Where is the Goddess in spirituality? (Full Version)

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Charles6682 -> Where is the Goddess in spirituality? (1/28/2011 4:08:08 PM)

I am curious.Most of the religions here in America and I assume in other parts of the World,focus on the Male God only.God is always referred to as Him.I know Goddess spirituality has been slowly making its way for the past few decades.Now when I mention the word Goddess,I am referring to a spiritual form of the Goddess.I guess you could say "Gods" female half.I am not referring to Goddess as it may relate to the BDSM world.I am not talking about any Women as a Goddess,although there are certainly some Women would could be considered a Goddess!

I know there are a few modern religions that do mention the Goddess.Paganism and Wicca to name a few.However,outside of the "Earth centered"spirituality,the term Goddess is rarely mentioned.The mainstream religions hardly even mention the term.

Why does mainstream society still seem to deny any level of a "Female" God?Is it because we are perhaps still in a Patriarchy and men just think this way?There have been some people who claim that in the earlier times of humanity,Women and Men both use to believe in a Goddess and a God.Although,many "historians" claim there is no concrete proof.Perhaps they are right,who knows.However,many of these historians tend to be Men who I suspect,still has a view of some form of Patriarchy and they wish to preserve that thinking.They claim any form of Goddess worship in the past,is nothing more than "wishful thinking".

I just find it hard to believe that God is all "He".I would think that there should be some balance when it comes to spirituality.



gungadin09 -> RE: Where is the Goddess in spirituality? (1/28/2011 4:32:15 PM)

Well, i can't find my book, but i think the original idea of "Goddess" comes from ancient history and pagan religion. Before people understood that males play a role in procreation, they believed that females created life all on their own. That gave rise to the cult of the "Goddess". If i understand correctly, human civilization was matriarchal for thousands of years.

Eventually, humans discovered the male reproductive role, and females were shifted to the background. Society and religion became patriarchal and has mostly stayed that way ever since. In modern times, a few throwbacks to the matriarchy still survive, such as the Mother Mary, Valentines Day, and the Biblical story of Jezebel. Also, i think the Wiccan practices emphasize a return back to the martiarchy. Look it up if you're interested.

pam



Chulain -> RE: Where is the Goddess in spirituality? (1/28/2011 4:32:57 PM)

The Virgin Mary is a goddess of the Catholic church, a polytheistic religion if ever there was one.



DarkSteven -> RE: Where is the Goddess in spirituality? (1/28/2011 4:50:31 PM)

Good question.

The Jewish religion pioneered monotheism.  The Jewish God is considered male, but vaguely so.  I have the impression that He is also considered above gender at times.  He is referred to with a masculine pronoun, but I don't know if that's due to translation.

Christianity fused this God with His son, and obviously Jesus was masculine.

Mormonism has both men and women as Gods in the afterlife, although the male Gods are clearly over the female ones.

There are both male and female Hindu Gods, similar to the pantheon of Greek Gods.



KenDckey -> RE: Where is the Goddess in spirituality? (1/28/2011 5:16:39 PM)

Personal Conjecture:    I think that it is because back when who know when  Men dominated women in life.   They were the hunter gatherers.  They were considered the head of everything.  Women were subject to their whims.  

I think it carried forward from that concept to the present day.



Tantriqu -> RE: Where is the Goddess in spirituality? (1/28/2011 5:47:19 PM)

Lol, are you kidding? Read about Ba'al, Astarte, Lilith, Inanna, Ishtar, Hathor, Nut, Caribou woman, White Buffalo Calf Woman, Maya, Devi, Shakti, Mary, Eostre [the fertility goddess we worship every Easter with eggs, ham and flowers] then come back to the thread.
Most of these are dual incarnations of Mother, Preserver, Destroyer, no beginning, no end.
And here's the nifty part, just like real life, the masculine complements and requires the feminine. Yin and yang.
Any religion relegating females to a lower order is doomed to a too-slow and painful death; that's part of why Atheism is the fastest rising belief system, as more people become literate and humanist, and less sexist and racist.
And in the meantime, worship the Venus of Willendorf instead of women who look like your high-school buddy with breast implants and hairweaves.



Chulain -> RE: Where is the Goddess in spirituality? (1/28/2011 5:56:37 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Tantriqu
that's part of why Atheism is the fastest rising belief system, as more people become literate and humanist, and less sexist and racist.

Gosh, I hope that's true. Sadly, I am not as certain as you are.



Aylee -> RE: Where is the Goddess in spirituality? (1/28/2011 7:01:34 PM)

Where is the Goddess in spirituality?

Wherever she wants to be.  That is why SHE is the Goddess.



allthatjaz -> RE: Where is the Goddess in spirituality? (1/28/2011 7:01:37 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Charles6682


I know there are a few modern religions that do mention the Goddess.Paganism and Wicca to name a few.ality.


Just a little correction here Charles. Paganism was around long before Christianity. Some say that Paganism is as old as man kind.
When the Christians came along they converted most Pagans by borrowing the Pagan festivals and calling them Christian ones. Those that wouldn't convert were called witches and burnt at the stake. For hundreds of years Pagans had to keep their religion secret but now its back and its growing at a rapid rate of knots.
Perhaps that's why your mistaking it as a new fad.



dcnovice -> RE: Where is the Goddess in spirituality? (1/28/2011 7:15:25 PM)

quote:

Atheism is the fastest rising belief system, as more people become literate and humanist, and less sexist and racist.


Nope, no bias here.



Termyn8or -> RE: Where is the Goddess in spirituality? (1/28/2011 7:36:47 PM)

"Why does mainstream society still seem to deny any level of a "Female" God?"

I did explain that, but got shot down by people who have apparently studied religions with perhaps fifty members in the world.

