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RE: EPA Rules Force Shell to Abandon Oil Drilling Plans - 4/26/2011 5:23:47 PM   
tj444


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well after BP its going to have to be one heck of a plan. I am guessing that that plan needs to be approved first tho? I would think that the govt can put a moratorium on all offshore drilling regardless of permits having been issued. Its amazing what the govt can do with the strike of a pen.

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RE: EPA Rules Force Shell to Abandon Oil Drilling Plans - 4/26/2011 5:24:54 PM   
hardcybermaster


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oh I must go out and buy an i pad
I must
I must have it

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RE: EPA Rules Force Shell to Abandon Oil Drilling Plans - 4/26/2011 5:37:52 PM   
flcouple2009


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tj,

The plans for an accident include everything which was learned during the BP event.  Everybody now knows what works and what doesn't.

As I said permits have already been approved. 

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RE: EPA Rules Force Shell to Abandon Oil Drilling Plans - 4/26/2011 5:53:36 PM   
tj444


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well, if you say so.
S**t can happen tho, even with the best laid plans. Mother nature, machine failure, human error, sabotage, terrorists, etc...

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RE: EPA Rules Force Shell to Abandon Oil Drilling Plans - 4/27/2011 7:23:10 AM   
Sanity


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Maybe you, like millions of other common folk, could use some of the money youre making from oil company stocks to buy one

That is, if you have been smart enough to put some 401k money away over the years

quote:

ORIGINAL: hardcybermaster

oh I must go out and buy an i pad
I must
I must have it


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RE: EPA Rules Force Shell to Abandon Oil Drilling Plans - 4/27/2011 7:57:29 AM   
hardcybermaster


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that wasn't the point.
people want stuff,stuff they don't need.
how is America going to get the oil it needs? I don't know but it will get more and more difficult to get it and therefore more expensive. Eventually it will run out. Everything you buy that you don't really need uses up resources,driving around in huge SUVs that do 10 mpg uses up resources. Most people in the developed world are greedy and materialistic, way beyond the ability of the planet to sustain.There way too many of us and we are using way to much non renewable materials. So go ahead,buy a gadget,release some endorphins and don't worry about it
quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity


Maybe you, like millions of other common folk, could use some of the money youre making from oil company stocks to buy one

That is, if you have been smart enough to put some 401k money away over the years

quote:

ORIGINAL: hardcybermaster

oh I must go out and buy an i pad
I must
I must have it



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RE: EPA Rules Force Shell to Abandon Oil Drilling Plans - 4/27/2011 8:08:17 AM   
servantforuse


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And at the same time we send 2 billion dollars to Brazil to help them drill for oil. What a farce.

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RE: EPA Rules Force Shell to Abandon Oil Drilling Plans - 4/27/2011 8:15:23 AM   
angelikaJ


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"He’s especially frustrated over the appeal board’s suggestion that the Arctic drill would somehow be hazardous for the people who live in the area. “We think the issues were really not major,” Slaiby said, “and clearly not impactful for the communities we work in.” "

That just does not sound especially definitive to me.

But who really cares anyway, after all, it's only 245 people, mostly "natives" at that, who they're talking about in a very remote village.

edit: grammar

< Message edited by angelikaJ -- 4/27/2011 8:16:24 AM >


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RE: EPA Rules Force Shell to Abandon Oil Drilling Plans - 4/27/2011 8:17:08 AM   
Hippiekinkster


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quote:

ORIGINAL: servantforuse

And at the same time we send 2 billion dollars to Brazil to help them drill for oil. What a farce.
quote:

This claim stems from a "preliminary committment" made back on April 14 by the board of directors of the Export-Import Bank of the United States. The bank intends to loan up to $2 billion to finance exports to the Brazilian oil company Petróleo Brasileiro S.A., known as Petrobras, over the next several years.

The e-mail is false on two counts.

■The message falsely says the decision was due to an "executive order" by the president. No presidential order was required. Furthermore, none of President Obama’s appointees had joined the Ex-Im board at the time of the vote, which was unanimous, and bipartisan. The Ex-Im Bank states: "In fact, at the time the Bank’s Board consisted of three Republicans and two Democrats, all of whom were appointed by George W. Bush."
■The message falsely claims that "we have absolutely no gain" from the loan. In fact, the loan is being made specifically to finance purchase by Petrobras of U.S.-made oilfield equipment and services. The mission of the Ex-Im Bank is to encourage exports by making such loans.



