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RE: To the whiners about incandescent light bulbs - 1/28/2011 9:22:52 AM   
DomKen


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quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

But damn...I want to see... the new energy efficient bulbs start slow and, at least to my eyes, watt for watt are no where as bright even when they build to maximum light output. My old eyes need incandescent light.

PS Long lived my ass...they cost 4 times as much and still burn out at an alarming rate. I really don't think they provide long term savings... so I will continue to whine thank you.

Butch

By every objective measure flourescents produce as much light as similiar rated incandescants while lasting between 4 and 10 times as long. If you really do find them that objectionable then get LED bulbs. They last 20+ times as long and are full spectrum lights.

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RE: To the whiners about incandescent light bulbs - 1/28/2011 10:21:55 AM   
kdsub


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen


By every objective measure flourescents produce as much light as similiar rated incandescants while lasting between 4 and 10 times as long. If you really do find them that objectionable then get LED bulbs. They last 20+ times as long and are full spectrum lights.


I'll bet you will find many people that will swear that a 60 watt incandescent is much brighter than a 60 watt CFL... If I could afford good LED's I would.

The CFL's are just a passing fad until the white LEDs can be made cheap...Even then you don't expect Sylvania, as an example, to produce cheap LEDs that will last 50 years do you? I mean they would put themselves out of business? No… bean counters will get out their calculators and figure profit by cost verses longevity and in the end it will cost more than the incandescent... AND increase the financial burden...chemical pollution...and poison our environment more then the status quo.

In my opinion anyway.

Butch


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RE: To the whiners about incandescent light bulbs - 1/28/2011 11:05:45 AM   
DomKen


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From: Chicago, IL
Status: offline 		LED's are already cheaper than equivalent incandescants if you take into account the lifetime of the bulbs and the difference in energy consumption.

Here's a 60 watt equivalent LED with a 50k hour lifespan that costs only $23
http://www.ledbulb.com/A19-LED-Lamp-p/a19-e26-5.2w-f.htm

< Message edited by DomKen -- 1/28/2011 11:06:10 AM >

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RE: To the whiners about incandescent light bulbs - 1/28/2011 11:39:05 AM   
kdsub


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

LED's are already cheaper than equivalent incandescants if you take into account the lifetime of the bulbs and the difference in energy consumption.

Here's a 60 watt equivalent LED with a 50k hour lifespan that costs only $23
http://www.ledbulb.com/A19-LED-Lamp-p/a19-e26-5.2w-f.htm



I can buy a 60 watt incandesent blub for 2 bucks that will have a 20K life span...now do the math

Butch

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RE: To the whiners about incandescent light bulbs - 1/28/2011 12:17:29 PM   
BenevolentM


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

[Compact flourescents] look the same, light the same, ..., but you'll never know the difference--they just use less energy.


The quality of light produced by the different technologies vary greatly. Halogen rules, florescent sucks. The quality of light produced by florescent bulbs is just awful and continues to be awful. The best way to turn a room into a basement is to install florescent lighting. If you want to destroy the look of your home, install florescent lighting outside.

If you can't tell the difference, you are seeing the world in black and white, that is you aren't paying much attention to the colors. The benefit conferred by florescent lighting is it makes it possible to flood a room with light without costing an arm and a leg to do it and without making everyone cook under the hot lamps at the same time. In this regard florescent lighting has a monopoly.

Actors often cook under the hot lamps because florescent lighting makes everyone and everything look ugly. If florescent lighting is so wonderful, then why don't photographers, artists, musicians, television studios, film makers, live theatre, and the like use it? Why have stores been moving away from the exclusive use of florescent lighting? Why do they bother with halogen lighting? Florescent lighting makes the merchandise look unappealing.

Our sun is not blue. It is illogical to use lighting that fails to mimic the color spectrum of our sun. Our visual system is not adapted to the sort of light produced by florescent lighting. Please notice that I said that florescent lighting continues to suck despite of the advances. Does anyone go to Hawaii to enjoy the bright florescent light bulb in the sky? If there was a bright florescent light bulb in the sky over Hawaii, the pictures would look really different and it would kill their tourist industry. In brief, florescent lighting is nasty.

If you were a porn star, would you insist on florescent lighting? So all of this interest in florescent lighting is the product of what seems logical to engineers and scientists.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam

So. what are ya sayin hunky? I sholud look at the fuckin thermometer and change the bulbs in My office day to day and hour to hour?


Why not? I'm not insulted by the prospect. What insults me is the prospect of having to use florescent lighting! and I think you're mistreating pahunkboy. It's not Dom to mistreat a submissive.

