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Religion may become extinct in nine nations, study says - 3/24/2011 1:10:41 PM   
Brain


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It’s remarkable in other countries which are like the United States religion is becoming less popular but in America religion has taken over the Republican Party and it’s trying to reverse social and scientific progress.


Religion may become extinct in nine nations, study says

A study using census data from nine countries shows that religion there is set for extinction, say researchers.

"It posits that social groups that have more members are going to be more attractive to join, and it posits that social groups have a social status or utility.
Dr Wiener continued: "In a large number of modern secular democracies, there's been a trend that folk are identifying themselves as non-affiliated with religion; in the Netherlands the number was 40%, and the highest we saw was in the Czech Republic, where the number was 60%."

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-12811197





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RE: Religion may become extinct in nine nations, study ... - 3/24/2011 1:11:42 PM   
mnottertail


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Status: offline 		too much, brain too much learn to use a governor.   this is dee do dee do shit. 

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RE: Religion may become extinct in nine nations, study ... - 3/24/2011 2:06:24 PM   
Termyn8or


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Status: offline 		People of the US : "PICK ME PICK ME".

Please. Get this eigth century shit out of the way.

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RE: Religion may become extinct in nine nations, study ... - 3/24/2011 7:33:05 PM   
popeye1250


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Status: offline 		Wouldn't it be nice if some of those countries were Saudi Arabia, Iran, Yemen and Egypt!

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RE: Religion may become extinct in nine nations, study ... - 3/24/2011 7:35:05 PM   
dcnovice


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quote:

Religion may become extinct in nine nations, study says


I wouldn't wait up nights.

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it's never enough to keep up.

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RE: Religion may become extinct in nine nations, study ... - 3/24/2011 10:31:48 PM   
tweakabelle


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Status: offline 		"Religion may become extinct in nine nations"


hmmmm ... I'm a-praying it comes true soon!

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RE: Religion may become extinct in nine nations, study ... - 3/24/2011 10:53:41 PM   
Fellow


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Status: offline 		How exactly is religion trying to reverse social and scientific progress? Religion has been supporting science thousands of years.

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RE: Religion may become extinct in nine nations, study ... - 3/24/2011 11:10:09 PM   
Hippiekinkster


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Fellow

How exactly is religion trying to reverse social and scientific progress? Religion has been supporting science thousands of years.
Yeah, right, tell it to Galileo.

I'm with Tweakabelle. Buddhism's cool, Hinduism's OK, but the Middle-eastern Abrahamic Tri-plague needs to go the way of the Greek Gods.


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RE: Religion may become extinct in nine nations, study ... - 3/24/2011 11:20:43 PM   
Termyn8or


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Status: offline 		"How exactly is religion trying to reverse social and scientific progress? Religion has been supporting science thousands of years."

Thanks for the laugh.

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RE: Religion may become extinct in nine nations, study ... - 3/24/2011 11:27:39 PM   
fmfclwu


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Status: offline 		While it would not be surprising to see religion shrinking in these countries, this model makes some overly simplistic assumptions.  They work well for modeling some types of social behaviors, but one of them in particular is the assumption that everyone in your society has roughly equal influence over your social decisions.  This may not be a bad way to model the behavior of future fashion trends, for example, but given the influence parents have over their children when choosing a religion, it is clearly a pretty weak assumption on the topic of religion.

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RE: Religion may become extinct in nine nations, study ... - 3/24/2011 11:32:36 PM   
willbeurdaddy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: fmfclwu

While it would not be surprising to see religion shrinking in these countries, this model makes some overly simplistic assumptions.  They work well for modeling some types of social behaviors, but one of them in particular is the assumption that everyone in your society has roughly equal influence over your social decisions.  This may not be a bad way to model the behavior of future fashion trends, for example, but given the influence parents have over their children when choosing a religion, it is clearly a pretty weak assumption on the topic of religion.


Fair warning: If its an OP by Brain it HAS to be simplistic.

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RE: Religion may become extinct in nine nations, study ... - 3/24/2011 11:35:53 PM   
fmfclwu


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Hippiekinkster


quote:

ORIGINAL: Fellow

How exactly is religion trying to reverse social and scientific progress? Religion has been supporting science thousands of years.
Yeah, right, tell it to Galileo.

I'm with Tweakabelle. Buddhism's cool, Hinduism's OK, but the Middle-eastern Abrahamic Tri-plague needs to go the way of the Greek Gods.



