects but themselves.  Of course that is another loony tune version of sovereignty because once again if the americans are part and party to a democracy they rule over the rest of the body po;itic by their vote.

Do you think that states should NOT have the authority to make and enforce laws?

Sure over those who consent to be subject to their jurisdiction.  Keep in mind that the state in the sense of a democracy becomes the trustee and the trustee PAYS THE BILLS for the beneficiaries!  So when people start to wake up this so called gubmint we have will be only to hally to let people who want out of the system out when people figger out that beneficiaries pay no bills and that means cars houses food you name it.  They want to run with the parens patria doctrine them pay the bills LOL  Right now they have it both ways because people do not knwo any better and do not understand law well enough to do anything about it or even wage a good front to get their rights back.

Or that city and local governments shouldn't? If local law didn't exist, would you be just as mad at the federal government for imposing ITS laws?

Well thats not it.  You see sovereigns operate off of contract and treaties not laws in as much as you would think of them, you know a cop standing over your head with a tazer.  Sovereigns today fight their battles in courts unless of course you are a barbaric state and you feel you can march into iraq and install a democracy and force your wholely unwanted gubmint on a culture and people who neither wants or deserves to be enslaved to your commercial ass rape venue. 

Are you mad at international law?

Nope I use it out of necessity sometimes.

How dare the United Nations declare its sovereignty (excuse me, "kingship") over YOU?

Yeh How Dare them too.  By what authority do they think they can control me?  Grant from God or satan?

Are you really just mad about having to follow any laws at all?

Nah you create and abolish several laws every day.  I borrow you my pen state I want it back you gave it back we both had a meeting of minds in a contract and that contract became the law and it was discharged in accord and satisfaction.
See people make law every day.
Why do you think we (read: society) makes laws? Is there a reason? Or is it just to piss you off?

Force, you and others do not really grasp what a real republic is.   Granted a democracy has it place as I explained in a jury and of course to take care of criminals which you would have very little of if you abolished the banks and the commercialization of people.  as in your body.

Remember if you have a kid tomorrow, that little baby is born into slavery.  He is legally a bond slave.  There is a 40,000 dollar debt he has to work off around his neck the second he pops out.  That IS SLAVERY!  People do not know the difference today, no clue what so ever!  the various forms of REAL slavery.  and once that kid pops out he is AUTOMATICALLY A CITIZEN OF THE STATE AND THE US.   Convenient does not have to be sworn in....  get the picture?  You people accept complete abrogation of your rights as law!  and you dont even know you are slaves!  and born into slavery!

It is snot an accident that you are born IN the state of and your car is "registered" IN the county of and kept IN the city of and your property is IN the county of and so forth and so on. It is how they claim jurisdiction over you and can take your kids from you and everything else.

It's not an accident that your passport says "United States" either. Another word for that is "citizenship". You are born a citizen of your state and country. U.S. citizenship is considered granted at birth (for those who are born here), but your state and local citizenship are determined by residency.

I hate to be a nit picker but I am not res-ident.

You see I am a living sentient being not a commercial dead man.

resident means "thing"-"identified".  You are a "human resource".

Every wonder why?  Because you are no more than reduced to cattle in a commercial system.  They commercialized you.   Nothing more than a statistic and calculated producer.  They trade based on your expected output.  LOL

So how do you feel now?  LOL   Sad state of affairs and I bet you accept it as nothing to be concerned about?  Well fear not because I just informed you of the elements required to create a slave.

Being a citizen of a state or city means you pay taxes in exchange for the benefits that their "sovereignty" provides you.

Sovereignty does not provide anything for anyone.  Sovereignty only means self-governing.  It can be one man or woman.  Not a group.  In fact in its strict sense of the word sovereign cannot be a "fictitious"  "person"  ie an ens legis or a nom degurre.  It can only be a real live man or woman.

Benefits such as: schools, police, the maintenance of roads, sanitation workers, the local courts, etc.

There again you use that benefit word if I am getting a benefit then they better pay ALL THE FUCKING BILLS! Because that makes them the trustee.  Oh thats right they are the trustee!  But we have to pay taxes too!  Hmmmm,,,,,  nothing wrong with this picture!  LOL  Fooled us!

Now lets talk about the benefit I bring to the city eh?   They would not exist without a few million of me would they and the few million of me as the trust corpus are the creator of them!!  Seems they benefit from me so what gives them the authority to tax me as a creditor then turn right around and make me a slave debtor?  Into trust and commercial law are ya?

You really don't want to be under the city's jurisdiction?

You are joking right?  Only a lunatic would want to be governed, (except of course for funnzies)..... 

I am more than happy to be a contracting agent to the city by treaty of my own making and servicing contracts etc.

