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A Defense project that could be cancelled and save bill... - 6/3/2011 6:43:08 PM   
jlf1961


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From: Somewhere Texas
Status: offline 		As of February of this year, the US Air Force has spent $5.2 billion on the Airborne Laser project.

The system is designed to shoot down ICBM's and TBM's during the boost phase of their flights.

Sounds great, a system that would shoot down enemy missiles BEFORE they actually became a threat to the US.

However, there are a few small, incidental, almost meaningless little items that are not talked about when the project is mentioned to the general public.

These are:


quote:

Air Force Chief Schwartz has said that the system "does not reflect something that is operationally viable.”


quote:

Secretary of Defense Gates said that "I don't know anybody at the Department of Defense, Mr. Tiahrt, who thinks that this program should, or would, ever be operationally deployed. The reality is that you would need a laser something like 20 to 30 times more powerful than the chemical laser in the plane right now to be able to get any distance from the launch site to fire.

"So, right now the ABL would have to orbit inside the borders of Iran in order to be able to try and use its laser to shoot down that missile in the boost phase. And if you were to operationalize this you would be looking at 10 to 20 747s, at a billion and a half dollars apiece, and $100 million a year to operate. And there's nobody in uniform that I know who believes that this is a workable concept."


Now for the kicker, Boeing Aircraft just got a 4.2million dollar 16 month contract to build a new laser to mount on the 747 test aircraft.

Now if the air force is no longer asking for funding for the project, why the hell are they building another laser for the damn thing?


< Message edited by jlf1961 -- 6/3/2011 6:44:15 PM >

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RE: A Defense project that could be cancelled and save ... - 6/3/2011 7:02:05 PM   
farglebargle


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Status: offline 		We have drones, which a cruiser can deliver plenty of. Why are we building all those new aircraft carriers, and why are we still maintaining B-52s?



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RE: A Defense project that could be cancelled and save ... - 6/3/2011 7:19:25 PM   
jlf1961


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quote:

ORIGINAL: farglebargle

We have drones, which a cruiser can deliver plenty of. Why are we building all those new aircraft carriers, and why are we still maintaining B-52s?





Actually, the B52 can still perform missions that the B1 cannot perform. The B52 has a much larger bomb load and longer loiter time over a target area.

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Boy, it sure would be nice if we had some grenades, don't you think?

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RE: A Defense project that could be cancelled and save ... - 6/3/2011 7:45:55 PM   
farglebargle


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Status: offline 		And drones make B-52's obsolete. They can linger WAY longer.

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RE: A Defense project that could be cancelled and save ... - 6/3/2011 7:48:08 PM   
willbeurdaddy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961


Now if the air force is no longer asking for funding for the project, why the hell are they building another laser for the damn thing?



Since the premise is wrong, the question is moot. The project is still being funded, with a change in status.

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RE: A Defense project that could be cancelled and save ... - 6/4/2011 1:15:02 AM   
outhere69


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quote:

ORIGINAL: farglebargle

And drones make B-52's obsolete. They can linger WAY longer.

They don't have nearly the same payload.

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RE: A Defense project that could be cancelled and save ... - 6/4/2011 3:42:13 AM   
Rule


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quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961
Now if the air force is no longer asking for funding for the project, why the hell are they building another laser for the damn thing?

They have another war objective.

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RE: A Defense project that could be cancelled and save ... - 6/4/2011 4:18:40 AM   
FullCircle


Posts: 5713
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Status: offline 		Yep you can melt a tiny hole into a dictators head from the air. One minute you are walking down the road minding your own business and the next minute uncle Sam has sliced your ear off by accident. You wasn't wearing a luminous hat and this is why we thought you were an enemy combatant.

It's like those high powered microwave devices, they want to develop one that can boil someone's brain juice, then it'll be like putting eggs in microwaves (messy).


< Message edited by FullCircle -- 6/4/2011 4:21:05 AM >

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RE: A Defense project that could be cancelled and save ... - 6/4/2011 4:27:35 AM   
SilverMark


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Rule

quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961
Now if the air force is no longer asking for funding for the project, why the hell are they building another laser for the damn thing?

They have another war objective.


Let's hope NOT!

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RE: A Defense project that could be cancelled and save ... - 6/4/2011 6:13:36 AM   
DarkSteven


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Status: offline 		Let's be real.  Shooting down a missile requires power.  A LOT of power.

While lasers are incredibly accurate, they're lousy at power conversion.  Last I heard, they took 1000 watts of input power to produce one watt of output.  Yeah, 0.1% efficient.  That means that having a ground based laser to take out a missile is pretty difficult to power.  Making the thing airborne - forget it.


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RE: A Defense project that could be cancelled and save ... - 6/4/2011 6:36:30 AM   
farglebargle


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quote:

ORIGINAL: outhere69

quote:

ORIGINAL: farglebargle

And drones make B-52's obsolete. They can linger WAY longer.

They don't have nearly the same payload.



How many drones can you buy for the cost of maintaining the B-52s?

We're not penetrating Soviet airspace to drop nukes anymore. The mission is changed. Now we launch a hellfire through someone's window while they're sleeping.

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RE: A Defense project that could be cancelled and save ... - 6/4/2011 9:56:03 AM   
FirmhandKY


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DarkSteven

Let's be real.  Shooting down a missile requires power.  A LOT of power.

While lasers are incredibly accurate, they're lousy at power conversion.  Last I heard, they took 1000 watts of input power to produce one watt of output.  Yeah, 0.1% efficient.

I think you are working from out-dated data, Steven.

Plus, there are some interesting low power diode lasers that get a very respectable conversion factor, indicating that even better factors are possible with high power lasers.

Firm


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RE: A Defense project that could be cancelled and save ... - 6/4/2011 10:13:09 AM   
willbeurdaddy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DarkSteven

Let's be real.  Shooting down a missile requires power.  A LOT of power.

While lasers are incredibly accurate, they're lousy at power conversion.  Last I heard, they took 1000 watts of input power to produce one watt of output.  Yeah, 0.1% efficient.  That means that having a ground based laser to take out a missile is pretty difficult to power.  Making the thing airborne - forget it.



They tested it live a year ago, and it worked fine AFAIK.

Edit:

whoomp there it is

< Message edited by willbeurdaddy -- 6/4/2011 10:18:51 AM >

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RE: A Defense project that could be cancelled and save ... - 6/4/2011 12:35:15 PM   
jlf1961


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From: Somewhere Texas
Status: offline 		The problem with the system is that it needs to be within 600 miles of the target, WHICH MEANS IT WOULD HAVE TO ORBIT INSIDE THE TERRITORY OF THE NATION FIRING THE MISSILE.

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Boy, it sure would be nice if we had some grenades, don't you think?

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RE: A Defense project that could be cancelled and save ... - 6/4/2011 2:12:55 PM   
DomKen


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Boost phase interception with a laser requires line of sight to the missile while it is going up, as pointed out that means close to the launcher. It is ridiculous to think we would keep multiple jumbo jets airborne over/near hostile nations 24/7.

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