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To take pride in... - 1/26/2011 8:19:30 PM

ThePeripatetic

Posts: 139
Joined: 12/21/2010
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This post is inspired by and in praise of LadyPact and her sub, LPslittleclip.

I've read their forum signatures many times. LadyPact's reads, "Proud owner of LPslittleclip" and in turn, clip's reads, "proud slave of LadyPact". I never really thought twice about it until just recently. It suddenly dawned on me that their signature is actually a pretty profound statement about their relationship. It speaks volumes about their dynamic.

I believe the concept of "taking pride in..." is hugely important amidst a D/s relationship. From my perspective, as a submissive, one of my greatest fears is that my submission will be taken for granted, that it won't be respected by the One I'm serving. But hearing the words "I'm proud of you" quickly drowns out these fears. Those words give me the courage and the willpower to endure just about anything that comes my way.

I also think this simple statement captures something that goes beyond just BDSM. It hints at the value and respect one has for their submissive or their Dominant beyond what they provide in terms of kink. I'm sure most all of you would agree when I say that I want to be valued for much more than what I provide in the BDSM realm. I doubt many people would use the term "I'm proud of you" if they're only thinking about how this person brings them sexual fulfillment.

Anyway, I don't have any sort of question here. Just some musings. Feel free to contribute some thoughts. And thanks to LadyPact and clip for being such positive examples! Glad you two are doing well!

.

_____________________________

"The Journey is the Destination" - Dan Eldon (One of my heroes. R.I.P.)

Post #: 1

RE: To take pride in... - 1/26/2011 11:44:18 PM

porcelaine

Posts: 5020
Joined: 7/24/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: ThePeripatetic

"But hearing the words "I'm proud of you" quickly drowns out these fears. Those words give me the courage and the willpower to endure just about anything that comes my way."

Greetings Theperipatetic,

I concur with your sentiments regarding LadyPact and Her clip. Thank you for bringing attention to something positive and worth noting. :)

As for your comments, I'm reminded of the song "More Than Words" by Westlife. One particular stanza jumps out at me and accurately sums up my feelings on your remarks:

What would you say
If I took those words away
Then you couldn't make things new
Just by saying I love you

It's more than words
It's more than what you say
It's the things you do

There are countless ways to show ones appreciation and I would be remiss if I limited my partner to verbal expressions. One of the largest challenges slaves encounter is learning to think outside the box and allowing their partner freedom and true latitude in his leadership. Difference isn't always bad nor is an omission of our preferred response indicative of lack or neglect. Sometimes we get lost in a sea of sound and fail to hear the echoes swirling around us because we're holding out for a particular guise and remain oblivious to its presence in our midst.

quote:

I also think this simple statement captures something that goes beyond just BDSM. It hints at the value and respect one has for their submissive or their Dominant beyond what they provide in terms of kink.

I believe it has less to do with the other party and truthfully centers on the security I've cultivated in the relationship and the real depth of trust I've placed in him. In my mind to allege that respect is lacking would call into question my decision-making and discernment in the mating process. Because I trust in my ability to select the right Keeper and wholeheartedly believe he's done the same, our collective desire for solidity and success would include mutual respect. This doesn't imply that fears are nonexistent. But one must be cognizant of the reality of serving two masters (that are not complimentary) and the inevitable clash that will occur. Either the ear is bent in his direction or my mind holds sway instead.

Namaste,

~porcelaine

_____________________________

His will; my fate.

(in reply to ThePeripatetic)

Post #: 2

RE: To take pride in... - 1/27/2011 1:30:48 AM

RCdc

Posts: 8674
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: ThePeripatetic

This post is inspired by and in praise of LadyPact and her sub, LPslittleclip.

I've read their forum signatures many times. LadyPact's reads, "Proud owner of LPslittleclip" and in turn, clip's reads, "proud slave of LadyPact". I never really thought twice about it until just recently. It suddenly dawned on me that their signature is actually a pretty profound statement about their relationship. It speaks volumes about their dynamic.

I believe the concept of "taking pride in..." is hugely important amidst a D/s relationship. From my perspective, as a submissive, one of my greatest fears is that my submission will be taken for granted, that it won't be respected by the One I'm serving. But hearing the words "I'm proud of you" quickly drowns out these fears. Those words give me the courage and the willpower to endure just about anything that comes my way.

I also think this simple statement captures something that goes beyond just BDSM. It hints at the value and respect one has for their submissive or their Dominant beyond what they provide in terms of kink. I'm sure most all of you would agree when I say that I want to be valued for much more than what I provide in the BDSM realm. I doubt many people would use the term "I'm proud of you" if they're only thinking about how this person brings them sexual fulfillment.