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RE: To the whiners about incandescent light bulbs - 1/28/2011 12:20:28 PM   
jlf1961


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Status: offline 		Actually, LED lighting is the most efficient and longest lasting, the only problem is finding the damn things.

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RE: To the whiners about incandescent light bulbs - 1/28/2011 12:21:37 PM   
mnottertail


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Status: offline 		Well, turn on the fuckin switch, dude, so you can see where they are.

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RE: To the whiners about incandescent light bulbs - 1/28/2011 12:29:52 PM   
pogo4pres


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quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

LED's are already cheaper than equivalent incandescants if you take into account the lifetime of the bulbs and the difference in energy consumption.

Here's a 60 watt equivalent LED with a 50k hour lifespan that costs only $23
http://www.ledbulb.com/A19-LED-Lamp-p/a19-e26-5.2w-f.htm



I can buy a 60 watt incandesent blub for 2 bucks that will have a 20K life span...now do the math

Butch




butch, a 20,000 hour incandescent for 2 bucks?  I do not think so, 2,000 yeah, but a 20,000 hour lamp?  Not bloody likely.  I've not seen anything much more than 2,500 hour life lamp at that price point. Based on a 2,500 hour life the cost of replacing the incandescent, or halogen lamps will run you about 50 bucks replacement cost, versus the LED lamp cost of 23 bucks.

Now figuring that you have a lamp on for 8 hours daily, you can expect 312.5 days of life for a 2,500 hour lamp.  Based on the same 8 hours a day number you can expect 6250 days of life from the LED lamp.  I'd say that is a pretty significant difference.  I ran the math and 6250 days = 17.2 YEARS.  Now I would guess a 6w LED lamp versus a 60w incandescent or halogen will also add at minimum 1000 dollars in energy savings over that 17 year life span.

To me those numbers make the 23 dollar initial cost of the LED seem pretty reasonable.  Were I running maintenance for any sized apartment complex,  I'd be seriously looking to LED lamps for any long term lighting application.


Electrically,
Some Knucklehead in NJ


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RE: To the whiners about incandescent light bulbs - 1/28/2011 12:47:50 PM   
kdsub


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Status: offline 		Nope do a search... I did...if you like I will list sites...but it is easy for you to search... 20,000Hr bulbs are cheap and easy to find.

Even more choices at 14k and many many at 10k at a $1.50 each

Butch

< Message edited by kdsub -- 1/28/2011 12:58:50 PM >

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I don't see any use in having a uniform and arbitrary way of spelling words. We might as well make all clothes alike and cook all dishes alike. Sameness is tiresome; variety is pleasing

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RE: To the whiners about incandescent light bulbs - 1/28/2011 1:00:03 PM   
Estring


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Status: offline 		I have an idea. How about everyone gets to buy whatever bulb they choose to, instead of making laws to restrict our choices? Now there's a bright idea!

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RE: To the whiners about incandescent light bulbs - 1/28/2011 1:29:53 PM   
DesFIP


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From: Apple County NY
Status: offline 		I was in Lowe's today looking at lightbulbs. They sell compact florescent bulbs which give off a daylight natural light. I haven't tried one yet since I still have some other cfls at home, but I'm betting they will be an improvement. 

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RE: To the whiners about incandescent light bulbs - 1/28/2011 1:33:51 PM   
jlf1961


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quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961

Actually, LED lighting is the most efficient and longest lasting, the only problem is finding the damn things.



Locally I have found them in only two stores, neither of which I frequent.

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Boy, it sure would be nice if we had some grenades, don't you think?

You cannot control who comes into your life, but you can control which airlock you throw them out of.

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RE: To the whiners about incandescent light bulbs - 1/28/2011 1:47:43 PM   
allthatjaz


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Status: offline 		LEDs are everywhere in the UK and are not at all expensive.

Because we live on a boat we are on low voltage and so LED's are perfect. We are not connected to the grid and so these are simply powered by a wind generator.

The disadvantage of LED is that the color temperature produces a very cold light but as the technology improves, so does the ability to produce a warm white LED. LED's last pretty much forever, the color temperature doesn't change as they age, they produce very little heat so very efficient. The only problem is, in domestic installations the efficiency of the step down transformers negates some of the savings made in using this sort of lighting.

< Message edited by allthatjaz -- 1/28/2011 1:49:12 PM >

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RE: To the whiners about incandescent light bulbs - 1/28/2011 1:52:07 PM   
pahunkboy


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Status: offline 		I wish the lightbulbs in my shoes would burn out.   I don't care for this "fashion".

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RE: To the whiners about incandescent light bulbs - 1/28/2011 1:55:51 PM   
DesFIP


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quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961


quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961

Actually, LED lighting is the most efficient and longest lasting, the only problem is finding the damn things.