Actually, until about the Industrial Revolution, the Catholic Church at least was a pretty big patron of the sciences - it was viewed as a way to better understand God by better understanding the Universe.  While the Church occasionally seemed to take sides in scientific disputes (such as the geocentric vs heliocentric models of the Solar System), this was less a kneejerk reaction against science than a political maneuver to satisfy patrons of the Church who happened to be Galileo's rivals.  It wasn't until relatively recent times that certain religions (particularly evangelical Christianity in the United States) have made science an opponent to religion and actively worked to subvert common scientific theories.

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RE: Religion may become extinct in nine nations, study ... - 3/25/2011 12:17:01 AM   
Termyn8or


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Status: offline 		Silly, that was back when the Earth was flat.

You know God is a real MF. He supposedly put forth beautiful horny Women to all the corners of the world, and then made it round !

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RE: Religion may become extinct in nine nations, study ... - 3/25/2011 1:19:28 AM   
Fellow


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Status: offline 		To my understanding religion and science are not in conflict. They exist side by side. Many well known scientists are religious.  Theists reject some science theories, but today there is no serious "reversal of science" by religion. I do not know any examples. Religion is a choice by believers. It would be an atheist dream (something to fight against) if something like this would take place. This little creationism vs. Darwin theory discussion is not solely religion vs. science debate. Many scientists reject Neo-Darwinism as well.  Embryo research restrictions are beyond religion, more to do how different people understand general universal ethics.

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RE: Religion may become extinct in nine nations, study ... - 3/25/2011 3:59:01 AM   
Sanity


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Disputes between politically minded scientists are as troublesome today, look at how the Global Warming faithful conspire to destroy the careers of any scientists who fail to worship the teachings of the hierarchy

Al Gore holds sway over leftists in the manner the pope used to sway Catholics in my opinion, he is the new pope

Global Warming industrialists such as GE are quietly pulling a lot of strings from behind the curtain, as well. So the same kinds of old power plays are still being effected in the modern world, very little has changed in that regard

quote:

ORIGINAL: fmfclwu

Actually, until about the Industrial Revolution, the Catholic Church at least was a pretty big patron of the sciences - it was viewed as a way to better understand God by better understanding the Universe.  While the Church occasionally seemed to take sides in scientific disputes (such as the geocentric vs heliocentric models of the Solar System), this was less a kneejerk reaction against science than a political maneuver to satisfy patrons of the Church who happened to be Galileo's rivals.  It wasn't until relatively recent times that certain religions (particularly evangelical Christianity in the United States) have made science an opponent to religion and actively worked to subvert common scientific theories.



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RE: Religion may become extinct in nine nations, study ... - 3/25/2011 4:33:19 AM   
tweakabelle


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity


Disputes between politically minded scientists are as troublesome today, look at how the Global Warming faithful conspire to destroy the careers of any scientists who fail to worship the teachings of the hierarchy

Al Gore holds sway over leftists in the manner the pope used to sway Catholics in my opinion, he is the new pope

Global Warming industrialists such as GE are quietly pulling a lot of strings from behind the curtain, as well. So the same kinds of old power plays are still being effected in the modern world, very little has changed in that regard


I knew it! I knew it! I knew it! I knew it all along! I could feel it in my bones. But thanks so much for revealing it anyways Sanity. We owe you a debt Brother Sanity.

Another sinister leftist conspiracy is uncovered. Unmasked are Pope Al, in league with those nasty Multi-Nationals (GE, Toyota, etc you know who they are ...) and Scientists with Atheistic Agendas (card carrying, die hard commies to a man, their white coats are really red). These fanatics will stop at nothing to take away your guns, your daughters, your God-given freedoms and redistribute your Godly wealth.

The final piece in this dastardly jigsaw will shortly fall into place as the devious role of the NWO and the Illuminati is exposed in a Beck special to be aired soon.

If any further proof is required, aluminium futures ticked down yesterday for the 4th day in a row ...... need I say more?

What's a good God-fearing, tax-hating, tea bag addicted righteous and right leaning American to do? Stay tuned to Fox, you know where they stand. Retreat and Reload, Keep the Good Book close and consult it at all times, Be Careful, Be Prepared and BE ARMED! Avoid cliches at all costs and Await the Word ......(code word: Rapture)

Meanwhile, back in the real world ...........


