RE: Positive traits

RE: Positive traits (Full Version)

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MasterSlaveLA -> RE: Positive traits (5/15/2011 4:58:52 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LadyPact Can't help Myself, MSLA. As to positive traits, it might be a bit hard to define. We covered the actual sins but those are just part of the picture. If we'd like to think that we live in a world that has generally decent people in it, most of them aren't out killing and stealing for kicks. Even at that, we can't get some universal definition of where the lines are. When I saw the personality traits part, I'm thinking stuff like sense of humor, responsibility, temperament, and traits of that nature. Even there, you can't really ascertain that they are good or bad until you start interacting with the person who is doing the interpretation. Much easier to ask an individual where they lie on the scale in various areas than try shots in the dark. For me, "positive traits" are in the eye of the beholder. As an example, one person's "good provider" is another person's "work-a-holic". Just depends on the people involved. Same is true of "lying"... sometimes it's done for good reasons... like when the mother-in-law brings you some nasty-tasting stuff, and you say, "Thank you... that was delicious", as opposed to, "Holy crap... this tastes like sweaty monkey nuts!!!" -- not that I would know what "sweaty monkey nuts" taste like, mind you?!! [8D] lol

gungadin09 -> RE: Positive traits (5/15/2011 4:59:35 PM)
What i consider positive traits in a partner (must haves): honesty integrity compassion/goodwill/empathy intelligence sense of humor work ethic a certain degree of kink match consistency/lack of ambiguity a certain degree of chemistry What i consider negative traits in a partner (limits): Daddy- daughter dynamics illegal activity involving unconsenting 3rd parties in kink interfering with my job permanent marks or scars telling me what to think making major life decisions for me (where i live, whether i work, etc.) extroversion dishonesty cheaters lack of discretion i don't think that any universal list can be made. It is for the people in a relationship to decide for themselves what traits are positive and negative. No traits are universally positive or negative. There is also a certain degree of wiggle room. i'm not sure i know the person who is ALWAYS honest (even people who believe they're being honest can deceive themselves), ALWAYS consistent, ALWAYS hard working, etc. Nor is it possible to absolutely guarantee that a relationship and what we do will NEVER have any effect on my job, NEVER change how i think, NEVER involve an unconsenting third party, etc. It's probably possible to come up with some extremely far fetched example in each case that would disprove the rule. But these are the rules of thumb i go by. pam

agirl -> RE: Positive traits (5/15/2011 5:00:12 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: juliaoceania quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl quote: People who swear their honor and moral code is so high that they never do this worry me because either, as you said, they are liars or they're pretty much rude assholes who don't filter as you also mentioned. There is a middle ground between being someone who would lie than tell the truth and just blurting out your own "truth" to everyone as part of your moral crusade. There are also those who would rather say nothing. Always another option. You mean the lie by omission? [:D] I think that's a bit rich. I say nothing sometimes, because, in my view, at THAT time, it is a waste of energy. The "company" surrounding me is unlikely to understand that I am not, in anyway, an advocate. No-one is actually saying PRECISELY what and who they'd lie about. I mean, I've paid for PC games knowing that my sons were underage for them. I've stymied movies I thought weren't suitable whether age related or not, no matter how much they wanted to see them. I see the system as the system, but not for MY blood-related offspring and not for me, specifically. I've been through the rinser enough times to realise that being blunt about the fact that you lie is likely to bring condemnation here. There are many reasons that I'd lie, which would be met with "You only have to say this" to be honest. I don't CARE to be honest, it doesn't crimp or crumple me to lie creatively, or when I think it's needed. It's second nature! I look to what I am hoping to achieve, and how it's likely to affect me and mine. I'm choosing things that suit OUR herb garden, not what suits the rest of the jolly old UK. I'm universally accepted as a very straight-forward, reliable and honest person........despite the fact that I'm clearly not. Fuuny old world, isn't it? agirl

tazzygirl -> RE: Positive traits (5/15/2011 5:07:12 PM)
exactly pam. to me, those positive or negative traits are those i decide are positive or negative. doesn't matter what anyone else thinks. So its extremely subjective.

leadership527 -> RE: Positive traits (5/16/2011 8:01:41 AM)
When I'm evaluating someone "on the whole" as a human being, I don't look for specific traits. I look to see if they have a generally positive influence on those around them. If people who brush up against me in my life generally end up better for the experience then I think of myself as "a good man". That's the same yardstick I use for others. Maybe put differently, I look for actual results rather than try to setup rules before-hand. So, "It is a universally positive trait" to "do good" when one can.

