The tangled web in Wisconsin (Full Version)

All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> Dungeon of Political and Religious Discussion



Message


tazzygirl -> The tangled web in Wisconsin (4/3/2011 9:58:03 AM)

Watching the political wheeling and dealing in Wisconsin has become a fascination for me. A comedy of errors is the most appropriate term I could find.

For example, Senate Majority Leader Scott Fitzgerald, the one who ordered the state police to arrest the Democrats to be lawfully forced to return? Well, seems his father, Stephen Fiztgerald runs the State Patrol. Nice family connection.

The same Majority Leader was warned told he would be oh "shakey grouonds" if he tried to force them to return by attorneys from at three state agencies.

But he acknowledged the efforts to return the senators to Madison came off as "comical" and would have become a public relations "disaster" if any lawmakers had been hauled back to Madison in a squad car.

"The whole thing was a mess," Fitzgerald said. "You just can't compel a senator to come back to the chamber."

He said the reality was brought home when police agencies refused to carry out his March 3 order to forcibly detain the senators. Among them was Rock County Sheriff Robert Spoden, who said his department would not honor any order to bring in Sen. Tim Cullen,

D-Janesville.

Said Fitzgerald: "There was no cop in the state that would enforce it."


Comical... a good word.

"It would appear that Section 15 prevents us from ‘arresting' or ‘physically forcing' a member to attend," Richard wrote in an email to attorneys at the two legislative service agencies and John Hogan, Fitzgerald's chief of staff. "It now seems that monetary penalties and removal of privileges may be our only recourse with this resolution."

Nevertheless, four days later, Fitzgerald once again sent troopers from the State Patrol, which is run by his father, Stephen Fitzgerald, to senators' homes.

On March 3, two weeks after the walkout, Fitzgerald ratcheted up the pressure. He called his 18 Republican colleagues into session, and when the Democrats did not return by 4 p.m., the Republicans found them in "contempt of the Senate." Fitzgerald ordered that the Democrats be "forcibly detained" if they stepped foot in Wisconsin.

That day, Fitzgerald and his private attorney, James Troupis, sounded confident in Fitzgerald's legal authority to bring the errant senators back to Madison. Troupis cited a constitutional provision that allows the Senate to "compel the attendance of absent members."

The Senate resolution authorized Blazel to use force and enlist the help of law enforcement to bring in the missing members. Troupis explained that detention was not an "arrest" because the senators were not suspected of any crimes.

When Fitzgerald tried to have the order to detain put out on the statewide system that officers use to check for arrest warrants it drew the attention of the state Department of Justice, which urged the Senate to back down.

"We would strongly recommend that you attempt to get the Senate's Order to Detain out of the system, i.e. to the extent possible indicate publicly that it has been withdrawn so that law enforcement do not rely upon it and attempt to enforce it, thereby creating unnecessary liability exposure to them and the state," Kevin Potter, an assistant attorney general, said in a March 4 email.

The email response from Troupis, three hours later, was defiant: "We are not withdrawing the Order."

The effort ended March 9 after Fitzgerald removed certain "fiscal" items from the bill that had required a 20-vote majority, and it quickly passed the Senate. Implementation of the law - which strips most collective bargaining rights from most public employees in Wisconsin - is now stalled in a court battle.

Fitzgerald said he doesn't regret trying to force the Democratic senators back but "I certainly understand it was futile."

"Every time we made a move it was always something that you in your wildest dreams never that you'd be involved with," Fitzgerald said. "The discussions we had were incredible, almost surreal.

"They characterize me as some evil overbearing guy who was trying to do all these dirty tricks. We were just trying to do the best we could ... to figure out how to get these things back on track - get the Senate back."


http://lacrossetribune.com/news/local/8ad2476a-5dac-11e0-95fb-001cc4c002e0.html

So while they were talking, through email, about what to do or not to do, what was legal and what the state police would or wouldnt do, while arguing with the state DOJ, they now want us to believe they were working within teh spirit of the law for the best efforts for Wisconsin to get the Senate "back on track".

Damn those pesky emails.

As far as the union law itself... its on hold for two months. I was wondering why these politicians believed they could circumvent a court order, until I read the above. The arrogance of these people knows no bounds.


