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The Great Cancer Hoax: - 6/11/2011 2:17:06 PM   
subfever


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Watch how the corrupt system most of you support operates, in this free (until June 13th) documentary:

The Brilliant Cure the FDA Tried Their Best to Shut Down:
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RE: The Great Cancer Hoax: - 6/11/2011 2:27:39 PM   
Musicmystery


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quote:

the corrupt system most of you support

????

(in reply to subfever)
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RE: The Great Cancer Hoax: - 6/11/2011 2:29:05 PM   
pahunkboy


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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antineoplaston

(in reply to subfever)
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RE: The Great Cancer Hoax: - 6/11/2011 2:29:49 PM   
kalikshama


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

quote:

the corrupt system most of you support

????


I'm guessing this:

quote:

You will learn that not only did the US Federal government spend 14 years actively suppressing a cancer treatment that had a FAR greater success rate than any other treatment available, they also spent well over $60 million of US taxpayer dollars trying to put the inventor of the treatment in jail in order to steal his patents and either suppress or cash in on his discovery.

(in reply to Musicmystery)
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RE: The Great Cancer Hoax: - 6/11/2011 2:33:21 PM   
pahunkboy


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People on facebook drive crazy over breast cancer fund raising.

There will never be a cure.   Why?   Rather then sell you a $10,000 cure-  they can bill you $200k for stringing you along.

Our health system is celebrated by how much cash it brings in-  not how effective it is.

Until that model changes-  we will always have half measures and dead ends. 

(in reply to kalikshama)
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RE: The Great Cancer Hoax: - 6/11/2011 2:42:39 PM   
DomKen


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Burzynski is a fraud artist. He fakes his data. Otherwise other doctors could replicate his treatments and get similiar results (they have never been able to).

(in reply to pahunkboy)
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RE: The Great Cancer Hoax: - 6/11/2011 3:46:28 PM   
subfever


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quote:

I'm guessing this:

quote:

You will learn that not only did the US Federal government spend 14 years actively suppressing a cancer treatment that had a FAR greater success rate than any other treatment available, they also spent well over $60 million of US taxpayer dollars trying to put the inventor of the treatment in jail in order to steal his patents and either suppress or cash in on his discovery.


Very good...

(in reply to kalikshama)
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RE: The Great Cancer Hoax: - 6/11/2011 3:50:49 PM   
subfever


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

Burzynski is a fraud artist. He fakes his data. Otherwise other doctors could replicate his treatments and get similiar results (they have never been able to).


It would behoove you to at least watch the documentary first, as it clearly dispels your false notions with very convincing evidence.

(in reply to DomKen)
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RE: The Great Cancer Hoax: - 6/11/2011 3:53:03 PM   
jlf1961


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

Burzynski is a fraud artist. He fakes his data. Otherwise other doctors could replicate his treatments and get similiar results (they have never been able to).



Well, reading the link provided by hunky, I see that at least one reputable cancer institute could not duplicate the results and the japanese had limited success.

If their are questions about the validity of the claims, why is subfever making a fuss, or is this one more conspiracy theory being posted?

_____________________________

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(in reply to DomKen)
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RE: The Great Cancer Hoax: - 6/11/2011 4:01:17 PM   
BKSir


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Okay, let's say, just for the sake of argument, that it is real. Fine. (I sincerely doubt that it is, but, I'm not a doctor and I'm trying to be fair here.)

Why is he so concerned about it trying to be squashed by the government, and about them trying to seize the data and hide it from everyone? This is 2011, we have this new and amazing thing now called an "internet". You may or may not have seen it, but it is there. How does one make sure information NEVER disappears again? Put it on this "internet" thing we have. Seriously, email it out to EVERYONE! Put it on blogs. Put it on youtube. Plaster it everywhere. Takes an hour or two at most to have something saturating the internet so much that it will never ever go away.

Why doesn't he do that?

Is it because he's afraid someone else will patent it and perfect it first and he'll lose all that money? If so, wouldn't that make him just as bad as the rest who are keeping us from a cure just so they can charge over and over for more profit?

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(in reply to jlf1961)
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RE: The Great Cancer Hoax: - 6/11/2011 4:02:39 PM   
subfever


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quote:

There will never be a cure.