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RE: EPA Rules Force Shell to Abandon Oil Drilling Plans - 4/27/2011 8:21:33 AM   
PeonForHer


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity
I am posting this in mind of the way so many Leftists on these discussion boards repeatedly deny that the president has anything to do with Americas ability to obtain cheap, plentiful fuel.


I fondly remember the time, way back in the 1980s, when the Right claimed that environmental protection was a mainplank of its thinking, rather than one that belonged to the Left. 'Conservatism easily embraces conservation', it was said. During the same period, many elements on the far left agreed: Greens, they argued, were right wing reactionaries - against progress, against the working classes.

How things have changed!

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RE: EPA Rules Force Shell to Abandon Oil Drilling Plans - 4/27/2011 8:29:46 AM   
mnottertail


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Yesterdays orthodoxy is todays heresy and thats heterodoxy.

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RE: EPA Rules Force Shell to Abandon Oil Drilling Plans - 4/27/2011 8:31:04 AM   
servantforuse


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The 2 billion loan should be used in our country to help our oil companies, not sent to Brazil to help them.

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RE: EPA Rules Force Shell to Abandon Oil Drilling Plans - 4/27/2011 8:34:01 AM   
mnottertail


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The oil companies dont need the money, in fact, they should be assessed a MASSIVE TAX, they have massive amounts of land under federal lease laying idle.

What happened to drill baby drill?

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RE: EPA Rules Force Shell to Abandon Oil Drilling Plans - 4/27/2011 10:14:21 AM   
flcouple2009


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quote:

In fact, the loan is being made specifically to finance purchase by Petrobras of U.S.-made oilfield equipment and services


It seems again you missed this part.

Buying US made goods does not help US companies?

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RE: EPA Rules Force Shell to Abandon Oil Drilling Plans - 4/27/2011 10:23:16 AM   
Hillwilliam


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quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

The oil companies dont need the money, in fact, they should be assessed a MASSIVE TAX, they have massive amounts of land under federal lease laying idle.

What happened to drill baby drill?

It got changed to "Hoard baby Hoard"

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RE: EPA Rules Force Shell to Abandon Oil Drilling Plans - 4/27/2011 10:38:50 AM   
DomYngBlk


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity


I am posting this in mind of the way so many Leftists on these discussion boards repeatedly deny that the president has anything to do with Americas ability to obtain cheap, plentiful fuel.

Beside Americas energy independence, also at stake are the trade imbalance as well as the Alaskan economy.

quote:


Energy in America: EPA Rules Force Shell to Abandon Oil Drilling Plans







Shell Oil Company has announced it must scrap efforts to drill for oil this summer in the Arctic Ocean off the northern coast of Alaska. The decision comes following a ruling by the EPA’s Environmental Appeals Board to withhold critical air permits. The move has angered some in Congress and triggered a flurry of legislation aimed at stripping the EPA of its oil drilling oversight.

Shell has spent five years and nearly $4 billion dollars on plans to explore for oil in the Beaufort and Chukchi Seas. The leases alone cost $2.2 billion. Shell Vice President Pete Slaiby says obtaining similar air permits for a drilling operation in the Gulf of Mexico would take about 45 days. He’s especially frustrated over the appeal board’s suggestion that the Arctic drill would somehow be hazardous for the people who live in the area. “We think the issues were really not major,” Slaiby said, “and clearly not impactful for the communities we work in.”

The closest village to where Shell proposed to drill is Kaktovik, Alaska. It is one of the most remote places in the
United States. According to the latest census, the population is 245 and nearly all of the residents are Alaska natives. The village, which is 1 square mile, sits right along the shores of the Beaufort Sea, 70 miles away from the proposed off-shore drill site. The EPA’s appeals board ruled that Shell had not taken into consideration emissions from an ice-breaking vessel when calculating overall greenhouse gas emissions from the project. Environmental groups were thrilled by the ruling.

“What the modeling showed was in communities like Kaktovik, Shell’s drilling would increase air pollution levels close to air quality standards,” said Eric Grafe, Earthjustice’s lead attorney on the case. Earthjustice was joined by Center for Biological Diversity and the Alaska Wilderness League in challenging the air permits.