Wisconsin's polarizing union rights law is on hold for about two months after a judge said Friday that a restraining order blocking it will stay in place she while considers whether Republicans passed it illegally.

Republicans had been pushing the law through despite a boycott by Democratic state senators and weeks of protests that drew as many as 85,000 people to the state Capitol. But they suffered a defeat Thursday when the same judge declared the law was not enacted last week as Republicans had claimed.


Dane County Circuit Judge Maryann Sumi on Friday extended indefinitely a temporary restraining order preventing the secretary of state from putting the law in effect. She is considering a lawsuit that says Republican lawmakers didn't provide the proper public notice when they convened a special committee to amend the plan before its passage. The state has appealed the order to the Wisconsin Supreme Court, but the court has not indicated whether it will take the case and has no deadline for making a decision.

Republicans could try to get around the issue by passing the bill again, but party leaders said again Friday they have no plans to do that.


Now they are accusing the Judge of being an "activist".


"We passed the law correctly, legally the first time," Senate Majority Leader Scott Fitzgerald said in a statement. "Passing the law correctly and legally a second or third time wouldn't change anything. It certainly wouldn't stop another activist judge and room full of lawyers from trying to start this merry-go-round all over again."

Gov. Scott Walker has said the law is needed to help school and local governments deal with cuts in state funding he expects to make to address the state's budget shortfall. Walker's spokesman referred questions to state Department of Administration officials, who declined comment.

Three lawsuits have been filed so far over the law. Sumi heard testimony Friday on one lawsuit filed by Dane County District Attorney Ismael Ozanne, who argues Republicans provided only two hours' notice of their meeting when the state's open meetings law requires 24 hours. Republican legislative leaders say proper notice was given under Senate rules.

But Ozanne called a number of witnesses who said they heard about the hearing only minutes before it began. They arrived to find long lines at the Capitol's entrances and by the time they reached the room where the meeting was held, police wouldn't allow them in.

Rich Judge, chief of staff for Assembly Democratic Leader Peter Barca, testified that someone dropped off a petition at Barca's office the night of the meeting. He said it was signed by nearly 3,000 people who alleged they were denied access to the meeting and the Senate floor session that immediately followed.

Brian Gleason of Madison testified he reached the Senate parlor, where the committee hearing was being held, about 20 minutes before the meeting was scheduled to begin. He found a crowd of about 150 people and a line of police standing shoulder to shoulder denying access.

"Frankly, I was angry," he said. "At that point, the train going into the Senate parlor was already closed to me."

Sumi asked for additional arguments from attorneys by May 23, delaying a decision for nearly two months. Whatever decision Sumi eventually makes, one side or the other is likely to appeal in an attempt to get the case to the state Supreme Court.



http://www.thenewstribune.com/2011/03/31/1607585/wis-judge-halts-govs-union-law.html?storylink=rss

Seems the spring is heating up.... politically.




truckinslave -> RE: The tangled web in Wisconsin (4/3/2011 10:08:09 AM)

Maryanne is both an activist and the mother of a union lobbyist.
She is thwarting the executive and legislative bodies of Wisconsin in an effort to allow the demonization of Justice Prosser to kill his re-election, thereby increasing the chance that the unions will somehow prevail in the Wisconsin Supreme Court.

She should be impeached forthwith.




tazzygirl -> RE: The tangled web in Wisconsin (4/3/2011 10:13:23 AM)

Is this where you are getting your information from?

http://www.danegop.org/latestnews.aspx?ID=234

RPDC Apologizes To Judge Sumi


The Republican Party of Dane County sent out a press release on March 29th criticizing Judge Maryann Sumi for holding up the publication of Governor Scott Walker’s collective bargaining reform bill. Upon further reflection we’d like to apologize for not understanding her point of view.

Sure, Governor Walker’s bill is unquestionably constitutional, increases worker’s rights and helps local government balance budgets without having to fire public workers. The Wisconsin state legislature consulted with their non-partisan parliamentarian to make sure that the passage of the bill followed the rules of the Senate and Assembly. But this isn’t about the law, is it?