Edited in accordance with the J Edgar Hoover Institute for Research into Paranoid Delusions' guidelines

< Message edited by tweakabelle -- 3/25/2011 4:41:58 AM >

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RE: Religion may become extinct in nine nations, study ... - 3/25/2011 4:45:11 AM   
Sanity


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Certain of these religious fundamentalists tend to get really tweaked if one dares to challenge their dogma

quote:

ORIGINAL: tweakabelle

I knew it! I knew it! I knew it! I knew it all along! I could feel it in my bones. But thanks so much for revealing it anyways Sanity. We owe you a debt Brother Sanity.

Another sinister leftist conspiracy is uncovered. Unmasked are Pope Al, in league with those nasty Multi-Nationals (GE, Toyota, etc you know who they are ...) and Scientists with Atheistic Agendas (card carrying, die hard commies to a man, their white coats are really red). These fanatics will stop at nothing to take away your guns, your daughters, your God-given freedoms and redistribute your Godly wealth.

The final piece in this dastardly jigsaw will shortly fall into place as the devious role of the NWO and the Illuminati is exposed in a Beck special to be aired soon.

If any further proof is required, aluminium futures ticked down yesterday for the 4th day in a row ...... need I say more?

What's a good God-fearing, tax-hating, tea bag addicted righteous and right leaning American to do? Stay tuned to Fox, you know where they stand. Retreat and Reload, Keep the Good Book close and consult it at all times, Be Careful, Be Prepared and BE ARMED! Avoid cliches at all costs and Await the Word ......(code word: Rapture)

Meanwhile, back in the real world ...........


Edited in accordance with the J Edgar Hoover Institute for Research into Paranoid Delusions' guidelines


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RE: Religion may become extinct in nine nations, study ... - 3/25/2011 6:32:41 AM   
DarkSteven


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Status: offline 		Ridiculous.

As a techie, I wanted to see what analysis method produced this result.  From the article: "Their means of analysing the data invokes what is known as nonlinear dynamics - a mathematical approach that has been used to explain a wide range of physical phenomena in which a number of factors play a part."

I tried to Google "nonlinear dynamics" and found that, contrary to what the article stated, nonlinear dynamics is NOT an analysis method but instead a class of problems, for which several analysis methods exist.

So the article could be translated to "A bunch of scientists dd an analysis using methods that we cannot understand or explain and somehow determined that religion will die out".

Ignoring the indefensible analysis that has been done, then, the question then becomes "If a country sees the number of inhabitants which self-identify as religious decrease, what will happen?"  Due to my understanding of analysis, I will especially look for factors that the analysts overlooked,. such as external forces.  Due to the advanced nature of the countries, I will postulate that having a religion's adherents forcibly expelled is not going to happen.  The only forces are:

1. Inhabitants getting or leaving religion.
2. Voluntary immigration or emigration.

I postulate that the current trend (people leaving religion)  will continue to a certain point.  At that point, missionary religions such as the Mormon church will see the country as a fertile ground for converts.  Even if the religion is officially banned from proselytizing (as the Mormons were in mainland China and maybe still are), I expect one or two religions to simply send several dozen members to the country.  Once there, they will establish a church and mingle with the locals, and inevitably some locals will convert...








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RE: Religion may become extinct in nine nations, study ... - 3/25/2011 9:56:57 AM   
LaTigresse


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Status: offline 		Exactly.

As much as I dislike organized religioun.......it fits too well with the human psyche, to ever become extinct.

People cannot help themselves, they want to believe in magic.


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RE: Religion may become extinct in nine nations, study ... - 3/25/2011 2:30:46 PM   
Palliata


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Brain

Dr Wiener continued: "In a large number of modern secular democracies, there's been a trend that folk are identifying themselves as non-affiliated with religion; in the Netherlands the number was 40%, and the highest we saw was in the Czech Republic, where the number was 60%."


This number is actually probably lower than reality - many Czechs are only religious in the loosest, most Deistic sense. They don't go to church or believe in personal faith, but instead have a vague idea that there may be or have been in the past a higher power. They may well still identify as Catholic or Orthodox for surveys, but they have no real connection either the church or the dogmatic basis thereof, and the younger generation has a much higher incidence of true atheism or agnosticism than their parents did.

This is especially ironic because Prague, the capital, is called the City of a Thousand Spires because it is packed full of historical churches - beautiful and majestic, but empty and unused.


< Message edited by Palliata -- 3/25/2011 2:32:25 PM >

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