At stake is an estimated 27 billion barrels of oil.


Read more:
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2011/04/25/energy-america-oil-drilling-denial/#ixzz1KcnkIEKP




So you want the Dutch to come and rob our natural treasures? I thought you were an American

(in reply to Sanity)
Profile   Post #: 36
RE: EPA Rules Force Shell to Abandon Oil Drilling Plans - 4/27/2011 10:40:29 AM   
DomYngBlk


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity


I am posting this in mind of the way so many Leftists on these discussion boards repeatedly deny that the president has anything to do with Americas ability to obtain cheap, plentiful fuel.

Beside Americas energy independence, also at stake are the trade imbalance as well as the Alaskan economy.

quote:


Energy in America: EPA Rules Force Shell to Abandon Oil Drilling Plans







Shell Oil Company has announced it must scrap efforts to drill for oil this summer in the Arctic Ocean off the northern coast of Alaska. The decision comes following a ruling by the EPA’s Environmental Appeals Board to withhold critical air permits. The move has angered some in Congress and triggered a flurry of legislation aimed at stripping the EPA of its oil drilling oversight.

Shell has spent five years and nearly $4 billion dollars on plans to explore for oil in the Beaufort and Chukchi Seas. The leases alone cost $2.2 billion. Shell Vice President Pete Slaiby says obtaining similar air permits for a drilling operation in the Gulf of Mexico would take about 45 days. He’s especially frustrated over the appeal board’s suggestion that the Arctic drill would somehow be hazardous for the people who live in the area. “We think the issues were really not major,” Slaiby said, “and clearly not impactful for the communities we work in.”

The closest village to where Shell proposed to drill is Kaktovik, Alaska. It is one of the most remote places in the
United States. According to the latest census, the population is 245 and nearly all of the residents are Alaska natives. The village, which is 1 square mile, sits right along the shores of the Beaufort Sea, 70 miles away from the proposed off-shore drill site. The EPA’s appeals board ruled that Shell had not taken into consideration emissions from an ice-breaking vessel when calculating overall greenhouse gas emissions from the project. Environmental groups were thrilled by the ruling.

“What the modeling showed was in communities like Kaktovik, Shell’s drilling would increase air pollution levels close to air quality standards,” said Eric Grafe, Earthjustice’s lead attorney on the case. Earthjustice was joined by Center for Biological Diversity and the Alaska Wilderness League in challenging the air permits.

At stake is an estimated 27 billion barrels of oil.


Read more:
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2011/04/25/energy-america-oil-drilling-denial/#ixzz1KcnkIEKP




And told you before how to fix that trade imbalance. Ethanol. But , of course, you don't want to do that cause it  benefits everyone in this country.

< Message edited by DomYngBlk -- 4/27/2011 10:41:25 AM >

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RE: EPA Rules Force Shell to Abandon Oil Drilling Plans - 4/27/2011 10:49:24 AM   
Edwynn


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quote:

ORIGINAL: servantforuse

The 2 billion loan should be used in our country to help our oil companies, not sent to Brazil to help them.




The choice is yours. The US is the third largest exporter in the world. Do you wish that we export more in the near future or export less to Brazil?

The loan itself is a guaranteed $2 billion in exports of US made drilling equipment and services, else the loan would not have been made, and you are already bitching about that before we even get the money.

Screw US located wells; we have better things to do, better things to make, better use for our land. It's called being a 'developed country.'

Here's a chart for you :