PdxJ -> RE: Positive traits (5/16/2011 8:54:03 AM)
I have my values, and if you don't like them, well I've got some others. - Mark Twain

needlesandpins -> RE: Positive traits (5/16/2011 12:00:27 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LadyPact Oh, this is the part where somebody pulls up the hypothetical, "but if you were being attacked by an intruder in your home, with a gun to your head, and he asked you if anyone else is home..........." Or "Your kid is under investigation for a crime, and if he were to be convicted of that crime would be sentenced to the death penalty, would you provide an alibi." No offense, but is there any possible way that we can actually do this topic without the life and death, odds of one in a million scenarios, and just address it the way most of us have our day to day lives in the bell curve? I'm not in any form of relationship (authority dynamic or otherwise) where anybody is stealing to feed their family, so without that exception, I don't want somebody who steals in My life. Unless it's self-defense or war, I don't want them shooting anybody. If I ask MP a straight question, I expect a straight answer. The same goes with clip. On the "lies of omission" bit that people like to throw around, I would love to know how this has transpired into 'if you don't mention that you didn't want tomato on your sandwich at lunch, you're omitting the truth'? Can't people decide between the two of them through communication what is important and what isn't? Somehow, if I don't like a shirt and tell someone so, that means I lack empathy? It's not the same thing as forgetting to mention that you had a nooner in the parking lot because the other person at home thinks you are being faithful to them. If you can't prioritize what the person in your life expects you to be forthcoming about or not, such as sex during your lunch break rather than whether or not you had tomato, there's a bigger issue than what can be handled on a message board. this has made the most sence to me. as for people who want honesty, well i'm one of them. i'd rather deal with the truth as it is than be shammed by a lie. sometimes the truth hurts, but the smallest lie can hurt far more. if i ask a question i want the total truth. if i ask 'does my arse look big in this?' 'do i look crap?' i want an honest answer otherwise i wouldn't be asking. i've been lied to in big ways and it's really bad for me. it hurts in a way i hate. as for would i lie for my son? no i wouldn't. he's been told as much too. he's also been told that if he commits a crime and i know about it i'd be just as likely to shop him for it than anyone else. i'm not having my son commit crimes thinking i'm stupid enough to cover for him. would i lie to save his life? depends on why his life is in danger. i'll tell you this though, if you were to ask me what i think of your dress/suit...whatever, i'll tell you the truth. lying screws me up too, i hate the guilt of it. i'm not saying i've never lied, but there has been alot i've had to justify to myself to make that horrid feeling worth it. that is what i ask myself, is the lie worth that feeling even though the truth will hurt. i'm afraid i'm not going to choose that feeling for just anyone or anything. as for what i find positive as traits in others. i think it varies from person to person, kinda how they carry and apply traits. i'm actually more likey to be looking for the lack of things i don't like, like self absorbed vanity, lack of manners, vulgarity for the sake of it and so on. i don't pay much attention to how someone writes as an example of their intellect. probably because both my ex and son have huge problems with writing, but both are intellegent enough to be understood and be good people in r/l. i do have to say though that it is making a wonderful change to have someone to talk to who is on the same level or higher than myself. needles

DesFIP -> RE: Positive traits (5/17/2011 5:45:13 AM)
I have to say that much of it is situational. I won't kill, but I know that if you're in the military, then the ability to do so is a positive thing. I don't lie as a default option, but a pow lying to protect the rest of his unit is a positive thing. Like Lady Pact said, you know what it is that's important. And having tomato on a sandwich only comes into that category if you're allergic to them. Or if your partner is so allergic that just kissing you after you ate on would cause a bad reaction for them.

crazyml -> RE: Positive traits (5/17/2011 6:27:23 AM)
<FR> Really good idea to post this tazzygirl, And for the purposes of disclosure it was me! To the OP : I agree that definitions of positive and negative traits are bound to be subjective, but I also believe that there are some universally positive traits too. If you take a simply "social" benchmark, I'd hope that these traits resulted in a net of social good - Take honesty - I'd apply this in its broadest sense - Honesty towards others and to oneself. I think that there are definitely cases where lying is justified and positive but it's one of those areas where if you choose to break the rule "be honest" then you'd better be prepared for the consequences. Integrity is an important trait, as is open mindedness.

SailingBum -> RE: Positive traits (5/17/2011 1:17:05 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MasterSlaveLA quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl quote: I have huge issues with lying. Its something I cannot bring myself to do.... Universally positive traits? Like not killing? Im not so sure. I would kill for my child... You'd probably "lie" for your child too, no??? Hell YA.... In a heartbeat, and kill someone if need be. letsay some ex was stalking your kid. Lets further say you needed a alibi on a certain night to deal with some issues. Assume the stalker issue solved. Now you don't have to kill someone to make them go away a serious hurt does the exact same thing. BadOne

NocturnalStalker -> RE: Positive traits (5/17/2011 1:31:07 PM)
People should stop being so black & white about their morals.

mnottertail -> RE: Positive traits (5/17/2011 1:37:31 PM)
I am rather motile and nebulous in the field of morals, myself.