The Republican Party of Dane County recognizes that Judge Sumi is a leftist living in Dane County. Her friends are leftists living in Dane County. Her son is a left wing activist in Dane County. She goes to cocktail parties held by leftists in Dane County. She shops at organic gourmet food shops run by leftists living in Dane County. If she were to enforce the law of Wisconsin and do what was in the best interest of the people of Wisconsin, she’d be exiled from her lifestyle. She’d lose her friends!

The leadership of the Republican Party of Dane County have all made the choice to stand against the Dane County elite. We accept that Left feels righteous vandalizing our homes and keying our cars. It's only fair. We disagree based upon logic and principle. That is intolerable! We prioritize the Constitution and the well being of the people of Wisconsin over foie gras at cocktail parties. That’s the choice we made. We respect Judge Sumi’s decision to live her life with the rich diversity that liberals cherish.




truckinslave -> RE: The tangled web in Wisconsin (4/3/2011 10:36:55 AM)

No, but they got the facts right. I thought it fairly droll as well.




tazzygirl -> RE: The tangled web in Wisconsin (4/3/2011 11:11:20 AM)

http://host.madison.com/ct/news/local/health_med_fit/vital_signs/article_36b8963c-5ae8-11e0-bcde-001cc4c03286.html

May want to read that.

So because of her son's career, she should be impeached? Im curious, on what grounds?




mnottertail -> RE: The tangled web in Wisconsin (4/3/2011 11:21:00 AM)

They are far more likely to shackle the governor and the republican legislature together, and have them dragged into the house, handcuffed and in tears, which I know is not the way my esteemed but sorely lacking in legal knowledge friend would have liked to see it done, before she is impeached on grounds. Now, they have shown their lawlessness to all and sundry, so they may send out some more toilet paper until they are recalled. 




Lucylastic -> RE: The tangled web in Wisconsin (4/3/2011 11:25:19 AM)

Sarah Palin just endorsed David Prosser, the right-wing candidate in next week’s election for Wisconsin Supreme Court.   Prosser voted with Gov. Scott Walker 95% when they were in the legislature -- and if he wins this election, he'll be the deciding vote on the legality of Gov. Walker's anti-worker bill that passed in the dark of night after Republicans bent the rules. 


The thot plickensbut only the lefty should be impeached huh?




DomKen -> RE: The tangled web in Wisconsin (4/3/2011 12:54:43 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: truckinslave

Maryanne is both an activist and the mother of a union lobbyist.
She is thwarting the executive and legislative bodies of Wisconsin in an effort to allow the demonization of Justice Prosser to kill his re-election, thereby increasing the chance that the unions will somehow prevail in the Wisconsin Supreme Court.

She should be impeached forthwith.

For what? The reason the TRO is still in force is because the republican officials named in the suit are not choosing to waive their immunity to civil actions while the legislature is in session.

Of course it is beyond certain that they violated the open meetings law and the recourse of nullifying all the actions taken in that meeting will be the outcome.




truckinslave -> RE: The tangled web in Wisconsin (4/3/2011 2:04:02 PM)

quote:

Of course it is beyond certain that they violated the open meetings law


Not only are you an expert on Wisconsin state law, but all the attorneys advising the Wis legislature, all the Republican legislators in Wis, and what passes for neutral sources on the subject are just stoooooopid.

Or: a liberal judge made up a specious reason to block the law........


Ever heard of Occams razor?




DomKen -> RE: The tangled web in Wisconsin (4/3/2011 2:05:33 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: truckinslave

quote:

Of course it is beyond certain that they violated the open meetings law


Not only are you an expert on Wisconsin state law, but all the attorneys advising the Wis legislature, all the Republican legislators in Wis, and what passes for neutral sources on the subject are just stoooooopid.

Or: a liberal judge made up a specious reason to block the law........


Ever heard of Occams razor?

Can you present even one nuetral source that says they didn't violate the open meetings law? Just a single link not to some right wing nuts will do.




tazzygirl -> RE: The tangled web in Wisconsin (4/3/2011 8:55:43 PM)

You really didnt expect an answer did you?




truckinslave -> RE: The tangled web in Wisconsin (4/4/2011 5:27:24 AM)

Senate Chief Clerk (a non-partisan position) Rob Marchant, whose job it is to advise on such things, is all over the web opining both before and after the meeting in question that all legal niceties were met.