"These 20 countries received 78.8% of the value of all U.S. exports as of June 2010"
  1. Canada … US$121.9 billion, up 26.8% from 2009 (19.9% of US total exports)
  2. Mexico … $77.3 billion, up 31.8% (12.6%)
  3. China … $41.2 billion, up 35.6% (6.7%)
  4. Japan … $29.2 billion, up 18.1% (4.8%)
  5. United Kingdom … $24.3 billion, up 6.4% (4%)
  6. Germany … $23.2 billion, up 9.5% (3.8%)
  7. South Korea … $19.2 billion, up 52.7% (3.1%)
  8. Brazil … $16.4 billion, up 37.7% (2.7%)
  9. Netherlands … $16.2 billion, down 1% (2.7%)
  10. Singapore … $14.2 billion, up 42.4% (2.3%)
  11. France … $13 billion, down 6.3% (2.1%)
  12. Belgium … $12.3 billion, up 16.1% (2%)
  13. Hong Kong … $12.3 billion, up 26.4% (2%)
  14. Taiwan … $12.1 billion, up 59.5% (2%)
  15. Australia … $10.5 billion, up 15.2% (1.7%)
  16. Switzerland … $9.7 billion, up 7.6% (1.6%)
  17. India … $9.2 billion, up 22.9% (1.5%)
  18. Italy … $7 billion, up 14.6% (1.1%)
  19. Malaysia … $6.6 billion, up 50.3% (1.1%)
  20. Colombia … $5.9 billion, up 35.8% (1%).
"Among these top 20 countries, 18 or 90% increased their purchases of U.S. exports during the first 6 months of 2010. Only the Netherlands (down 1%) and France (down 6.3%) decreased their consumption of American products over that time period.
Read more at Suite101: United States Exports So Far in 2010 by Trade Partner Country | Suite101.com http://www.suite101.com/content/united-states-exports-so-far-in-2010-by-trade-partner-country-a277026#ixzz1KkIF23QE "


I would like if Brazil moved up to #3 on that chart. Probably never happen, China is only going to keep buying more of our stuff and they are bigger, but I like close neighbors to exchange money and machinery and real tortilla chips with. Call me a homer.

Shipping to and from Brazil is cheaper than shipping to China or Germany or Japan, etc. I hope we keep increasing our shipments in that regard, but the more the US ships to Brazil in the way of 'plant and equipment,' the more they get it in gear and buy even more than they already are from US suppliers. Shipping US goods to Brazil is a good thing. And buying goods from Brazil is a good thing. If the US has to be net importers, I quite like Canada and Mexico and, I hope soon, Brazil, more than I like us buying and selling to China. Look out for your closest neighbors first. That's how Germany exports so much and has a positive trade balance.


Pardon me while I bust out some of my A. Carlos Jobim and Brazil '66 records here ...





< Message edited by Edwynn -- 4/27/2011 10:59:01 AM >

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RE: EPA Rules Force Shell to Abandon Oil Drilling Plans - 4/27/2011 10:55:36 AM   
domiguy


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Thomas, I try to like you. I look at your pictures of the national parks, you fishing in a beautiful river and you drinking from a well.

You value these places and yet are willing to put them at risk?

Is it because it is not in your backyard? WTF?

You have the luxury to live and to be able to easily visit areas that have been set aside and have avoided the wrath of development and the damage it can undoubtedly bring.

Would you accept drilling in Yellowstone or Salmon-Challis? What if the wells became contaminated or that river no longer held fish?

I envy you. I am stuck here in Chicago, beautiful city, beautiful Lakefront. We watch as invasive species are routinely dropped into our waters and industrial spills happen along her tributaries. Good fishing, though. I think about the impact on Lake Michigan if a gulf type of spill were to happen here. It is simply not worth the risk.

Find alternatives. Charge more for gas. Don't fuck up the few unique and beautiful places left in this country.

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RE: EPA Rules Force Shell to Abandon Oil Drilling Plans - 4/27/2011 11:21:32 AM   
Lucylastic


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quote:

ORIGINAL: domiguy

Thomas, I try to like you. I look at your pictures of the national parks, you fishing in a beautiful river and you drinking from a well.

You value these places and yet are willing to put them at risk?

Is it because it is not in your backyard? WTF?

You have the luxury to live and to be able to easily visit areas that have been set aside and have avoided the wrath of development and the damage it can undoubtedly bring.

Would you accept drilling in Yellowstone or Salmon-Challis? What if the wells became contaminated or that river no longer held fish?

I envy you. I am stuck here in Chicago, beautiful city, beautiful Lakefront. We watch as invasive species are routinely dropped into our waters and industrial spills happen along her tributaries. Good fishing, though. I think about the impact on Lake Michigan if a gulf type of spill were to happen here. It is simply not worth the risk.

Find alternatives. Charge more for gas. Don't fuck up the few unique and beautiful places left in this country.


Best post of the week!!


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