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Pope John Paul II Beatified - 5/2/2011 1:25:21 AM   
DeviantlyD


Posts: 4375
Joined: 5/26/2007
From: Hawai`i
Status: offline 		Sunday's biggest news may be about a death, but it was also the day Pope John Paul II was beatified. I know there are many who don't agree with Catholicism and find fault with the Vatican, but consider that these men (and women, if you consider the nuns) are human and fallible, as we all are. Regarding Pope John Paul II, I believe at his heart, he was sincere about his love for God and Jesus Christ, and, of humanity. So, perhaps, find a moment to celebrate what this man stood for.

http://www.ottawacitizen.com/news/John+Paul+sainthood/4707924/story.html
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RE: Pope John Paul II Beatified - 5/2/2011 2:01:13 AM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		Why dont you explain the rational behind his sainthood to all those adults who were abused as children. There is a huge difference between being human and covering up a massive crime.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to DeviantlyD)
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RE: Pope John Paul II Beatified - 5/2/2011 2:03:22 AM   
Thirsty4Goddess


Posts: 21
Joined: 4/17/2011
Status: offline 		Congratulations to the followers of John Paul.

I am not a Catholic or even religious, however I recognize John Paul for his humanitarian work and tireless support of world peace. He does deserve the beaification. Peace be with you.

Now on the other hand this Ratsinge rcharacter that is current Pope has no love for the people. His earlier work shielding priests that rape children from prosecution and even reassigning them to other positions where they had access to children is criminal at best. His efforts to cover up the documented rape of children and failure to inform authorities or preventing the rapists from raping additional victums, makes him culpable in the rapes that happened after he became aware of the problem.

(in reply to DeviantlyD)
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RE: Pope John Paul II Beatified - 5/2/2011 2:08:51 AM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		In 1994, seven years before the clergy sexual abuse scandal exploded, Robert Costello sent a letter to Pope John Paul II.

“Dear Holy Father,’’ it began, “When I was a small boy of about 10 years old, I was sexually abused by our parish priest. The abuse lasted for over four years. At the time, what was happening to me was extremely frightening. I was very battered on the inside and very cold on the outside.’’

Costello was an altar boy at St. Theresa’s in West Roxbury, and a predator in a Roman collar named John Cotter routinely molested him. Cotter would follow him into the pool and put his hands down his swim trunks.

“On the inside, I was dead,’’ Costello wrote to the pope.

Costello felt a shame he could share with no one. He started stealing drinks from his grandfather’s liquor cabinet.

“I think it was the first time I really wanted to die,’’ he wrote to the pope. “I was both physically and mentally raped of everything I knew. My world was dark.’’

He urged the pope to confront the evil in his midst as surely as he spoke out about the evils of communism and totalitarianism.

“What I can’t understand is all of the silence by the Catholic Church,’’ he wrote to the man who was in charge of that church. “This priest admitted what he did. The Church knows he abused sexually, spiritually and mentally many children. He was transferred to another parish where he continued to sexually abuse children.’’

He begged the pope for an audience.

“By us sitting down together you could help the healing process for thousands of people. I would not take up much of your time and it would mean so much to countless others that the pastoral responsibilities of the Catholic Church were making a comeback.’’

Bob Costello never did hear back from the pope, and today in a ceremony in Rome that will put that little wedding in London to shame, the dead pope will be beatified, one step away from sainthood.

“You would think that the institutional church would have learned, would have been sensitive to the thousands and thousands of victims and survivors out there,’’ Bob Costello told me yesterday. “But by making John Paul a saint, and by rushing the process so blatantly, I think it’s pretty clear that the leaders of the church still don’t get it. They still think it’s all about them, not about the ordinary people, not about those who have suffered.’’

There is no doubt John Paul was a great man. He was also a flawed man who presided over a church that was guilty of one of the biggest institutional coverups of criminal activity in history. The pope being rushed to sainthood failed thousands of children and in doing so failed his church and his God.

http://articles.boston.com/2011-05-01/yourtown/29493772_1_pope-john-paul-ii-clergy-sexual-abuse-scandal-abuse-children/2

Its just plain wrong.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to Thirsty4Goddess)
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RE: Pope John Paul II Beatified - 5/2/2011 4:43:47 AM   
farglebargle


Posts: 10715
Joined: 6/15/2005
From: Albany, NY
Status: offline 		Compared to Pope Hitler Youth, yeah, I guess it does look like sainthood...

_____________________________

It's not every generation that gets to watch a civilization fall. Looks like we're in for a hell of a show.

