RE: Seeking Permissions

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SpiritedRadiance -> RE: Seeking Permissions (6/22/2011 2:08:11 AM)
[Edited because its stupid to argue with a wall]

SpiritedRadiance -> RE: Seeking Permissions (6/22/2011 2:10:35 AM)
Hannah, theres no point in trying to explain or argue this situation with you because you arent going to understand it, or your just going to curse a lot to cover up the fact that. Not everything in life is as simple as you make it out to be. In my Job my main rule is ignorance is okay, Pride is not.

agirl -> RE: Seeking Permissions (6/22/2011 2:15:58 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: HannahLynHeather yeah, it was a crappy example. no argument there. Fucking hell......... not a fuck in sight in your reply!!! :)(lighthearted response) I have to admit it was a welcome reprieve!. Bloody hell, Hannah, you have such a lot of really great stuff to say.......entertaining as well as sensible and insightful.....I KNOW you write as you speak....but damnnnnnnn.....I can't wade through reams of fucks.....LOL I mentally edit 50% of them out...:).I once read one of your longer posts out loud, to myself........it was a funny 5 mins:) Hope you don't take an old lady too seriously:).Don't change... just edit.....LOLOL agirl

Charnegui -> RE: Seeking Permissions (6/22/2011 2:51:51 AM)
Once he'd try to restrict my movements, so I needed permission to go anywhere, except for going with my dog. Well, that's a huge opening there grinning and I did take a lot of advantage of that. But then, asking to add someone to my IM took several hours and I did add the person without permission. When it does not have any repercussions, you keep doing what you do. He has to restrain me onto a wall or something, will I stop finding the gaps he left. And I am very sourcefull finding them. grinning It is not, that I refuse to obey, it is the my disobedience has no consequences

HannahLynHeather -> RE: Seeking Permissions (6/22/2011 3:05:40 AM)
we're not talking about your fucking job! it was an example and an admittedly shitty one. let me ask you a question. if you needed permission to cum, would you really fucking expect your dom to make himself available 24/7 to answer your requests to get your happy on? would you really expect to be able to call him at 3 fucking am and ask to get a quickie in on your break and not face some sort of repercussions?

HannahLynHeather -> RE: Seeking Permissions (6/22/2011 3:08:29 AM)
hey, what can i say, sometimes a fuck just isn't fucking appropriate. [:D] actually i'm trying to cut them back some at heather's request.

thishereboi -> RE: Seeking Permissions (6/22/2011 4:09:45 AM)
quote: If the s-type asks permission for something, is the d-type expected/required to answer? What if he doesn't answer or is too busy? If the D says she has to ask, then yes, he should have to answer. Or he should make plans on what the sub should do if she can't contact him.

agirl -> RE: Seeking Permissions (6/22/2011 4:16:56 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: HannahLynHeather hey, what can i say, sometimes a fuck just isn't fucking appropriate. [:D] actually i'm trying to cut them back some at heather's request. Winks in that internetty winky way because I can't add an emoticon no matter how often I've tried for an embarrassing amount of years. ;) agirl

kalikshama -> RE: Seeking Permissions (6/22/2011 4:27:28 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: HannahLynHeather sorry syl, but its not true. think of it in the context of work. your fucking boss makes loads of rules, there's all sorts of fucking things you need permission to do, but you don't expect him to be available all day long to answer your fucking questions do you? My subordinates DO expect me to be available all day long to answer questions. I'm training someone new and his questions are exhausting but expected. What annoys me is when I'm asked questions that people could find the answers themselves if they put in a little effort - Google, Google Desktop, etc. My 20 something coworkers want instant gratification and I keep asking them to prioritize by urgency and email rather than IM, IM rather than coming to my desk, etc. I need to work on insisting on these boundaries. I'm perfectly capable of discerning if my own questions need to be answered NOW and can move onto the next task while I await a response.

HeatherMcLeather -> RE: Seeking Permissions (6/22/2011 4:29:43 AM)
quote: If the D says she has to ask, then yes, he should have to answer. Wouldn't no answer be an answer?

ChatteParfaitt -> RE: Seeking Permissions (6/22/2011 4:31:57 AM)
Great thread topic !! Any permission seeking requires enough discussion so the s-type is totally clear on what they can and cannot do. Now that's a fine and dandy statement most of us can agree with. Issues arise when the dom requires constant permission for every little thing in a s-type's life, even when the dom is not there. Although much can be covered by: if you can't get a hold of me, take care of your basic needs as best you can and then report to me, this only works with a mature thinking s-type who is non-manipulative. We know from what we hear on this very board, not all s-types fit this description. In the other thread the dom appeared to have the opinion that his s-type was immature, an idiot, incompetent to look after herself, highly manipulative and looking for reasons to disobey. Now, if this was really true, why on earth would be waste a second on her? It bothers me when doms think so little of their s-type. Or automatically assume they want to disobey, or are manipulative, whatever. Are there some s-types like that? Oh sure. But most I have seen in real time truly want to be obedient and would rather stab themselves in the eyeball with a dull fork than not follow the rules as set out. Permission seeking is one thing when you know for a fact your s-type is strongly motivated to obey. It's my opinion that if the s-type does not have that strong motivation, he/she is not ready for the type of power dynamic in which micromanaging plays a part. Edited more than once b/c I'm just not awake yet.

