RE: Who Deserves the Credit for Osama's Demise?

RE: Who Deserves the Credit for Osama's Demise? (Full Version)

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tazzygirl -> RE: Who Deserves the Credit for Osama's Demise? (5/6/2011 9:56:47 AM)
quote: And if my aunt had balls, she would be my uncle. You can not tell me if it had gone south many of the people saying he should get no credit would be trying to put the blame 100% at his feet. Of course they would have. And if he was white, they would give him the credit now.

angelikaJ -> RE: Who Deserves the Credit for Osama's Demise? (5/6/2011 10:03:19 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam quote: ORIGINAL: vincentML * Sighssss * how quickly we forget this is a jihad, a holy war waged against out beloved Christian nation. The real credit goes to our Protector and Avenger: "He is trampling out the vintage where the grapes of wrath are stored; He hath loosed the fateful lightning of His terrible swift sword:" Come on, youse guys. Give credit where credit is due. Our God is stronger than their God! For heaven's sake, everybody knows that. Jesus guided the bullet straight to Osama's eyeball. SPLAT! I got bad news for ya dude. Our god IS their god. Yup, same entity just spelled differently and worshipped differently. Yup, someone fell asleep during his world religion class. Muslims worship the God of Abraham and Moses and believe that Jesus was a prophet, along with Muhammad. They differ in their belief of course that Jesus was the son of God. They do believe that Jesus foretold the coming of Muhammed; that he was a precursor to Muhammad. Yup, Jesus is mentioned in the Qur'an. His birth, his life, and they believe he will return again. The lineage of 6 major Prophets in Islam are as follows: Adam --> Noah --> Abraham --> (from Abraham came Isaac's lineage) --> Moses (and also from Isaac's lineage was Mary) --> Jesus (On the other side of Abraham's lineage there is Ishmael --> Abdul Muttalib) --> Muhammad. So, yes, same God, different name.

BamaD -> RE: Who Deserves the Credit for Osama's Demise? (5/6/2011 10:12:13 AM)
Obama gets credit for execution of the plan Bush should for getting the intelligence. If it had gone south it would have been execution, black white or purple that would belong to Obama. For reference I blame Carter for the Tehran rescue fiasco, and Reagan for the Marine Barracks in Lebanon. I think they were both white and only one was a Democrat.

Mezrem -> RE: Who Deserves the Credit for Osama's Demise? (5/6/2011 10:12:20 AM)
I disagree there, I think if he was any color the hard line vote for them because they have an R crowd would still give the credit to anyone but him. Just as the hard left is making it sound as if he was there pulling the trigger. Like I said before the real credit for this goes to the people with real skin in it. They have shed blood and in some cases given every thing down to thier lives. quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl quote: And if my aunt had balls, she would be my uncle. You can not tell me if it had gone south many of the people saying he should get no credit would be trying to put the blame 100% at his feet. Of course they would have. And if he was white, they would give him the credit now.

LadyConstanze -> RE: Who Deserves the Credit for Osama's Demise? (5/6/2011 10:20:35 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: cuckoldmepls It's always good to see an intelligent black man reveal the hypocrisy of the democratic party. I love it. http://patriotpost.us/opinion/larry-elder/2011/05/05/bush-led-bin-laden-dead-wheres-the-credit/ Yeah 2 terms and he couldn't do what he promised to do... Sure he deserves credit for what the guy who took over did, I mean somebody can't finish a job and they fire him and you get the job and you do it, surely the other guy should get the credit for it and not you... Let me ask you, if it would have somehow gone wrong, WHO WOULD YOU HAVE BLAMED?

kdsub -> RE: Who Deserves the Credit for Osama's Demise? (5/6/2011 10:23:48 AM)
Moving past the black white bullshit there is some truth to what he is saying…but…Who is to say that information could not have been gained without interrogation techniques like water boarding? Why is the formation of an anti-terrorism special forces unit political? Don’t you think that if a Democrat was in office at the time they may have done the same thing? I do. President Bush would have gotten credit if he had been in office at the time…do you think he would have given President Clinton any credit? I think President Obama gave President Bush credit and tried to get him to share in the accolades. I have expressed my dislike of Bush and his record while in office but I thought it was classy of him to decline Obama’s invitation to share the glory. Butch