ברוך אתה, אדוני אלוקינו, ריבון העולמים, מי יוצר צמחים ריחניים

(in reply to tazzygirl)
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RE: Pope John Paul II Beatified - 5/2/2011 11:37:37 AM   
paulmcuk


Posts: 80
Joined: 4/16/2011
Status: offline 		Regardless of actions/spirituality of JP2, the unseemly fast-tracking of him towards sainthood smacks very strongly of the vatican trying to cash in on his unquestioned popularity among catholics. A very political move, rather than a spiritual one. Also, the fact that they've invited mad-dog Mugabe kinda spoils the sintliness of the occasions.

(in reply to farglebargle)
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RE: Pope John Paul II Beatified - 5/2/2011 5:04:58 PM   
Termyn8or


Posts: 18681
Joined: 11/12/2005
Status: offline 		Mugabe is still around ? How about sainthood for him ?

T^T

(in reply to paulmcuk)
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RE: Pope John Paul II Beatified - 5/2/2011 9:16:13 PM   
AllOfTheLights


Posts: 5
Joined: 4/28/2011
Status: offline 		Mugabe hasn't tripped and fallen head-first on a bullet yet?  Dang.

Note to self: Send more loose bullets and banana peels to Zimbabwe.

(in reply to Termyn8or)
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RE: Pope John Paul II Beatified - 5/3/2011 6:37:34 PM   
Edwynn


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Joined: 10/26/2008
Status: offline

Man, I am SO glad that people caught up to this.

Being that the Catholic church has sole hegemony on child molestation here, none of any other of any persuasion having any to do with that whatsoever at all.

Jews? clean. Muslims? Clean. Every other of the hundreds of other Christians of other diversions as per some whim of a king? Clean. Every other child molester of no faith whatsoever? Clean. Not to mention child molesters with out any ascribable faith.  Clean bill of contemporary politically or socially or in any other regard 'acceptable' health  in any modern world standard?

Have at it, bitches.







Good job, folks. Congratulate yourselves there.






We don't even hear about any of that, that's how good the cover-up job is there.





< Message edited by Edwynn -- 5/3/2011 6:45:59 PM >

(in reply to AllOfTheLights)
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RE: Pope John Paul II Beatified - 5/3/2011 7:10:09 PM   
Aylee


Posts: 24103
Joined: 10/14/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Edwynn

Being that the Catholic church has sole hegemony on child molestation here, none of any other of any persuasion having any to do with that whatsoever at all.



It is ironic that statistically speaking, your child is more likely to be molested by a teacher than a priest. No one though condems the public school system for this.

_____________________________

Ceterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam

I don’t always wgah’nagl fhtagn. But when I do, I ph’nglui mglw’nafh R’lyeh.

(in reply to Edwynn)
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RE: Pope John Paul II Beatified - 5/3/2011 7:36:17 PM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		Im trying to figure out what his post has to do with the OP.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to Aylee)
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RE: Pope John Paul II Beatified - 5/3/2011 8:05:40 PM   
Aylee


Posts: 24103
Joined: 10/14/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

Im trying to figure out what his post has to do with the OP.


I believe that he is pointing out that there are bad people in any group.

You see. . . beatification is dependent upon a miracle. If John Paul was able to intercede with someone on their behalf with G*d and a miracle occurred, then he becomes, "Blessed John Paul."

A bishop opens the investigation, the body is exhumed to be sure that there has been no cult springing up, a recommendation that the person exhibited the theological virtues of faith, hope and charity, and the cardinal virtues of prudence, justice, fortitude and temperance, to a heroic degree, and then a miracle has to happen or they have to have been a martyr.

So that you know, "Justice, which gives every one his due, is the pivot on which turn the virtues of religion, piety, obedience, gratitude, truthfulness, friendship, and many more. Jesus sacrificing His life to give God His due, Abraham willing to sacrifice his son in obedience to God's will, these are acts of heroic justice." It has nothing to do with the court system or human laws.



_____________________________

Ceterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam

I don’t always wgah’nagl fhtagn. But when I do, I ph’nglui mglw’nafh R’lyeh.

(in reply to tazzygirl)
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RE: Pope John Paul II Beatified - 5/3/2011 8:22:36 PM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		Of course there are bad people in any group. The person this OP is about is two Popes... one dead... one alive. The dead one having ignored the plight of the abused.. and the live one attempting to make a Saint out of the one who was doing the ignoring.

To me, this isnt a case of virtues... he should little towards those who were the most innocent under the care of his church.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to Aylee)
Profile   Post #: 13
RE: Pope John Paul II Beatified - 5/3/2011 9:34:45 PM   
Aylee


Posts: 24103
Joined: 10/14/2007
Status: offline 		Tazzy,

Keep in mind that I was just making a guess at the meaning behind someone else's post.

The OP was about thinking on the good John Paul II did, or so I thought.