SpiritedRadiance -> RE: Seeking Permissions (6/22/2011 5:47:04 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: HannahLynHeather we're not talking about your fucking job! it was an example and an admittedly shitty one. let me ask you a question. if you needed permission to cum, would you really fucking expect your dom to make himself available 24/7 to answer your requests to get your happy on? would you really expect to be able to call him at 3 fucking am and ask to get a quickie in on your break and not face some sort of repercussions? Yes Because He took on the responsibility that required me to ask permission knowing my schedule and me before making the rules and before taking me as his submissive. If you want that level of control you cant get it with out an added level of responsibility. That means making yourself available when you might not want to. Theres a reason why I own a cat over a dog, because i dont want the added responsibility of having to be home several times a day to take the dog out on a walk to go to the bathroom. I know that i cant handle that level of commitment, so I got a cat who did not require those things. IF my partner doesnt want to be called at 3 am for me to ask permission to cum, then he needs to put in a rule that says "no touching while at work" Or Not put that restriction. Why? Because if thats the rule, Im going to call him most likely more then once to get permission. I am currently inservice to a household with very few but very clear requirements, If the Owner of the house calls, I pick up No ifs no ans no buts, My boss knows this and i will pick up the phone in the middle of a meeting and ask if its an emergency or if i can call Him back. If i wish to play with anything that has a penis, I have to ask, He understands that this means several phone calls at weird hours, or even me standing at the edge of a scene of His to ask. The last rule is if I need him Im to call him, He will pick up, no ifs no ans, no buts Im not to wait till the next time I see him, Im to call and ask if i need something that requires Him or His input. He knows this means added work to himself He knows that this means it might cut into his sleep, or his play time or anything involving himself. But he understands that HE created the rules no one else, and its HIS responsibility to be available for me to follow his rules. He cant expect me to follow his rules if hes not around to grant or deny permission as necessary. Could most of what i ask Him for wait? Yes it could, does it? No. Why? Because His rules state that i dont. It might not work for you or be your opinion and thats superfantastic. But i would hope if you cant care for a dog in the way its required you wouldnt get one, the same if you had a submissive who had such expectations as i do that you wouldnt take on someone like me, because it wouldnt work well. But its my very strong opinion that to have ANY control it requires a certain level of responsibility.

LillyBoPeep -> RE: Seeking Permissions (6/22/2011 6:06:16 AM)
in all fairness Hannah, you did make it about her job by insulting her ability to hold her job. if you fail to see that as a reality, then perhaps that's your problem, not hers? anyway, to the topic, if permissions aren't required i don't see the point of asking for permission. it seems like you're just making work for yourself or for the Leaderperson. but i also think, with new rules, some people still feel unsure and will continue to ask until they feel comfortable. i didn't have a whole lot that i had to ask permission for, i just basically went by "what would M do" or what would he think was appropriate, and that was that. if he was with me, he'd make adjustments. if he wasn't, he figured i could get along on my own. it wasn't all that hard, but then again, ours wasn't a micromanagement dynamic. but even still, if you have a micromanagement dynamic and you live in it for a while, i imagine that that gets easier, too.

HeatherMcLeather -> RE: Seeking Permissions (6/22/2011 6:35:06 AM)
wrong window again!

HannahLynHeather -> RE: Seeking Permissions (6/22/2011 6:37:52 AM)
quote: if you had a submissive who had such expectations as i do that you wouldnt take on someone like me don't worry, there isn't a fucking chance in hell of that ever happening, i want a sensible girl without unreasonable expectations. edited because i'm a fucking nimrod (thanks kalikshama)

kalikshama -> RE: Seeking Permissions (6/22/2011 6:40:06 AM)
quote: Theres a reason why I own a cat over a dog, because i dont want the added responsibility of having to be home several times a day to take the dog out on a walk to go to the bathroom. I know that i cant handle that level of commitment, so I got a cat who did not require those things. I like this analogy and will expand on it. I have been a cat person all my adult life and now that I am single, the next pet I get will again be a cat for precisely the reasons you described. However, in 2007 my ex Dom brought home a beautiful husky that he'd found wandering the streets of Atlanta. Husky was a LOT of work. He had separation anxiety so R ended up taking him to work. He couldn't be alone with the cats, so I moved out of our bedroom and into the second bedroom because Husky didn't want to sleep alone. (Husky was a much better bedmate, BTW :) I believe all the care needed and his very lack of independence led to a greater bond between us. I've never felt the way I did for him for a cat. (Sadly, he died young of cancer.) While I personally find micro managing a negative, I wonder if this leads to a deeper bond in humans as well? I suppose it could also lead to enmeshment and unhealthy dependence. Thoughts?