Anyway, I don't have any sort of question here. Just some musings. Feel free to contribute some thoughts. And thanks to LadyPact and clip for being such positive examples! Glad you two are doing well!

.

Pride is a wonderful thing, but at the same time people do look down on it as well as it can instil a sense of over inflated ego. Usually that stems from jealousy though.

I don't think people inform others enough about how much pride they feel for someone in everyday life (not speaking BDSM here). I've been incredibly fortunate to have had a constancy in my experience with it. However in a relationship setting such as I am blessed by, as Masters girl, it isn't my place to have a sense of 'pride' in another unless he instructs it and any sense of pride I do have, is His.

_____________________________

RC&dc

love isnt gazing into each others eyes - it's looking forward in the same direction

(in reply to ThePeripatetic)

Post #: 3

RE: To take pride in... - 1/27/2011 6:25:53 AM

OttersSwim

Posts: 2860
Joined: 9/1/2008
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quote:

ORIGINAL: RCdc

Pride is a wonderful thing, but at the same time people do look down on it as well as it can instil a sense of over inflated ego. Usually that stems from jealousy though.

I don't think people inform others enough about how much pride they feel for someone in everyday life (not speaking BDSM here). I've been incredibly fortunate to have had a constancy in my experience with it. However in a relationship setting such as I am blessed by, as Masters girl, it isn't my place to have a sense of 'pride' in another unless he instructs it and any sense of pride I do have, is His.

I highlighted this because I wonder if this is a distinction between a slave vs. submissive "way of thinking"? Or if it is more of a typical Male/female D/s relationship dynamic that differs from a typical Female/male D/s dynamic? And I hope that the Dark will forgive me for not remembering if you are in a Master/slave relationship, or a Dominant/submissive...or if those terms even apply for your dynamic.

For me, and my limited three-year exposure to the wonderful world of BDSM relationships, I typically see more pride in male submissives/slaves - outwardly expressed - than I have in female submissives/slaves. Not saying that females in D/s relationships do not have pride, but it seems more typical of the dynamic type for them to be more...demure...about it. I wonder if it is colored by the whole "male submissive is weak" stereotype...and thereby it becomes not only acceptable, but perhaps expected for a male in a D/s relationship to have more of that?

In a previous post, I likened the Female/male relationship to more often wanting a tiger at Her feet rather than a worm or a puppet (no girls, please don't read -anything- in to that!

). And that is partially how I see the male submissive/slave - in more of a "chained animal metaphor" where his -strength- is willingly subdued to Her...probably a lot of ying/yang thing going on there where female strength tends to flow underneath where male strength is more expressed on the surface...

Anywhooo...just some thoughts! I know that for the dynamic I have with my Lady, I certainly feel pride in service, and strength in it. And I feel no bounds on me to express that pride- and thus, the Dark's post contrasted my own feelings and I felt called to see what others feel.

Great topic!

_____________________________

I am on a journey of authenticity and self.

(in reply to RCdc)

Post #: 4

RE: To take pride in... - 1/27/2011 8:18:13 AM

RCdc

Posts: 8674
Status: offline

Hello Otter!

Our dynamic is one of Master/slave... but Master is not a person who enjoys me to speak in third person constantly... I think it tends to throw some people. He is very much that there is a time and place kinda thing.

I don't think there is a huge amount of difference due to it being Male led, rather than Female led. I think it's more just personal preference. I know of female property who are permitted pride and demur is a great word to use, but for Master, this is about His pride. In our relationship (and I am permitted to consider this as ours) my pride must come from a place that is about Him. He owns it and if He doesn't want pride manifesting, then it does not.(Not sure if I am making sense).

I'm more obedience driven, than service driven. I loathe failure and disappointment and my reaction to service is not to take pride in it but that it is expected... so maybe, Otter, that is where the difference comes in? (I don't know if you are service or obedience driven).

_____________________________

RC&dc

love isnt gazing into each others eyes - it's looking forward in the same direction

(in reply to OttersSwim)

Post #: 5

RE: To take pride in... - 1/27/2011 8:48:10 AM

leadership527

Posts: 5026
Joined: 6/2/2008
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quote:

ORIGINAL: OttersSwim
Not saying that females in D/s relationships do not have pride, but it seems more typical of the dynamic type for them to be more...demure...about it.

Well, I can say that in Carol's case it wouldn't occur to her to think of her submissive nature as something to be proud of. In her own words, "That'd be like being proud of my brown hair. I didn't do anything to get it." I feel the same way about my dominance. Until I actually DO something with it it's just a thing. When I actually DO something, then that thing might be something I'm proud of... or not.

