to say no..

to say no.. (Full Version)

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snugglepuss -> to say no.. (6/9/2011 12:19:45 PM)
a simple and direct question here. when is it ok to refuse your master? and what should i do if he doese not listen to a no?

hlen5 -> RE: to say no.. (6/9/2011 12:22:30 PM)
Welcome to CM and the forums (hands you a flame-retardant suit), congrats on your first post!!

mnottertail -> RE: to say no.. (6/9/2011 12:23:12 PM)
Dont know your situation but it is not simple. Simple answer if you want it, bottom line rule the world, 2 minutes, how do i do it? if you cant live with it, walk, right fuckin now. Otherwise, what is it? Is there any why to it? is it a matter of how? is it who? what? when? where? If you are willing to take a dogfucks worth of beating...I'd probably say you felt pretty adamant about that no.... Otherwise, maybe.

snugglepuss -> RE: to say no.. (6/9/2011 12:26:40 PM)
thank you for the welcome. mnottertail i am so sorry but english is not my first language i dont realy understand what you want to say.

DarkSteven -> RE: to say no.. (6/9/2011 12:29:13 PM)
That is a tough question. Just WHY are you saying no? Example: If I tell her we're eating out and she says no, that could be due to several things: She could think I'm denigrating her cooking. She could just not feel up to going out. She could be broke and yet not feel right about me paying. She could feel sick and not want to eat at all. She could have plans and not want to spend the extra time eating out. She could have already prepared a very nice dinner. I'm trying to say that the No itself could be a sign that she doesn't feel submissive to me. Or it could be something ridiculously simple. Your responsibility as a slave is to explain the reason behind your No. His responsibility is to assess and make the decision. If you still do not agree with his decision, then as a slave, you have to ask yourself if you can trust and obey him. If so, go along. If not, examine why now - it could be that you are mentally preparing to leave the relationship. What is it you are saying No to?

RapierFugue -> RE: to say no.. (6/9/2011 12:30:04 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: snugglepuss a simple and direct question here. when is it ok to refuse your master? and what should i do if he doese not listen to a no? Oh Lordy. There are so many variables to this one that it’s almost impossible to answer coherently. One could, however, consider the following; Is it a M/s dynamic, or a D/s one? If you have given yourself completely, under what terms? Have you ever been given a chance to enumerate your hard limits? If not, why not? Why are you saying no? If it’s a “genuine” no, why is your Master not able to handle the situation? Etc etc ... it’s a minefield, TBH. One thing you can be sure of is that any “Master” who says “just obey, all the time, without reason” isn't what they claim to be.

snugglepuss -> RE: to say no.. (6/9/2011 12:36:06 PM)
it is a more basic no. i dont meen the "please master i cant today" i meen the no that comes when your limit has been breached or an agreement wallked over

snugglepuss -> RE: to say no.. (6/9/2011 12:41:55 PM)
i understand the problem and realice i have been a bit shallow in what i am asking. i am new in this life and have been tought to always obay. but i do have my limits. and to be expised to them is not in my wishes, i am slave and wish to be so. but i think i still desirve some respect as a living being.. i have never been asked for my hard limits. but i do give them. the question is genniral but based on the real no. the one saying i have no intrest in being in this situation

RapierFugue -> RE: to say no.. (6/9/2011 12:45:56 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: snugglepuss i understand the problem and realice i have been a bit shallow in what i am asking. i am new in this life and have been tought to always obay. but i do have my limits. and to be expised to them is not in my wishes, i am slave and wish to be so. but i think i still desirve some respect as a living being.. i have never been asked for my hard limits. but i do give them. the question is genniral but based on the real no. the one saying i have no intrest in being in this situation Only you know what sort of relationship you have with your Master, but it's worth remembering that, if you're new to all this, someone making you feel like you're doing wrong for saying "no" when they haven't previously bothered to get to know you well enough to understand where your limits are, is ... well I have my opinion of such people, but as I say I don't know your dynamic, so labelling them as a terminal fuckwit would be a bit of a punt on my part.

snugglepuss -> RE: to say no.. (6/9/2011 12:51:47 PM)
this is someting to think on. thank you for sharing your opinion. maybe i should try to have a serius talk where i can air my thoughts and conserns openly. but then how do one start a talk like that? i meen you should not contredic your master and to say he acts wrong is not a good thing eather.. this is a realy tight rope to walk on.