Locally I have found them in only two stores, neither of which I frequent.


Either Home Depot or Lowes will have several variety to choose from. The local hardware store in town doesn't carry them however.


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RE: To the whiners about incandescent light bulbs - 1/28/2011 2:54:17 PM   
DomKen


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quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

LED's are already cheaper than equivalent incandescants if you take into account the lifetime of the bulbs and the difference in energy consumption.

Here's a 60 watt equivalent LED with a 50k hour lifespan that costs only $23
http://www.ledbulb.com/A19-LED-Lamp-p/a19-e26-5.2w-f.htm



I can buy a 60 watt incandesent blub for 2 bucks that will have a 20K life span...now do the math

Butch

How much do you pay per kilowatt/hour? The LED uses around 10 watts. That's a life time power savings of 2,500 kilowatt/hours. Which works out to be, based on my rate, a savings of $305 dollars over the lifetime of the bulb. So the incandescants will cost you about $310 more.

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RE: To the whiners about incandescent light bulbs - 1/28/2011 4:10:14 PM   
Termyn8or


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Status: offline 		"They last 20+ times as long and are full spectrum lights. "

No they're not. They, as well as any flourescent are made to appear to be full spectrum by the distribution of wavelengths. For a poorman's spectrometer, try a CD. Yes those old music CDs. When you see the rainbow switch the light source(s) and you'll see it for yourself.

As such CFLs cannot be used for example, in DLP TV sets. It would be great if they could. The bulbs used in normal LCD TVs have a special phospour which aligns the primary colors' wavelengths with NTSC colorimetry. DLPs have corrected the remaining errors by using five (approx) colors rather than the normal three.

People's perception of the color spectrum differs, and that has nothing to do with the flicker. Some say the color(s) of object(s) look(s) different. Like when Lakewood, Ohio switched to narrow band vapor streetlights, alot of people had trouble telling what color the cars were. The proper wavelengths have to be there to reflect or admit.

For people with these "problems" maybe incandescent is the way to go, at their own expense of course.

T^T

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RE: To the whiners about incandescent light bulbs - 1/28/2011 4:27:11 PM   
Termyn8or


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Status: offline 		"The disadvantage of LED is that the color temperature produces a very cold light but as the technology improves, so does the ability to produce a warm white LED. LED's last pretty much forever, "

A warm light LED is a piece of cake. Red and green make it warm. Blue LEDs came out later, they were alot more difficult to produce because of the shorter wavelength. Mixed dopants with a thinner outer layer makes the white LED.

And LEDs are usually long lasting, but they do not last forever. What's more they are usually small, and the most efficient way to make an array which is required for a viable output is to put them in series. Thus, like the old style Christmas tree bulbs, if one goes out the whole array is shot.

T^T

< Message edited by Termyn8or -- 1/28/2011 4:30:39 PM >

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RE: To the whiners about incandescent light bulbs - 1/28/2011 4:49:19 PM   
ThatDamnedPanda


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Estring

I have an idea. How about everyone gets to buy whatever bulb they choose to, instead of making laws to restrict our choices? Now there's a bright idea!


How about you buy a mule, a musket, an axe, and some flints, and move to the mountains where you won't have to do anything anyone tells you, ever again, as long as you shall live? There's an even brighter idea.

Or, if you choose to stay where you are and continue to enjoy the benefits of living in a semi-advanced, putatively civilized society, how about you stop bitching about the tradeoffs that are a part of that bargain?

American conservatives need to grow the fuck up and stop their selfish, infantile whining. Fossil fuels are a finite resource, and Americans do not have a god-given right to burn as much of these finite resources as they want with no regard for the consequences. Did you never see "Mad Max?" The government regulations that moderate energy consumption are basically intended solely to save your whiny, ungrateful asses from having to live in that kind of a future, and instead of a mature "Gee, thank you, that's a good idea," all you characters can think of to spew out is, "Wahh, wahh, wahh, I wanna choose my own lightbulbs!!!"

Jesus fucking christ, please - please - deliver me from my fellow fucking Americans. Soon as possible, please. Kthnx.


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RE: To the whiners about incandescent light bulbs - 1/28/2011 6:49:30 PM   
allthatjaz


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Termyn8or

A warm light LED is a piece of cake. Red and green make it warm. Blue LEDs came out later, they were alot more difficult to produce because of the shorter wavelength. Mixed dopants with a thinner outer layer makes the white LED.




But as far as I'm aware, they haven't made that as a single chip device yet. We can make one up ourselves but a lot of people aren't go to be bothered with the hassle.

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