I'm proud of the marriage I've built... as is Carol. Neither of us would be proud of our dominance or submission.

_____________________________

~Jeff

I didn't so much "enslave" Carol as I did "enlove" her. - Me
I want a joyous, loving, respectful relationship where the male is in charge and deserves to be. - DavanKael

(in reply to OttersSwim)

Post #: 6

RE: To take pride in... - 1/27/2011 9:18:43 AM

LadyPact

Posts: 32566
Status: offline

I want to thank the OP for starting this thread.

Yes, it is a simple line, but it means so many different things to Me. I am proud of him. He knows it and darn near everybody that I interact with knows it. There are multiple levels to it. Not just his service and submission to Me. (Not saying that isn't enough on it's own. It can be a pain in the ass at times being owned by Me.) It also covers what I think of him as a human being. The things that he does in his life and especially the way he treats other people. There are things that he does that, in truth, I don't have it in Me to do.

There is something more to it as well. Often, I think the misinformed stereotype about F/m or male submissives of the "lowly worm" type is out of proportion. A number of people who don't have exposure don't realize that a number of Dominant women don't see their submissives as some form of lower beings. (Not said against anybody if that's their particular kink.) That it looks differently than what they might have seen in porn or read in erotica. The truth is there really are female led dynamics out there where the male submissive is valued and cherished. It is one of the areas where I do believe that folks form a misconception between the genders.

_____________________________

The crowned Diva of Destruction. ~ ExT

Beach Ball Sized Lady Nuts. ~ TWD

Happily dating a new submissive. It's official. I've named him engie.

Please do not send me email here. Unless I know you, I will delete the email unread

(in reply to leadership527)

Post #: 7

RE: To take pride in... - 1/27/2011 10:47:37 AM

porcelaine

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Joined: 7/24/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: RCdc

but for Master, this is about His pride. In our relationship (and I am permitted to consider this as ours) my pride must come from a place that is about Him. He owns it and if He doesn't want pride manifesting, then it does not.(Not sure if I am making sense).

QFT. Well stated.

Namaste,

~porcelaine

_____________________________

His will; my fate.

(in reply to RCdc)

Post #: 8

RE: To take pride in... - 1/27/2011 2:07:11 PM

Nineveh

Posts: 1299
Joined: 2/5/2008
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quote:

ORIGINAL: leadership527

quote:

ORIGINAL: OttersSwim
Not saying that females in D/s relationships do not have pride, but it seems more typical of the dynamic type for them to be more...demure...about it.
Well, I can say that in Carol's case it wouldn't occur to her to think of her submissive nature as something to be proud of. In her own words, "That'd be like being proud of my brown hair. I didn't do anything to get it." I feel the same way about my dominance. Until I actually DO something with it it's just a thing. When I actually DO something, then that thing might be something I'm proud of... or not.

I'm proud of the marriage I've built... as is Carol. Neither of us would be proud of our dominance or submission.

What I see in the OP is appreciation at expression of pride in the relationship, rather than pride in the person's nature.

Pride in not only having a strong relationship, but in having one with someone worthy of being proud of being with.

(in reply to leadership527)

Post #: 9

RE: To take pride in... - 1/27/2011 4:59:00 PM

ThePeripatetic

Posts: 139
Joined: 12/21/2010
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Nineveh nailed it. My use of the word "pride" in this circumstance has nothing to do with pride regarding my identification as a submissive. The "pride" I'm referring to is being honored to serve the one I'm with. It's a reflection of the value and respect I have for the one I'm submitting to. It's also an acknowledgement that this person could probably have the pick of the litter yet She allows me to submit to Her. It's an honor to serve under those circumstances.

_____________________________

"The Journey is the Destination" - Dan Eldon (One of my heroes. R.I.P.)

(in reply to Nineveh)

Post #: 10

RE: To take pride in... - 1/27/2011 6:51:05 PM

agirl

Posts: 4530
Joined: 6/14/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: ThePeripatetic

Nineveh nailed it. My use of the word "pride" in this circumstance has nothing to do with pride regarding my identification as a submissive. The "pride" I'm referring to is being honored to serve the one I'm with. It's a reflection of the value and respect I have for the one I'm submitting to. It's also an acknowledgement that this person could probably have the pick of the litter yet She allows me to submit to Her. It's an honor to serve under those circumstances.

I might feel honoured if I'd been competing for some position and it meant something to me to gain that. It didn't and I wasn't.

I asked to be his because he was awfully good at what he does. I don't really think of it as an honour to be*allowed* to submit, anymore than I think it's any great *honour* to own me. It's what we chose and it is what it is.