There will never be a cure as long as we operate under a monetary-economic paradigm.

Remove the money paradigm, and cancer will soon be history.

(in reply to pahunkboy)
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RE: The Great Cancer Hoax: - 6/11/2011 4:15:32 PM   
jlf1961


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If I may be so bold as to point out a few facts.

1) Cancer is a group of diseases, each on different and treated in different ways. There is no "cure all" treatment.

2) Many cancers can now be cured, with good results. Medicine has made steady progress, and many people with cancer can now be cured – but no one has discovered the one cure for all cancer.

3) The cancer researchers has found a genetic link to some cancers, so unless you can treat the cancer at a genetic level, you cant really cure it.

4) With all these facts, anyone that claims to have found a single cure all for cancer, that cannot be duplicated is a fraud.

_____________________________

Boy, it sure would be nice if we had some grenades, don't you think?

You cannot control who comes into your life, but you can control which airlock you throw them out of.

Paranoid Paramilitary Gun Loving Conspiracy Theorist AND EQUAL OPPORTUNI

(in reply to subfever)
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RE: The Great Cancer Hoax: - 6/11/2011 5:09:15 PM   
Aneirin


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Maybe cancer is just part of us, a variable in our lives so nature can take it's course.

But I do agree, whilst there is big money in cancer research, there will never be a cure.


_____________________________

Everything we are is the result of what we have thought, the mind is everything, what we think, we become - Guatama Buddha

Conservatism is distrust of people tempered by fear - William Gladstone

(in reply to jlf1961)
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RE: The Great Cancer Hoax: - 6/11/2011 5:10:51 PM   
DomKen


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quote:

ORIGINAL: subfever


quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

Burzynski is a fraud artist. He fakes his data. Otherwise other doctors could replicate his treatments and get similiar results (they have never been able to).


It would behoove you to at least watch the documentary first, as it clearly dispels your false notions with very convincing evidence.

I've read the actual papers. I've also followed the fact that serious cancer researchers tried to follow his protocol and had nothing like his claimed success rates. One basic inescapable fact is that science is not valid if it cannot be reproduced.

Since Burzynski charges 100k+ for his treatment, despite the drugs being made by simple techniques from common low cost chemicals, I know he is simply enriching himself off the desperation of people who have terminal cancer.
http://www.quackwatch.org/01QuackeryRelatedTopics/Cancer/burzynski1.html

(in reply to subfever)
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RE: The Great Cancer Hoax: - 6/11/2011 5:51:24 PM   
subfever


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quote:

I've read the actual papers. I've read the actual papers. I've also followed the fact that serious cancer researchers tried to follow his protocol and had nothing like his claimed success rates. One basic inescapable fact is that science is not valid if it cannot be reproduced.


Who's actual papers did you read? The film shows how Burzynski's protocols were not followed. But you have not watched it, have you?

It is also an inescapable fact that tests can be skewed to produced desired results.

quote:

Since Burzynski charges 100k+ for his treatment, despite the drugs being made by simple techniques from common low cost chemicals.


And conventional cancer treatments cost an average of $500,000, while producing inferior results. Do you want to discuss the profits of mainstream pharmaceuticals too?

quote:

I know he is simply enriching himself off the desperation of people who have terminal cancer


You know only what mainstream media tells you.

You status quo defenders are all the same. You defend the monetary economic system that requires us to feed of each other, but the moment someone outside-the-box threatens the profits of the status-quo establishment, then you have a problem with profit.

(in reply to DomKen)
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RE: The Great Cancer Hoax: - 6/11/2011 6:03:16 PM   
Kirata


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

http://www.quackwatch.org/01QuackeryRelatedTopics/Cancer/burzynski1.html

You're a scream. Quackwatch? Get a hobby. Quackwatch is operated by quackpot Stephen Barrett, M.D.

Barrett is also on the Board of the NCAHF, the (self-proclaimed) "National" Council Against Health Fraud, along with fellow quackpots William T. Jarvis, Ph.D., John Renner, M.D., and Victor Herbert, M.D., as well as being the owner and Webmaster of the NCAHF.org website. In addition, Quackwatch is "affiliated" with about 22 other look-alike "watch" sites, all of which proudly "accept donations" and run Google ads for profit.