It is true though, that masculinity has been associated with strength, and therefore power. It's a psychological thing. In fact I think that female dominance and male submission are an inversion of the classic views. The reasons are many, and are logical. However I no longer speak of this in the forum. That would come close to hijacking your thread because too many "enlightened" folk do not understand and would argue the point ad nauseum, like last time.

If you want my detailed opinion shoot me a mail. In fact if you wish to quote parts of it, and can't because of TOS I'll do it myself, actually retype it. But once you've read it, the question will evaporate as long as you can handle it.

And the short answer is : The Godess is cooking me some food.

T^T



tweakabelle -> RE: Where is the Goddess in spirituality? (1/28/2011 7:44:14 PM)

This is a wee bit off thread but IMHO interesting and related nonetheless.

One of my students did a thesis examining the social status of transgender* people across various cultures. Her main finding was that monotheistic societies tended to punish and marginalise transgender people while OTOH polytheistic societies tended to treated them with respect and generosity.

To me, this suggests our understandings of gender and religion/deities are inter-related at multiple levels.

* I am using transgender very loosely here to refer to any gender role outside the standard Western monogenders of masculine and feminine.


Edited to add extra lipstick [:D]



Chulain -> RE: Where is the Goddess in spirituality? (1/28/2011 7:48:35 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: dcnovice
quote:

Atheism is the fastest rising belief system, as more people become literate and humanist, and less sexist and racist.

Nope, no bias here.

What are you implying, that atheists as a general rule are not less racist and sexist, and are not more educated, than adherents of major religions?

Is that what you're implying?



FukinTroll -> RE: Where is the Goddess in spirituality? (1/28/2011 7:50:44 PM)

The search is over! I found her!

http://www.collarme.com/personals/v/986408/details.htm



chiaThePet -> RE: Where is the Goddess in spirituality? (1/28/2011 7:58:23 PM)


Her Highness of all things feminine, is in the boudoir, softly inquiring,

"Where the hell are my Bon-Bons and Cosmopolitan you worthless..............!!!!"

chia* (the pet)



VaguelyCurious -> RE: Where is the Goddess in spirituality? (1/28/2011 8:00:04 PM)

Haha! You're a sweetie, Mr Troll.

But I'm no goddess. I'm too short, for one thing.



FukinTroll -> RE: Where is the Goddess in spirituality? (1/28/2011 8:01:30 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: VaguelyCurious

Haha! You're a sweetie, Mr Troll.

But I'm no goddess. I'm too short, for one thing.


PFFFFTTTTTTTT!!!!! I lust for you unmercifully my wee lil goddess.

SLURP!



dcnovice -> RE: Where is the Goddess in spirituality? (1/28/2011 8:06:41 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Chulain

quote:

ORIGINAL: dcnovice
quote:

Atheism is the fastest rising belief system, as more people become literate and humanist, and less sexist and racist.

Nope, no bias here.

What are you implying, that atheists as a general rule are not less racist and sexist, and are not more educated, than adherents of major religions?

Is that what you're implying?



I'm not implying anything. I'm saying that the sentence struck me as reflecting a strong bias that atheists are superior to others: more literate, more humanist, less racist, less sexist. Moreover, the sentence seemed to be saying that atheism is the logical outcome of becoming less sexist and racist.

I have no earthly idea whether athiests are, for instance, more or less racist than the ministers and church folk who were the backbone of the Civil Rights movement. How would one even begin to measure something like that?



Chulain -> RE: Where is the Goddess in spirituality? (1/28/2011 8:11:52 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: dcnovice
I'm not implying anything. I'm saying that the sentence struck me as reflecting a strong bias that atheists are superior to others: more literate, more humanist, less racist, less sexist. Moreover, the sentence seemed to be saying that atheism is the logical outcome of becoming less sexist and racist.

You inferred the latter. The former (that atheism is, as a general rule, less sexist,  etc.) is probably true. What's yer beef?

quote:

I have no earthly idea whether athiests are, for instance, more or less racist than the ministers and church folk who were the backbone of the Civil Rights movement. How would one even begin to measure something like that?

Think about the intolerant attitudes espoused by major religions, the primary one being "If you're not like us, something's wrong and we need to fix you or kill you." Not universal, but rather prevalent.



gungadin09 -> RE: Where is the Goddess in spirituality? (1/28/2011 8:24:57 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Charles6682

I am curious.Most of the religions here in America and I assume in other parts of the World,focus on the Male God only.God is always referred to as Him.

Why does mainstream society still seem to deny any level of a "Female" God?

Is it because we are perhaps still in a Patriarchy and men just think this way?

I just find it hard to believe that God is all "He".I would think that there should be some balance when it comes to spirituality.


There are various religions that practice Goddess worship, or worship both gods and goddesses. You mentioned several such yourself.

A few people have already said that even some strongly patriarchal religions, such as Catholicism, have matriachal components to them.

If you're asking why society is patriarchal, the answer is history. As far as i know, most civilizations became patriachal once they discovered the male role in reproduction, and have remained so ever since. It's sort of an inertia thing, i guess. Once a society's thinking patterns are established, it takes a great deal to change them.

If you're asking why the various religions that are patriarchal are so, the answer is because God (whoever He or She is) says so. Or, at least, because the practitioners of those religions believe that God says so. i'm not religious myself, but i believe that most people who are are because they think it's what God wants from them. And God (if there is a God) gets to be the One to say if He's male or female, if He (or She) is single, or one of many, and what His (or Her) religious doctrine is. i would imagine that, as far as God is concerned, the terms of His religion are non-negotiable.

Or, in other words, if there is a God He probably doesn't much care whether you think His religion is matriarchal enough.

But if you see religion as something that you can choose, then by all means choose the one that best fits your needs.

pam




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