We appreciate each other hugely but we don't *do* the proud and honoured thing as if either of us was doing the other some huge favour.

agirl

(in reply to ThePeripatetic)

Post #: 11

RE: To take pride in... - 1/27/2011 7:43:31 PM

TreasureKY

Posts: 3032
Joined: 4/10/2007
From: Kentucky
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: agirl

We appreciate each other hugely but we don't *do* the proud and honoured thing as if either of us was doing the other some huge favour.

The above portion resonates with me, though perhaps not in the same way it does for you.

Pride is an interesting concept, and one that I believe can be used in different ways. In this post, I am not referring to what I consider to be "boastful pride", but more the intense personal feelings related to worth.

Recently I posted that I am deeply affected by Firm's pride of possession of me. That is true, but for me, it is only true if his pride validates my own pride in myself. In other words, if he were proud of owning me, but I didn't feel that he had any particular reason to be proud... if I did not feel worthy of that pride... it would not have a positive affect on me.

To me, pride properly begins with me. It is my own pride that spurs me on to work hard to achieve whatever it is that I desire to achieve, and it is my own pride that leads me to give my all and do my best. My core behavior does not change whether I'm with someone or not. I am who I am because of me. Being able to be proud of myself makes me happy.

That affect can, however, be multiplied and heightened by recognition. When Firm takes pride in me (who I am, what I do, or how I do it), his recognition trips my trigger... which in turn deepens my own pride, increases my happiness, and fills me with a warmth of satisfaction.

But I don't want favors. If I felt that Firm's pride in me was falsely placed or superficial, it would depress me.

It also does not sit well with me the use of the word "honor". I do not belong to him because he deigned to choose me when he could have had anyone else. I deserved to be chosen by him... and my own pride will insist that I continue to deserve him. In the same respect, by virtue of who he is, he deserves the pride I have in him.

(in reply to agirl)

Post #: 12

RE: To take pride in... - 1/27/2011 8:24:05 PM

ThePeripatetic

Posts: 139
Joined: 12/21/2010
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Agirl... Perhaps the difference between your situation and what I've experienced is the relational dynamic between partners. To clarify, my personal experience was with a Domme who was older than I and happily married. There was little to no chance that it would develop into a "romantic" relationship (romantic isn't the right word here but I don't know what else to put). I was, quite simply, Her 'toy'.

I can see how the concepts of "pride" and "honor" would be different in a relationship where your with your life-partner. I'm looking at it from a different angle. In my case, my Domme could have played with any number of subs I'm sure. I felt very fortunate that She something of value in me.

So youre absolutely right, the pride factor may become more of an issue if there is a bit of competition in play. But isn't that kind of the case in any relationship? Unless you're dating the dregs of society aren't you competing against other individuals for the affection of your partner (at least in the initial stages of a relationship)?

< Message edited by ThePeripatetic -- 1/27/2011 8:27:39 PM >

_____________________________

"The Journey is the Destination" - Dan Eldon (One of my heroes. R.I.P.)

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Post #: 13

RE: To take pride in... - 1/27/2011 8:53:21 PM

lizi

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Joined: 2/1/2009
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I find that pride absolutely plays a big part in my relationship on both our sides. We are proud of each other and thankful that we have each others continued presence in our lives. For us, pride is a form of mutual respect.

On my side, knowing that he's proud of me gives me the biggest rush from head to toe. I do whatever I can to live up to him feeling that way about me. I want to be something he can be proud of, it gives me a goal to work for and makes me a better person in the end.

(in reply to ThePeripatetic)

Post #: 14

RE: To take pride in... - 1/27/2011 10:23:39 PM

LPslittleclip

Posts: 1163
Joined: 9/29/2007
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as my Mistress said i am proud to be owned by Her as the dynamic complements U/us in many diffrent ways. as stated before i am not a worm but a human being that enjoys the lifestyle and is in a benificial dynamic. i was very lucky in finding my MIstress as i was only looking to find a play partner to help me explore the lifestyle, i have been happily collared for over 3 years now. when i speak of Her my eyes do light up and i am very animated in descriptions about U/us. i happily give answeres to questions about U/us. as my Mistress and i always say there is no one way for the lifestyle. i dont know if the word pride is adequate to cover how i feel for my Mistress, humble happy delighted there are many that woud fit i do love my Mistress and i do know She loves me in return so beyond that what other words matter

_____________________________

proud to serve the awsome
LadyPact

(in reply to lizi)

Post #: 15

RE: To take pride in... - 2/5/2011 3:10:19 PM

agirl

Posts: 4530
Joined: 6/14/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: ThePeripatetic

Agirl... Perhaps the difference between your situation and what I've experienced is the relational dynamic between partners. To clarify, my personal experience was with a Domme who was older than I and happily married. There was little to no chance that it would develop into a "romantic" relationship (romantic isn't the right word here but I don't know what else to put). I was, quite simply, Her 'toy'.