Okay, but how will you feel when your house is burning down, and they just look at you and say, hey buddy, that's your problem.

I have a sprinkler system, nice try.

How would you like disposing of your own sewage?

Easy, prefer it frankly.

Digging your own well?

Been there done that.

Generating your own electricity.

yep got that too

Setting up your own IV fluid as you drive to the hospital yourself?

Yep stoopid assed doctors diagnosed me incorrectly 4 times in the last 10 years and I had to correct them.

Assuming there even is a hospital.

Anyone can buy medical equipment and read a fricken read out LOL

What happens when there's an earthquake? A hurricane? A flood? And they just look at you and shrug.

Like they do not already?  When I was a boy the whole hood would chip in and buy and build new places but then that was before every sucked on the me me me bank tit, well except in new york I suppose because they were commercialized long before the rural areas.

Also, generally they don't take people's kids away unless there's a good reason.

Since when does a good reason trump rights?  When a good reason trumps right you have no rights.  Granted while part of me sympathizes with you there is nothing more precious than rights. 

the rule is injury in body or equity.

Your ability to contract overrules the constitution and when you contract with the devil, that is the government you sell your soul and "CONVERT" your rights to priviledges and only if you are are a court meister do you stand a snowballs chance in hell of getting away from their clutches because you are a beneficiary of the city they built. 

Actually, the 10th Amendment grants sovereignty to state governments to preside over matters within their own borders.

and the 14th takes it away!  LOL
It also grants sovereignty to the people and they are both several and jointly members of the state club.

The only provision is that the state make no law that violates federal law.

Now you hit a good one!!!  In fact you are correct!  There is no mandate for any legislature to create law which they have the authority to do without your permission that is constitutional.  NONE ZIPPO to the best of my knowledge in any state.

So those "kings" are completely constitutional.

OOPS no they are not.  the 14th was passed without suffrage from the south completely unlawful and they know about it and discussed it on the floor in 1967 and will not do anything about it because the people of america wont MAKE THEM!  I posted the congressional record here before on the matter.  Thats one of the reasons jlf is so raging pissed off at me LOL

Doesnt matter that they are a beneficiary of you being there and that their taxation scheme in history was called slavery and in an unconscionable contract, that does not matter.

Who called it that, out of curiosity? What state or local governments do you know of that are being run for profit, rather than being run to exactly use up the money in their yearly budget?

Well again I also posted the CRIS accounts of the court that monetize every case traffic ticket and parking ticket and they get sent up to wall street as derivatives!  JUSTICE FOR MONEY ON MTV!  Its the industrial disease! and that is only the tip of the iceburg they are literally robbing you blind. LMAO


You were dumb enough to be born!
If you have no figgered it out look again!

i have looked at your arguments various times and i still haven't "figured it out".

well you need to do a huge mongous amount of research to get to where I am at frankly..... and I do mean hit the state archives and national archives etc etc etc.

section 1.01 states that all the officers of the state are chartered to PROTECT THE STATE NOT YOU!

Yes, because "the state" represents millions of people, and not just you. State governments are empowered to act for the greater good, not for the good of one person or another.

No they arent.  they are enacted to control you by a small group call a legislature who need to make shit loads of law that in reality are corporate by-laws.....and sell it to you as law of the land under the pretense of due process.  LOL  So much money to be made so little time!  Getting fined 200 bucks because your 16 year old took a sip of beer?  Yeh thats constitutional aint it!

That was the whole point of my posting that in the first place.

Can you give any examples of a state deliberately acting contrary to the well being of its own people?

You are kidding me right?  Tell me its not so! LOL  First you prove my point with the use of "ITS OWN PEOPLE" thank you! You are programmed well!  You identify as owned by the state as you well should. "slave"!

Yes they are chartered to protect my rights liberties not provide services that you think would be nice at the end of a barrel of a fucking gun.  In as much as what they do agains the rights of the people the list would make a 5 inch thick book you arent serious are you?   

You are not chartered to be protected yet you are paying for it and the whole purpose of government was to protect your life liberty and pursuit of happiness NOT SELL YOU FIRE AND WATER SERVICES!!!  and all the other horsecrap they have on the tax roll!

Like, as i mentioned above, emergency services, sanitation, police, public schools, jails, etc.

pam

quote:

ORIGINAL: Termyn8or
Has he or Hunky or anyone recommended that you seek psychiatric help

quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961
Considering that NONE of realone's has a basis in fact, law OR reality, I have a problem. Furthermore, the philosophies he claims to follow are noted for illegal activities up to and including the murder of law enforcement personnel.

