RE: The Real World of Slavery. . . (Full Version)

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subfever -> RE: The Real World of Slavery. . . (5/1/2011 5:01:14 PM)

quote:

The problem of course is if they are invisible how do we find them? How can we know or make that determination.


I don't think we need to look far and hard to find the answer, if we just open our eyes and mind.

As long as we exist within a system which forces us to exchange our labor for money in order to provide the basic necessities of life, we are indeed submitting. The question is: do we consent to our submission because we know that non-consent would result in either poverty, ostracization, or incarceration... or do we actually delude ourselves to believe we're free people?

If our conditioned delusion is the "politically sanctioned invisible" to which you refer, then I agree with you.




Arpig -> RE: The Real World of Slavery. . . (5/1/2011 5:14:27 PM)

quote:

Yes RO we are all slaves to the crown,

quote:

So how can you tell?

What are the signs?

A Canadian passport is a pretty good indicator...[;)]




subfever -> RE: The Real World of Slavery. . . (5/1/2011 5:18:11 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

quote:

ORIGINAL: subfever

FR


quote:

ORIGINAL: Lucylastic

Yes RO we are all slaves to the crown, yes now please bugger off and go back under your bridge, let the grownups wind each other up


Hey RO... I see you've made some friends here... [:D]


That's only because you two live under the same bridge.



Aaaahh... I was wondering what crawled out from under that rock to see us both there... it was you!




Lucylastic -> RE: The Real World of Slavery. . . (5/1/2011 5:19:03 PM)

and Im doubly enslaved....by birth and choice
funny but it really doesnt suck to be me






imperatrixx -> RE: The Real World of Slavery. . . (5/1/2011 5:40:49 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne

sounds like you are referring to the writ of right for legal affairs.

that is one version of right but what about moral right, just right both which may be outside the commercial world?

Would a just cause not be a right?


In my opinion, no. A right only exists where there is authority, because even to think you have the "right" to do something carries with it the implication that it is possible for you to not have that right. Such a system of permissions requires authority to grant or deny.

quote:

The legal version confers rights based on the fee.  What about the right to tap your fingers on your knee for instance?  Where would we find a law for that?  I can proclaim I have the right to tap my finger and someone would challenge it and take it to court I would most likely win.  (never know now days)

so not all rights are sanctioned in law.



Depends. If you're tapping your fingers on your knee in time to what's on your ipod, then it's implied in the right to assemble peaceably - you're just sort of existing and doing your own thing.

If you're tapping your fingers on your knee to signal to your hired gun that his target just came out the door, then yeah...not really covered.




Real0ne -> RE: The Real World of Slavery. . . (5/1/2011 7:49:34 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: imperatrixx


quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne

sounds like you are referring to the writ of right for legal affairs.

that is one version of right but what about moral right, just right both which may be outside the commercial world?

Would a just cause not be a right?


In my opinion, no. A right only exists where there is authority, because even to think you have the "right" to do something carries with it the implication that it is possible for you to not have that right. Such a system of permissions requires authority to grant or deny.

quote:

The legal version confers rights based on the fee.  What about the right to tap your fingers on your knee for instance?  Where would we find a law for that?  I can proclaim I have the right to tap my finger and someone would challenge it and take it to court I would most likely win.  (never know now days)

so not all rights are sanctioned in law.



Depends. If you're tapping your fingers on your knee in time to what's on your ipod, then it's implied in the right to assemble peaceably - you're just sort of existing and doing your own thing.

If you're tapping your fingers on your knee to signal to your hired gun that his target just came out the door, then yeah...not really covered.




well the way rights worked since the beginning of time is that you have the right to do anything your heart desires and anything you can think up.

but there is a caveat;

as long as it does not injure another in equity or person.  That is why I used the tap your knee example and even in your latter I dont see how any court could convict with the trigger example but I got a good chuckle.

that is where the saying your rights end at the next guys nose.

When rights are seen as being granted by an authority, say guv, what the guv grants the guv can take away.  They can always dream up some emergency beg you to give up a right then you never get it back.

That is precisely why the 10th is written the way it is.

quote:

The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.


funny thing about constitutions though, the distinguish between the states and people.  lol hmm....






Politesub53 -> RE: The Real World of Slavery. . . (5/2/2011 5:33:13 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne

ok...
so to explore that to the next step we need to ask you/anyone precisely what is a "right" is and where does it come from?

How does it come to belong to someone in the first place?

People claim they have them all the time, you see it on most threads but no one has stopped to tell me what a right really is?



You have the right to remain stupid Miranda. Anything you say may be used against you in a court of your peers.

History has never been your strong point has it, at least accurate history hasnt.




starshineowned -> RE: The Real World of Slavery. . . (5/2/2011 8:14:51 AM)



quote:

ORIGINAL: subfever

Primary purpose = extracting value.


quote:



daym!

good one!  first poster!

value which basically converts to money.

I think most people would agree with that?



Probably in the minority but value converts to happiness in this home. There is so much more involved to making happiness thrive than simply having money.

starshine

* lil edit to remove the multiple quote thingys*




imperatrixx -> RE: The Real World of Slavery. . . (5/2/2011 11:47:26 AM)

quote:

When rights are seen as being granted by an authority, say guv, what the guv grants the guv can take away.


Exactly. That's why I don't see how it would make sense to look at "rights" in the abstract, outside of an authority to grant or deny them. Someone giving you rights is basically giving you protection. Without that, what do you have? God given rights? Sure, if God's going to rain thunderbolts on whoever tries to infringe on those rights. Self given rights? So long as you're stronger than the one who wants to take the right away.

From my perspective, nobody has any inherent rights. The concept of rights is a construct of social structure.




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