Do your own damned research.




tazzygirl -> RE: The tangled web in Wisconsin (4/4/2011 5:44:10 AM)

Sumi has not ruled on the special session meeting yet. She has heard arguments. I would think Walker and the rest would want to have it publically known to all that the meeting was legal, above board.

Remember, that is not the only suit before her. Its the one she is currently hearing.




truckinslave -> RE: The tangled web in Wisconsin (4/4/2011 5:57:59 AM)

quote:

I would think Walker and the rest would want to have it publically known to all that the meeting was legal, above board.


They have issued multiple press releases, given multiple interviews, doing exactly that. Maryannes TRO has been blasted and denigrated in what passes in legislative circles as pretty harsh terms. I don't know what else they can do; it's hardly a shock that the dinosaur media has given more ink to the dimocrat side.

Of course there are other suits; this is America. There are always other suits. This is the one she could use to help the Dims first/fastest.




DomYngBlk -> RE: The tangled web in Wisconsin (4/4/2011 5:59:54 AM)

http://www.npr.org/2011/04/04/135106101/professors-face-scrutiny-over-labor-standoff

Interesting. Not worrying whether the content of their teaching is of any consequence only if they have opined on the labor standoff and walker.......Nothing like getting back to the basics of the founding fathers and the constitution with the Tea baggers...




tazzygirl -> RE: The tangled web in Wisconsin (4/4/2011 6:11:58 AM)

quote:

They have issued multiple press releases, given multiple interviews, doing exactly that. Maryannes TRO has been blasted and denigrated in what passes in legislative circles as pretty harsh terms. I don't know what else they can do; it's hardly a shock that the dinosaur media has given more ink to the dimocrat side.


You would prefer to have the courts, and public, take the word of one side over the other? Careful, thats a slippery slope for any political party to take.




truckinslave -> RE: The tangled web in Wisconsin (4/4/2011 6:27:58 AM)

I'm pretty sure that all I said was that the media has taken one side over the other.
That, and Maryanne, the mother of the union lobbyist. Wonder if she can spell "recuse".




Sanity -> RE: The tangled web in Wisconsin (4/4/2011 6:29:41 AM)


NPR? [sm=rofl.gif]

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomYngBlk

http://www.npr.org/2011/04/04/135106101/professors-face-scrutiny-over-labor-standoff

Interesting. Not worrying whether the content of their teaching is of any consequence only if they have opined on the labor standoff and walker.......Nothing like getting back to the basics of the founding fathers and the constitution with the Tea baggers...




housesub4you -> RE: The tangled web in Wisconsin (4/4/2011 6:55:48 AM)

Huh you seem to have a problem with the family connection in this case.

Yet you do not seem to be troubled by other family connections as long as it is for your side.

Cases in point, 

The Judge who ruled against the Healthcare law in Fl.  He owns the lobbying firm who wrote the argument for the case, he was the author of it.  So a Judge who writes the argument then gets to rule on his own briefs is not a conflict of interest to you.  (unless you can show me where you stated anywhere in this forum you disagreed with this abuse of power)

Supreme Court Justice Thomas, (his wife is was paid close to a million, to advise on the Citizens united case)  But no conflict of interest there, or the money, trips and speeches he has been paid for by the very groups who benefited most from his decision.


Where is your outrage about these conflicts of interest. 

Show me where the judge in Wisconsin gained financially from her decision?  Not hard to find it in the two examples I posted ( a google search will bring up enough proof to show you facts on both examples)




mnottertail -> RE: The tangled web in Wisconsin (4/4/2011 6:58:59 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: truckinslave

I'm pretty sure that all I said was that the media has taken one side over the other.
That, and Maryanne, the mother of the union lobbyist. Wonder if she can spell "recuse".


What reason for a recusion?  Will the state's defense have to recuse themselves because their sons and daughters have a job, them having no pecuniary or tangible interest?

You should give 28 U.S.C. sec. 144 a read.

That's how law works.  I see no adverse party that would benefit instead of these teachers, or the state,  in this ruling.

Plus she hasn't poisoned the well in that direction.





Page: [1] 2   next >   >>

Valid CSS!




Collarchat.com © 2025
Terms of Service Privacy Policy Spam Policy
0.046875