RapierFugue -> RE: to say no.. (6/9/2011 12:57:17 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: snugglepuss this is someting to think on. thank you for sharing your opinion. maybe i should try to have a serius talk where i can air my thoughts and conserns openly. but then how do one start a talk like that? i meen you should not contredic your master and to say he acts wrong is not a good thing eather.. this is a realy tight rope to walk on. Maybe you should. Even an M/s or D/s relationship is still a relationship. If you haven't signed up to a specific set of terms, or have no means to express your fears or concerns, then I fear (and again, I don't know your situation) that you're dealing with a shouty amateur. For someone who has been in the lifestyle for years it's one thing (although even then they'd have enough knowledge to know and understand what they were signing up for). To make a newbie feel like any question is a wrong thing just isn't right, in my opinion at least.

snugglepuss -> RE: to say no.. (6/9/2011 1:05:10 PM)
thank you for geting my mind to start working a bit. i will think and then have a talk. then it is all up to him i guese. i will have to tell him my needs and limits once more and make sertin he hears them. i so hate to be loud. and if he cant understand then i dont know. you have been a big help

RapierFugue -> RE: to say no.. (6/9/2011 1:11:18 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: snugglepuss thank you for geting my mind to start working a bit. i will think and then have a talk. then it is all up to him i guese. i will have to tell him my needs and limits once more and make sertin he hears them. i so hate to be loud. and if he cant understand then i dont know. you have been a big help Sorry? Once more? You've been over your limits previously?

snugglepuss -> RE: to say no.. (6/9/2011 1:16:52 PM)
i have told him yes. about the limits. he did not ask me but i did tell him in our talk to get to know echother fase. i told him what i was looking for and also what was my hard limits. but i feel they are geting more and more smudged so to say. he is stepping at the edges all the time. pushing at the walls. this makes me unsecure as well as it is so suttle. i dont want to look like a nag or just spoiled. i dont know when to stop him. i dont realy know how to explain it. the language makes my thoughts come out a bit mixed up.

DarkSteven -> RE: to say no.. (6/9/2011 1:21:26 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: snugglepuss i have told him yes. about the limits. he did not ask me but i did tell him in our talk to get to know echother fase. i told him what i was looking for and also what was my hard limits. but i feel they are geting more and more smudged so to say. he is stepping at the edges all the time. pushing at the walls. this makes me unsecure as well as it is so suttle. i dont want to look like a nag or just spoiled. i dont know when to stop him. i dont realy know how to explain it. the language makes my thoughts come out a bit mixed up. Um. If he knows your limits and is determined to push them, he sure as hell better know what he's doing. The way you described it sounds like he knows what he wants and is pushing you there, limits or no. If that's your take, then you need to talk with him to see where he wants you to go and if you're comfortable going there.

snugglepuss -> RE: to say no.. (6/9/2011 1:27:11 PM)
i dont mind being molded and guided. i even welcome it as i am still new to this life and have not yet found all that i am/ can be. but still i do know what i dont wish to do or to be done to me. it is like if i dont want him to touch my toes he grabes the toe nail instead. doese that make any sence?

RapierFugue -> RE: to say no.. (6/9/2011 1:36:25 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: snugglepuss i dont mind being molded and guided. i even welcome it as i am still new to this life and have not yet found all that i am/ can be. but still i do know what i dont wish to do or to be done to me. it is like if i dont want him to touch my toes he grabes the toe nail instead. doese that make any sence? Yes. He hasn't got much of a clue, and neither have you. The thing is, you aren't (as a newcomer) supposed to have a clue. If he's calling himself a Master, he is. If he's pushing previously un-discussed limits, or overstepping hard limits, then he has to accept the occasional "no". If that's an issue for him then you can make your own mind up as to the degree of competency you're dealing with. TBH it sounds to me like you want to be "forced", and this thread is just a way of you feeling better about it. I've given my opinion, so I'm ducking out, coz only you know how happy with it you are.

snugglepuss -> RE: to say no.. (6/9/2011 1:49:01 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: RapierFugue quote: ORIGINAL: snugglepuss i dont mind being molded and guided. i even welcome it as i am still new to this life and have not yet found all that i am/ can be. but still i do know what i dont wish to do or to be done to me. it is like if i dont want him to touch my toes he grabes the toe nail instead. doese that make any sence? Yes. He hasn't got much of a clue, and neither have you. The thing is, you aren't (as a newcomer) supposed to have a clue. If he's calling himself a Master, he is. If he's pushing previously un-discussed limits, or overstepping hard limits, then he has to accept the occasional "no". If that's an issue for him then you can make your own mind up as to the degree of competency you're dealing with. TBH it sounds to me like you want to be "forced", and this thread is just a way of you feeling better about it. I've given my opinion, so I'm ducking out, coz only you know how happy with it you are. thank you for all the help. i know my language makes my thoughts and what i want to say not come out as planed all the time. forcing can truly be intresting but as i am not needed to be forced as i wish to please the one i am with. i like foce of the body but i do wish my limits to be respected and dont like to be forced in that sence. i dont feel uncomftible with who/what i am. if it was only about me wanting him or anyone to force me to comply i would not have stared this thread. i am not shamed with myself or my desires or needs. thank you all for listening and for giving advise. i to give up this. it seems i cant get out what i want to say or ask advice about.

MisterStrongWill -> RE: to say no.. (6/9/2011 2:08:11 PM)
More details would help but, limits should be clear in any situation. Stand firm to them. slave vers sub is always the shaky ground and it sounds like you are on it.

DesFIP -> RE: to say no.. (6/9/2011 2:35:27 PM)
If he promised not to do something and then did it, that means he isn't trustworthy. He's a liar. Why did you commit to him before you had dated enough to see what kind of person he was? If this is something that you will never trust him again as a result, then the relationship is already over. What might he do to you next time, now that you know he doesn't care about how you feel?

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