I can see how the concepts of "pride" and "honor" would be different in a relationship where your with your life-partner. I'm looking at it from a different angle. In my case, my Domme could have played with any number of subs I'm sure. I felt very fortunate that She something of value in me.

So youre absolutely right, the pride factor may become more of an issue if there is a bit of competition in play. But isn't that kind of the case in any relationship? Unless you're dating the dregs of society aren't you competing against other individuals for the affection of your partner (at least in the initial stages of a relationship)?

Just saw your response and question, sorry for the delay in answering unless it was rhetorical...lol

Anyhow, No, is the answer to that. No, I wasn't competing in even the most basic sense ESPECIALLY in the initial stages. I might CARE a lot more later on but even so, I have zero interest in competition. Either I'm desireable as I am or someone else is more attractive to them, I see no point in competing in any way whatsoever.

agirl

(in reply to ThePeripatetic)

Post #: 16

RE: To take pride in... - 2/6/2011 7:25:31 AM

darkenchantment

Posts: 39
Joined: 10/21/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: LPslittleclip

as my Mistress said i am proud to be owned by Her as the dynamic complements U/us in many diffrent ways. as stated before i am not a worm but a human being that enjoys the lifestyle and is in a benificial dynamic. i was very lucky in finding my MIstress as i was only looking to find a play partner to help me explore the lifestyle, i have been happily collared for over 3 years now. when i speak of Her my eyes do light up and i am very animated in descriptions about U/us. i happily give answeres to questions about U/us. as my Mistress and i always say there is no one way for the lifestyle. i dont know if the word pride is adequate to cover how i feel for my Mistress, humble happy delighted there are many that woud fit i do love my Mistress and i do know She loves me in return so beyond that what other words matter

Very well said. My opinon would always be that we should take pride in the person we choose to spend our time with, whether that be in bdsm, D/s or M/s, or in vanilla life. Why would we want to spend time with someone we do not value? This talk which goes about, usually regarding male subs/slaves, but also regarding females, of being a 'worm; slut; bitch' etc, etc, is all very well used in playful terms, but if it is used as a genuine expression for the way someone regards another human being, or themselves, then I'm afraid I am concerned. Lack of ability to appreciate someone with whom we choose to spend important periods of our time reflects poorly I think, on us and our view of our own value, as well as theirs. For me, being able to feel proud of the person with whom I choose to spend my quality time is a recognition not only of her value, but also of my own.

_____________________________

There is no way to peace and happiness
Peace and happiness is the way.

(in reply to LPslittleclip)

Post #: 17

RE: To take pride in... - 2/6/2011 11:43:22 AM

chamberqueen

Posts: 1597
Joined: 10/25/2007
From: Kalamazoo, MI
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I remember reading once on another forum that a slave should never be proud of herself. I was stunned. I think that pride is a misunderstood emotion.

I take pride when I do my job well - whether it is scrubbing a toilet or doing something more personal. My Master takes pride in my every accomplishment, whether it is in something done for him or some personal or career growth.

I think that the thing that has taken me most by surprise is how often I feel truly proud of Him. There are still times when he just flat out amazes me. I have seen that it is often the perspective of the submissive that pride comes only from the top down - they might feel pride in being owned, for instance, or be truly most fulfilled when their owner is proud of them, but it is another emotion that can go both ways.

As my own journey has evolved, my Master said something to me recently about being proud that I was owned. I had lost touch with that feeling - not out of any disrespect, and certainly not out of any lack of fulfillment or joy in the relationship. In fact, it was the opposite. I understand my place better than ever and just see it as day to day business. I took the time to talk with him about why he would think that would make me feel proud so that I could have his perspective on it. In his mind, (and I am certainly not suggesting that this is universal), it was a reward for continuing loyalty and devotion, for always putting him first, and that as I walk through life I should shine with pride that I am his.

In this case being "proud" has nothing to do with being haughty. It is a beautiful gift that one person can give another - one of recognition, a stirring of emotion, and a gladness for what the other person is. Slaves (and many submissives) are expected to sacrifice a lot. To know that your owner is truly proud of you, and especially if they give you reason to be proud of them in return, is a wonderful gift I never expected when first entering my journey. I expected a small show of pride for a task well done, but when it becomes an intrinsic part of the journey it is nothing short of amazing.

_____________________________

(in reply to darkenchantment)

Post #: 18

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