_____________________________

Ceterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam

I don’t always wgah’nagl fhtagn. But when I do, I ph’nglui mglw’nafh R’lyeh.

(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 14
RE: Pope John Paul II Beatified - 5/3/2011 11:49:27 PM   
DeviantlyD


Posts: 4375
Joined: 5/26/2007
From: Hawai`i
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: paulmcuk

Regardless of actions/spirituality of JP2, the unseemly fast-tracking of him towards sainthood smacks very strongly of the vatican trying to cash in on his unquestioned popularity among catholics. A very political move, rather than a spiritual one. Also, the fact that they've invited mad-dog Mugabe kinda spoils the sintliness of the occasions.



Hmm....that's a good point. And it makes sense.

On the one hand I do think he was a good man and a sincere one. So how can one forgive how he ignored the devastating abuse of children by priests? I truly think he has to be in denial about it. One thing is for certain - none of us will know if he ignored it out of denial, out of a sense of duty to protect the church (don't get bent out of shape on that point, I agree it's beyond reprehensible if that was the reason), or something else.

(in reply to paulmcuk)
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RE: Pope John Paul II Beatified - 5/7/2011 12:40:08 PM   
CruelDominio


Posts: 3
Joined: 1/9/2011
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Aylee


quote:

ORIGINAL: Edwynn

Being that the Catholic church has sole hegemony on child molestation here, none of any other of any persuasion having any to do with that whatsoever at all.



It is ironic that statistically speaking, your child is more likely to be molested by a teacher than a priest. No one though condems the public school system for this.


Maybe that's because the public school system doesn't hide the fact when it happens, and cooperates with the police to get the abuser in jail.


(in reply to Aylee)
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RE: Pope John Paul II Beatified - 5/7/2011 12:50:40 PM   
rulemylife


Posts: 14614
Joined: 8/23/2004
Status: offline 		I don't think we should be beating any Popes, especially dead ones.

You can only take RACK so far.


(in reply to DeviantlyD)
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RE: Pope John Paul II Beatified - 5/7/2011 1:04:07 PM   
rulemylife


Posts: 14614
Joined: 8/23/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Thirsty4Goddess

Congratulations to the followers of John Paul.

I am not a Catholic or even religious, however I recognize John Paul for his humanitarian work and tireless support of world peace. He does deserve the beaification. Peace be with you.

Now on the other hand this Ratsinge rcharacter that is current Pope has no love for the people. His earlier work shielding priests that rape children from prosecution and even reassigning them to other positions where they had access to children is criminal at best. His efforts to cover up the documented rape of children and failure to inform authorities or preventing the rapists from raping additional victums, makes him culpable in the rapes that happened after he became aware of the problem.


John Paul did the same and worse.


Pope John Paul's Path to Sainthood: A Rush to Judgment? - TIME

When hundreds of thousands of Catholics gather in Rome Sunday for the beatification of Pope John Paul II, not everyone will be celebrating.

For the victims of sexual abuse by predatory priests, the ceremony — a major step towards sainthood — is too much too soon for a Pontiff they say failed to adequately confront the crimes committed by members of his church.

"It's the rubbing of salt into the already deep and still fresh wounds of thousands of victims," says David Clohessy, national director of the Survivors Network of those Abused by Priests. "The signal that his beatification basically sends to church employees across the globe is that no matter how many children are harmed because of your inaction, your clerical career won't suffer."



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RE: Pope John Paul II Beatified - 5/7/2011 1:05:50 PM   
Rule


Posts: 10479
Joined: 12/5/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DeviantlyD
Sunday's biggest news may be about a death, but it was also the day Pope John Paul II was beatified. I know there are many who don't agree with Catholicism and find fault with the Vatican, but consider that these men (and women, if you consider the nuns) are human and fallible, as we all are. Regarding Pope John Paul II, I believe at his heart, he was sincere about his love for God and Jesus Christ, and, of humanity. So, perhaps, find a moment to celebrate what this man stood for.

He was the single person on Earth whom I deemed most likely to burn in hell for all the godless acts that he committed - but then I am kinda paranoid.

I do think that anyone who thought that he was a nice guy, does was or is insufficiently paranoid.

(in reply to DeviantlyD)
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RE: Pope John Paul II Beatified - 5/7/2011 1:16:33 PM   
rulemylife


Posts: 14614
Joined: 8/23/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Aylee

It is ironic that statistically speaking, your child is more likely to be molested by a teacher than a priest. No one though condems the public school system for this.


Well, please do share those statistics with us.

I'm sure they must be as close to your fingertips as the claim you just made.




< Message edited by rulemylife -- 5/7/2011 1:18:56 PM >

(in reply to Aylee)
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