ChatteParfaitt -> RE: Positive traits (5/17/2011 1:55:39 PM)
Morality for me is based on my own personal codes of ethics, which are extremely subjective and extremely relative. For instance, I consider myself a pacifist, and so by definition am morally against violence and especially war. Both are reprehensible to me. But if I was being attacked, I know for a fact I would fight back, I would violently defend myself. If there was a war here and my home town were invaded, I would go to the front lines to help the injured. Even in this instance I would refuse to fight as a soldier. But if an enemy soldier tried to kill me or hurt me, again I would fight back. I can easily say thievery is wrong and against my moral code. But I can guarantee you I would not starve to death if I had no food. I'd steal some. Personally I have no problem with people having their own situational ethics. It's those people who have no personal ethics and have to look to the government of the church to supply their morality who scare me. JMO, YMMV

agirl -> RE: Positive traits (5/17/2011 2:32:34 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: leadership527 When I'm evaluating someone "on the whole" as a human being, I don't look for specific traits. I look to see if they have a generally positive influence on those around them. If people who brush up against me in my life generally end up better for the experience then I think of myself as "a good man". That's the same yardstick I use for others. Maybe put differently, I look for actual results rather than try to setup rules before-hand. So, "It is a universally positive trait" to "do good" when one can. This suits me quite well. I've never found that peoples morals fit neatly into each and every situation. I've seen good men bend theirs, and I've done it myself often enough. I also tend to view people on the whole.........because I jolly well would prefer than I am. Situationally, and in a moment by moment manner, I have plenty of deficits and if I was scrutinized I could easily be seen as rather vile. I think s trait I appreciate hugely is understanding. Other than that, traits that are universally lauded mean little without a helicopter view. agirl

tazzygirl -> RE: Positive traits (5/17/2011 2:45:54 PM)
Thats part of why this thread began. Its the assumption that we hold other people to our values... sometimes without knowing the values of the person we are assuming about. If a man steals a car... he is a thief. If he steals a car to take his kid to the hospital, is he still the same thief? If a mom shoplifts, she is a criminal. If she shoplifts diapers, is she still the same level of thief you believed her to be? Values are a great thing to have. But my "value" may not be yours.

cactustree -> RE: Positive traits (5/17/2011 2:52:48 PM)
morals? cactus

Iamsemisweet -> RE: Positive traits (5/17/2011 2:53:21 PM)
To me, not lying and not killing, or vice versa, are more positive (or negative) BEHAVIORS than traits. I consider a trait to be a personality characteristic that can manifest itself in behavior. Having a sense of morality is a trait, for example, as are being pleasant and empathetic. I think there can be much broader agreement on what is a positive trait than on what is a positive behavior.

sexyred1 -> RE: Positive traits (5/17/2011 3:23:31 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl Thats part of why this thread began. Its the assumption that we hold other people to our values... sometimes without knowing the values of the person we are assuming about. If a man steals a car... he is a thief. If he steals a car to take his kid to the hospital, is he still the same thief? If a mom shoplifts, she is a criminal. If she shoplifts diapers, is she still the same level of thief you believed her to be? Values are a great thing to have. But my "value" may not be yours. I totally agree with this. There are definite differences in the reasons why things are done as in your above examples. I also agree that some universal traits, such as what slaveluci said about having empathy and compassion,would be ideal if everyone had them. I don't consider those to have subjective value; they have universal value since interpersonal communications among people would improve with their utilization. The thing that I despise is when someone holds others to judgements about traits they themselves possess; but are not self aware enough or just too arrogantly blind to see. The whole double standard is beyond annoying.

tazzygirl -> RE: Positive traits (5/17/2011 3:36:35 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: cactustree morals? cactus What about morals? Do you subscribe to everyone must have the same morals as everyone else?

agirl -> RE: Positive traits (5/17/2011 4:43:07 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl Thats part of why this thread began. Its the assumption that we hold other people to our values... sometimes without knowing the values of the person we are assuming about. If a man steals a car... he is a thief. If he steals a car to take his kid to the hospital, is he still the same thief? If a mom shoplifts, she is a criminal. If she shoplifts diapers, is she still the same level of thief you believed her to be? Values are a great thing to have. But my "value" may not be yours. I don't expect ANYONE to be anything like me, my morals, my values or my rather dodgy ethics......I tend to just be in their company. I don't actually need to take issue with anyone elses values, even if they don't mirror mine, to enjoy that. I hold differing views on aspects of all sorts of things to my sons. I might not agree with them, but they hold them for their own good reason, as do I. I have a friend, who's 25yrs younger than me, a big, black male and boy oh boy do we differ in our outlook in loads of ways....but he's a fabulous Scrabble partner and we can go out and do crazy things together because we just like each other. Despite everything, we are comfy together and just enjoy each others company. We genuinely like each other on the whole as Jeff says. I think his values stink at times, and he thinks mine do too. We have a bash about them now and then, and then go for a bike ride or to the sea-side or play scrabble, eat, drink and laugh. Why would I hold people I DON'T know to my values ,when I don't hold the people I DO know and care about, to them?...lol Where values are concerned, the only person I have to care about is myself and what I think of me. I live MY way and I can live quite contentedly with people that live theirs, whether I agree with them or not. agirl

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