A Modern Day Witch Hunt.

K.



< Message edited by Kirata -- 6/11/2011 6:11:50 PM >

(in reply to DomKen)
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RE: The Great Cancer Hoax: - 6/11/2011 6:10:02 PM   
subfever


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quote:

A Modern Day Witch Hunt.


Nice find.

(in reply to Kirata)
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RE: The Great Cancer Hoax: - 6/11/2011 6:40:59 PM   
IceDemeter


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Just a few questions to think about:

--- He has a multi-million dollar facility with multiple staff - is he not running this as a profitable business?

--- If this is running as a profitable business, how does it differ from any other pharmaceutical company?

--- Why has nobody else, following standard protocols, been able to duplicate his reported results?

--- Why, in the decades since he first came up with this, has he not had any version make it through peer-reviewed, standard protocol Phase II clinical trials to the point of full approval? There certainly are a lot of drugs produced both by large pharmaceutical companies and by small, independent producers who have managed the feat.

As someone who has lost loved ones to various cancers, you can bet that I have done the research both on standard and "alternative" treatments. This is one that didn't pass the smell test when I first researched it almost a decade ago and doesn't pass it now.

Internationally there are a host of researchers in universities, in private labs, in governments, and in large pharmaceutical companies who have been working diligently for decades looking for cures for the myriad of cancers that exist. Very few of these researchers are in a position to profit personally from what they find. These are people who are very careful to follow accepted protocols so that they don't miss possible toxicities, so that they will be able to list expected side-effects, and so that their results can be replicated by others. These are the folks who have come out with treatments that had no problem being accepted by the FDA and the counterparts of the FDA in other countries.

I find it reprehensible the amount of gross misinformation that is spread by conspiracy theorists who state that there is a "cure for cancer" already discovered but not used because someone would lose profits. If this were true, would there be a polio vaccine? Would there be continuous advancements in antibiotics? Would the successful treatments for various cancers that have come out over the past decades be in standard usage? Do these theorists really believe that all of the researchers out there would silently watch their own loved ones suffer and die of cancers but still withhold the "cure" from the rest of the world? Do they think that the purveyors of "alternate" treatments are not profiting from their wares but only "Big Pharma" is making money from peoples' suffering?

Pfft - do more than watch an infomercial created and paid for by the one who serves to profit by those convinced by its pseudoscience. Start looking at the amazing work being done in the US, in Isreal, in Germany, in the UK - heck, even here in Canada - especially at the universities. Start researching what the difference is between a Phase I and a Phase II clinical trial. Start meeting with some of the researchers in person and hear what kind of effort that they put in to make sure that they are doing science, and not alchemy. If you don't have access to the papers that aren't in the public domain, then make friends with someone at your nearest university and get their access, and make friends with someone in the medical community to get their access.

The "great Cancer hoax" is all of the snake-oil salesmen who profit greatly by taking advantage of people when they are most vulnerable --- advocating use of products with no proven results, no testing, no trials, and nothing other than anecdotes to back their claims.

(in reply to subfever)
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RE: The Great Cancer Hoax: - 6/11/2011 7:00:03 PM   
Kirata


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quote:

ORIGINAL: IceDemeter

Why has nobody else, following standard protocols, been able to duplicate his reported results?

Do you know for a fact that anyone has tried, or are you taking DomKen's word for it? Risky business, that.

Burzynski claims they altered the protocols and accepted patients for whom a different protocol, involving higher dosages, would have been required. And not one of us is in a position to know for an absolute fact which is true. The film, however, does show copies of letters that support Burzynski's claim. And while we're all entitled to believe whomever we wish, we're not entitled to issue statements of fact about things of which we are ignorant.

K.

(in reply to IceDemeter)
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RE: The Great Cancer Hoax: - 6/11/2011 7:17:10 PM   
subfever


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quote:

advocating use of products with no proven results, no testing, no trials, and nothing other than anecdotes to back their claims.


I see you haven't watched the documentary either.

(in reply to IceDemeter)
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