WantsOfTheFlesh -> RE: Who Deserves the Credit for Osama's Demise? (5/6/2011 10:25:44 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: angelikaJ quote: ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam quote: ORIGINAL: vincentML * Sighssss * how quickly we forget this is a jihad, a holy war waged against out beloved Christian nation. The real credit goes to our Protector and Avenger: "He is trampling out the vintage where the grapes of wrath are stored; He hath loosed the fateful lightning of His terrible swift sword:" Come on, youse guys. Give credit where credit is due. Our God is stronger than their God! For heaven's sake, everybody knows that. Jesus guided the bullet straight to Osama's eyeball. SPLAT! I got bad news for ya dude. Our god IS their god. Yup, same entity just spelled differently and worshipped differently. Yup, someone fell asleep during his world religion class. Muslims worship the God of Abraham and Moses and believe that Jesus was a prophet, along with Muhammad. They differ in their belief of course that Jesus was the son of God. They do believe that Jesus foretold the coming of Muhammed; that he was a precursor to Muhammad. Yup, Jesus is mentioned in the Qur'an. His birth, his life, and they believe he will return again. So, yes, same God, different name. Yes but not quite 100% because recognition of the divinity of Jesus Christ is essential in Christianity for one's salvation. He is quite literally another aspect of the Holy Trinity so with one faith seeing him as a phony prophet, another seeing him as a true prophet of a series and another seeing him another manifestation of true divinity, it can be said they are similar but different gods besides the very different teaching that accompanies each. In a sense the god of Judaism and Islam are closer because both just have one/singlular manifestation of God where neither see any of their holy prophets as divine - merely agents of that will.

tazzygirl -> RE: Who Deserves the Credit for Osama's Demise? (5/6/2011 10:27:55 AM)
quote: Like I said before the real credit for this goes to the people with real skin in it. They have shed blood and in some cases given every thing down to thier lives. I agree the Seals should get the credit, and the reward. If they dont want it, then they should, collectively, decide who to give it too. Lots of great charities out there could use that kind of money. As far as Obama, my belief remains... much of the derision aimed at the man is because of his skin color.

tazzygirl -> RE: Who Deserves the Credit for Osama's Demise? (5/6/2011 10:29:56 AM)
quote: Obama gets credit for execution of the plan Bush should for getting the intelligence. If it had gone south it would have been execution, black white or purple that would belong to Obama. For reference I blame Carter for the Tehran rescue fiasco, and Reagan for the Marine Barracks in Lebanon. I think they were both white and only one was a Democrat. And did not Obama invite both Bush and Clinton to the ceremony? I dont recall Obama taking full credit for the outcome. I do recall him praising those who went in and performed their jobs.

LadyConstanze -> RE: Who Deserves the Credit for Osama's Demise? (5/6/2011 10:41:27 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl quote: Like I said before the real credit for this goes to the people with real skin in it. They have shed blood and in some cases given every thing down to thier lives. I agree the Seals should get the credit, and the reward. If they dont want it, then they should, collectively, decide who to give it too. Lots of great charities out there could use that kind of money. As far as Obama, my belief remains... much of the derision aimed at the man is because of his skin color. Oh I agree, would he be purely Caucasian nobody would have dared to ask for a birth certificate, no Donald Duck could claim he didn't deserve to be admitted to Harvard (yeah and he finished magna cum laude because he wasn't a fantastic student - and the earth is flat), it's all a freaking racist agenda. While the Seals deserve credit and did the job, if anything would have gone wrong, Obama would have gotten the blame because he's the one in charge, he gave the command, so why do people grudge him the credit for making the decision and giving the command?

BamaD -> RE: Who Deserves the Credit for Osama's Demise? (5/6/2011 10:55:50 AM)
John Kerry said he wanted to take the fight against terrorism back to pre 911 so he wouldn't have formed the task force. The people who were there say the waterboarding was what broke the key people so the question is not can you prove we wouldn't have gotten the information anyway but can you be sure we would have gotten it without waterboarding.