Now that either makes him one of two things, insane, or dangerous.

quote:

ORIGINAL: gungadin09
It's nice to see you make such a mature and well reasoned response in the face of such "personal attacks". Technically, the reason that people are at such a loss to respond is because you're talking complete nonsense. (And i say that as a criticism of your argument, not yourself...)But if you want a discussion, why not give a straight answer to the few people who have bothered to take this thread seriously?

pam

quote:


ORIGINAL: Real0ne

well as you can see you do not need a very high IQ to see that the state declared itself the king over everything with its jurisdiction.

The state has done no such thing. Federal jurisdiction trumps the state and federal agencies can and have taken over operations and taken the local and state agencies out of the loop

It is snot an accident that you are born IN the state of and your car is "registered" IN the county of and kept IN the city of and your property is IN the county of and so forth and so on. It is how they claim jurisdiction over you and can take your kids from you and everything else.

Under this argument, I could not legally leave the state I was born in, without the proper immigration papers. My sister and I own property in Texas and North Carolina, since we are not citizens of the state of North Carolina, we are not subject to their jurisdiction. We are subject to the laws of Texas and the federal government, but not North Carolina.

Furthermore, I can, if I desire to, move to another state, take my car, buy property in that state and maintain the property I have in the other two states and would only be under the jurisdiction of the state I move to.


Your ability to contract overrules the constitution and when you contract with the devil, that is the government you sell your soul and "CONVERT" your rights to priviledges and only if you are are a court meister do you stand a snowballs chance in hell of getting away from their clutches because you are a beneficiary of the city they built.

How many times have you had this argument thrown back in your face? And you still make the same claim. There is no case law, in any court in the United States that supports your claim.

Doesnt matter that they are a beneficiary of you being there and that their taxation scheme in history was called slavery and in an unconscionable contract, that does not matter.

What fucking archaic ancient law that is no longer recognized are you basing this crap on? Something out of Imperial Russia?

quote:

ORIGINAL: gungadin09

quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne

ah..... I have seen this happen on a lot of boards....

These guys butts are so pinned in the corner because they cannot refute this stuff using law they either go deep into denial and cognitive dissonance posture or sometimes they are precisely that, the anti thesis to what this country was hoped to become.

Anyway I feel his pain, in fact that last post I laughed so hard I had tears in my eyes...  LOL   

He can never attack the post or the case citings with counter-law just continues to attack me personally LOL

When that happens you got em by the balls! 

I feel his pain!  Really I do!

(Nah just foolin!)  LMAO

It's nice to see you make such a mature and well reasoned response in the face of such "personal attacks". Technically, the reason that people are at such a loss to respond is because you're talking complete nonsense. (And i say that as a criticism of your argument, not yourself...)But if you want a discussion, why not give a straight answer to the few people who have bothered to take this thread seriously?

pam

quote:

ORIGINAL: Hippiekinkster
You are relatively new here. Now, granted, I've only been here for three or four years, but even prior to that, on another purple board far, far away I recognized the futility of attempting to have a rational discussion with those who are obviously batshit crazy.

My question to you is this: what do you hope to accomplish by attempting to have a reasoned discussion with someone who is quite clearly incapable of reason? Paranoid schizophrenics frequently fixate on some sort of "everyone else vs. me" scenario; in this case it is the delusion that the person is some sort of "sovereign" entity that is not subject to any laws except those the voices require him to obey.

Oh good thing I seen this!   I have difficulty reading tard posts and I usually dont even scan them any more aside to realize if it came from a tard or not.

Tards think sovereigns do not have law or go by law because they dont have the statute merchant up their ass. 

quote:

"The meaning of 'sovereignty' is the decree of the sovereign makes law." American Banana Co. v. United Fruit Co., 29 S.Ct. 511, 513, 213 U.

The law of the land and any lawmaker in higher gubmint will tell you that due process under common law is an ALTERNATIVE to statutory law.  Tards simply do not get it!

Its because they think everybody wears the same shit stained panties they do!

Of course tards are non-the wiser because they think that everyone must be a slave just like them and frankly its coming to that because the slaves love their slavery so much they cheer when the gubmint keeps peace loving sovereigns hostage at the end of a barrel of a gun.....the enslaved love company but that is changing because damages get quite high and bonds once lost are never regained.

Sovereignty is so far fetched from the slaves mind they cant even imagine it much less grasp how it works.

But then that is why they are slaves.


You CANNOT dissuade the delusional on an internet message board. Even professionals with years of experience, using therapy and antipsychotics, have a difficult time introducing them to reality.

They may not go away, but by engaging with them, you are reinforcing their insanity. Do you understand?

And if you wanna know what batshit crazy is, it is a slave who waves his flag telling everyone he is free when he has to ask permission to buy a drug at the drug store and those radicals across the pond can walk in and order anything they want when ever they want and as much as they want.  No script required!  Now watch someone jump up and down and justify the need for permission! LMAO

quote:

Then why do you have a problem with him ?