kalikshama -> RE: Seeking Permissions (6/22/2011 6:44:01 AM)
now moot

HannahLynHeather -> RE: Seeking Permissions (6/22/2011 6:45:23 AM)
quote: in all fairness Hannah, you did make it about her job by insulting her ability to hold her job. if you fail to see that as a reality, then perhaps that's your problem, not hers? there was no insult, just the truth. and if you can't see that you don't know a thing about networking.

KnightofMists -> RE: Seeking Permissions (6/22/2011 6:46:47 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: SpiritedRadiance quote: ORIGINAL: KnightofMists these Masters should be hung upside down and beatend till their brains fall out... How dare they not be at the beck and call of their s-type!!! Its not that they are at the beck and call of their submissives its more, You the dominant are demanding this control over the submissives life, YOU not the submissive, shes doing her job as YOUR sub to follow YOUR rules. YOU put YOURSELF in this situation not anyone but YOU... In my case it wouldnt work because of the shift I work I work 12 am to 8 am, when most people are asleep, If i need to get a soda because im falling asleep on my shift, im not going to wait for you to wake up. If my boss says Your working till 10 today Im working till 10 that day, unless i have reason to not work such as class or a Doctors appointment. If you want the control its your responsibility to maintain the control If you dont want the responsibility of the control, dont request the control. If you dont want her being upset or feel like your not living up to your end of the agreement, then be a responsible Dominant and respond as necessary, In a timely fashion... Or remove the restrictions that require you the additional work. Im expected to respond to the Owner of the house I belong to when He calls or gets in contact of me regardless of what im doing, regardless of how busy I am. And I answer as I'm supposed to, even if its to say, Im doing X can i call you back. If i call him Hes expected to pick up the phone regardless of what hes doing. Why because i only call when I have need for His advise or response. Hes not at my beck and call, he set rules and he understands that by setting them theres now a requirement on his part to respond. First of all... My comment was in jest and you clearly took it seriously. I was going to ignor your post because frankly it from a rather narrow perspective as well as amusing First of all.. I don't demand control over them. They gave authority to me. I do demand and expect obedience because of that transfered authority. There is a huge difference between authority and control but that is another disussion. Now... I found later discussions with regards to the job rather amusing. I found it amusing... because I am the Boss that gets the calls. I run a 200 milliion a year 24/7 operation and have over 50 direct employees that I will be their first call and double that when you take in the support people that could call me as well. It's actually pretty rare that they need to call and it's always when the process requires them to call. They have a rule book that is over 3 inches thick and then there is policies and procedures that they also have which are as equally thick. On occassion, I get calls that are just stupid and needless. If they paid attention to the processes that are already in place, they would of had there answer so times it alittlle coaching is needed in these cases. On extremely rare occassions a call comes in that isn't covered by the processes in place.... but you can bet your ass that it will be in place after the call. I train my employees to be empowered and skilled to do the job they have delegated authority to make certain decisions and not others. The ones they don't they call me... and they also have back up process to call if I am not availalbe like now since I am on a weeks vacation!!! and sometimes I don't answer because I am on the toilet! My girls are not alot different in this regard. Kyra already showed an example how one can develop processes that can cover a situation that wasn't covered previously. They have processes to follow and they are intelligent skill individiuals that can apply the right process with the right situation. They even understand what to do when they don't have a process and can't reach me for direction. It's really fairy tale to think an M type is going to answer every call for their S-type. It's not all that complex or difficult... I do it my work life and I do it my personal life! I do it literally 24/7

SpiritedRadiance -> RE: Seeking Permissions (6/22/2011 6:46:55 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: HannahLynHeather quote: if you had a submissive who had such expectations as i do that you wouldnt take on someone like me don't worry, there isn't a fucking chance in hell of that ever happening, i want a sensible girl with unreasonable expectations. If you wouldnt mind keeping your personal attacks to yourself, Its not necessary. Im Not unreasonable, Nor am I lacking of sense However that might be called into question because I'm doing little more then debating points with a wall....Im simply NOT compatible with someone who NEEDS rules like Permissions but doesnt want the added hassle of being around to enforce those rules.

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