MrRodgers -> RE: Who Deserves the Credit for Osama's Demise? (5/6/2011 10:55:50 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam quote: ORIGINAL: cuckoldmepls It's always good to see an intelligent black man reveal the hypocrisy of the democratic party. I love it. http://patriotpost.us/opinion/larry-elder/2011/05/05/bush-led-bin-laden-dead-wheres-the-credit/ I'm trying to figure out why it matters that he was black, white, brown or purple. Because that's what this post is ALL about...racism. We are here in this OP to try our best, our very best, to find a reason, any reason we could give credit to somebody...anybody else but Obama. Your link is just more unmitigated republican bullshit. The whole thing is just more propaganda to try to justify the continuing fascism of America. Torture works they say when neither you or they know for sure that it was used at all here, but they want you to believe it. 'Enhanced interrogation' is NOT 'CIA interrogation methods' that have been used not just by the CIA but law enforcement. You know those folks that can't torture or they are not legally allowed to say...torture a local felony suspect. Any hope-for hypocrisy of the democratic party is dwarfed every single day by the real experienced, almost professional hypocrisy of the repubs and all of their wingnut talking heads. The repubs are now the very dangerous warmongering, fascist 'liberals' in this country.

angelikaJ -> RE: Who Deserves the Credit for Osama's Demise? (5/6/2011 11:28:46 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: WantsOfTheFlesh Yes but not quite 100% because recognition of the divinity of Jesus Christ is essential in Christianity for one's salvation. He is quite literally another aspect of the Holy Trinity so with one faith seeing him as a phony prophet, another seeing him as a true prophet of a series and another seeing him another manifestation of true divinity, it can be said they are similar but different gods besides the very different teaching that accompanies each. In a sense the god of Judaism and Islam are closer because both just have one/singlular manifestation of God where neither see any of their holy prophets as divine - merely agents of that will. Unitarians aren't Christians? How interesting. *Some* of them might object to that. There is a branch of Pentacostalism called Oneness Pentacostal, they don't believe in the Trinity either. "Hear O Israel, the Lord thy God is one Lord." Some people only define Christians as those who accept Jesus as their personal saviour. Some people believe that Catholics aren't really Christians. So, it may be your belief that Christians have to believe in the Trinity but not all Christians will agree with you, just as not everyone agrees upon what qualifies someone as "Christian".

MrRodgers -> RE: Who Deserves the Credit for Osama's Demise? (5/6/2011 11:29:45 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: ArizonaBossMan DEAR LEADER! He is the bestest most magnificent more than a man a GOD I tell ya. Cancel the 2012 elections and just crown him for dang sake. ALL HAIL DEAR LEADER! See, here is a person who would have become a nazi, as this is exactly what the right overwhelmingly brandished upon Bush when he took us to war just like Hitler. Hillary and the rest of us were branded traitors...traitors to our country and simply for exercising their constitutional right to dissension ? You see how quickly they turn on any opposition. I am telling you kinkroids, this whole fucking thing is a fucking ruse. Bin Laden was in fact a CIA protege securing 'Northern Alliance' money from the CIA and then Stinger missiles to take out Soviet choppers. (1980-84) AFTER 9/11 out comes the term 'Al-Qeada', the new Bolsheviks of terrorism...created by the CIA. Let's look at some not so widely known facts about the Bin Ladens and the Bushes...ok ? Bush I and the Bin Laden family were original investors in the new at the time...Carlyle group, an American investment banking group HDQ'd in DC. They've made billion$ in trading paper. (not creating a single job BTW) Bush I was having a meal with the Bin Ladens on 9/11. Another Bush was doing the same with another Bin Laden family. Bush I has been to Saudi Arabia to do deals with the Bin Ladens with the endorsement of the Saudi crown. The entire Bin Laden family (residents of no. Va.) when ALL other...that's ALL other US airports were closed...were allowed to fly out of the country on 9/12...why ? Well, to avoid something called a free yet cowardly press, questions and of course, for their safety of course. Why ? Because as of 9/12, less than 24 hours after that attack, the US govt. knew they were going to pin it on some group called Al-Qeada and OBL, their son who had been disavowed by both family and the crown and even kicked out of Saudi. They are or were partners people...as in partners. 'Al-Qeada' does not really even exist. [It] was created to have 'them' available upon which our govt. heap blame for any and ALL operations...we are told by OUR govt.

jlf1961 -> RE: Who Deserves the Credit for Osama's Demise? (5/6/2011 12:13:35 PM)
Actually, the first time al Qaeda was ever mentioned was after the 1993 bombing of the WTC, followed by two embassy bombings, a bombing at a US military camp in Saudi Arabia, and the attack on the USS Cole. While it is true that Bin Laden was supplied by the US with weapons to fight the Soviets in Afghanistan, it is also true that after the soviets left Afghanistan, he turned to preaching against the evils of Israel, and by extension the United States. The United States became a real target after the first gulf war when we had troops stationed in Saudi Arabia. President Clinton had the CIA tracking his movements during his two terms in office and actually had been the president to come closest to taking him out. The op was called off because of the risk of collateral damage to non combatants.

LadyConstanze -> RE: Who Deserves the Credit for Osama's Demise? (5/6/2011 12:43:29 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: jlf1961 Actually, the first time al Qaeda was ever mentioned was after the 1993 bombing of the WTC, followed by two embassy bombings, a bombing at a US military camp in Saudi Arabia, and the attack on the USS Cole. While it is true that Bin Laden was supplied by the US with weapons to fight the Soviets in Afghanistan, it is also true that after the soviets left Afghanistan, he turned to preaching against the evils of Israel, and by extension the United States. The United States became a real target after the first gulf war when we had troops stationed in Saudi Arabia. President Clinton had the CIA tracking his movements during his two terms in office and actually had been the president to come closest to taking him out. The op was called off because of the risk of collateral damage to non combatants. Why don't we go back to who taught Bin Laden everything he knew to carry out the terrorist attacks, then go back which president has close relations with the family (i.e. the only deal that ever was successful because in everything else he was a failure, much like his 2 terms in office, which were basically just doing what daddy couldn't do), said president didn't manage to catch Bin Laden despite much publicity (there is a surprise) but got a 2nd term on the back of 9/11. Somebody obviously finished a job Bush was incapable or unwilling to do and now Bush deserves credit? Oh please, who gives him credit for ruining the economy? http://www.rense.com/general14/bushsformer.htm Edited to add a link

rulemylife -> RE: Who Deserves the Credit for Osama's Demise? (5/6/2011 12:55:06 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: BamaD John Kerry said he wanted to take the fight against terrorism back to pre 911 so he wouldn't have formed the task force. The people who were there say the waterboarding was what broke the key people so the question is not can you prove we wouldn't have gotten the information anyway but can you be sure we would have gotten it without waterboarding. The question is whether we want to be a society that condones torture.

DomKen -> RE: Who Deserves the Credit for Osama's Demise? (5/6/2011 3:33:21 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: BamaD The people who were there say the waterboarding was what broke the key people so the question is not can you prove we wouldn't have gotten the information anyway but can you be sure we would have gotten it without waterboarding. Actually the people who were there admit that KSM and the other 2 lied throughout the waterboarding and denied even knowing the nickname of the courier. The courier's nickname came from standard interogation procedures and it took years to find the guys last name and trace him through his family. If those we tortured had really broken they would certainly have not denied knowing the courier and likely knew his actual name which would have saved years of searching. It is the final proof that torture got us NOTHING.

NewOCDaddy -> RE: Who Deserves the Credit for Osama's Demise? (5/6/2011 4:15:21 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: cuckoldmepls This raid was a huge gamble. It could have blown up in Obama's face big time if they had attacked the wrong house, if Bin laden was not there or if the neighbors had all converged to destroy the attacking force like the did in Somalia. Now you can't tell me with the huge risk that was taken here, that he didn't authorize the mission for political reasons. With his popularity going down the crapper he had nothing to lose. Keep in mind too, that if it had not been to his political disadvantage, he would have instantly withdrawn from Afghanistan as soon as he took office. If you need further proof where his true alliances are, all you have to do is ask why won't he release the photos? They are going to extract revenge regardless so why not release them. The answer is he is still catering to the Muslim world just as he has been doing for the past 3 years. There was far bigger political risk in NOT authorizing action.

NewOCDaddy -> RE: Who Deserves the Credit for Osama's Demise? (5/6/2011 4:17:58 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: jlf1961 Actually, the first time al Qaeda was ever mentioned was after the 1993 bombing of the WTC, followed by two embassy bombings, a bombing at a US military camp in Saudi Arabia, and the attack on the USS Cole. While it is true that Bin Laden was supplied by the US with weapons to fight the Soviets in Afghanistan, it is also true that after the soviets left Afghanistan, he turned to preaching against the evils of Israel, and by extension the United States. The United States became a real target after the first gulf war when we had troops stationed in Saudi Arabia. President Clinton had the CIA tracking his movements during his two terms in office and actually had been the president to come closest to taking him out. The op was called off because of the risk of collateral damage to non combatants. The op was called off because WJC didnt think he had legal grounds to take him out, not because of collateral damage.

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