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What is Your Definition of Masculine? - 5/17/2006 3:04:35 PM

anthrosub

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In a recent conversation, the term "masculine" was used which got me thinking. I did a search of the discussions here but didn't find anything discussing this specifically. I realize it's subjective (just like what does it mean to be "plus sized"), so I thought I would put the question out there.

For myself, I've never really given this term much attention. I don't think of myself as masculine...just male. To be honest, I really don't know what it means in today's society. In the past, I've probably equated it more to "macho" than anything else. Women I've known in the past have consistently told me that although I'm not effeminate, I definately don't display the less attractive qualities of being "a guy" (such as knowing who played what sport and what the score was last night, having a close relationship with beer, having trouble showing emotions, etc.).

So what is it...physically and psychologically? Is it having big arms and a rippled set of abs? Is it having a deep voice and piercing eyes of stone? Is it having some sort of quiet strength that eludes a sense of calm in the face of calamity? I'd love to hear your thoughts.

Thanks so much,
anthrosub

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RE: What is Your Definition of Masculine? - 5/17/2006 4:22:53 PM

thetammyjo

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There are the sociological/psychological meanings that one can use to figure out one's gender. I did one of these in my undergraduate days and came back androgynous (high masculine and high feminine charactistics in terms of personality).

I think I use masculine as meaning traditional interests/behavior or looking highly male -- facial hair, body hair, big upper body, small lower body, muscles.

I don't find myself attracted to either of the above.

So I think of myself as more attracted to androgynous people -- hate body hair, not really into deep voices or squeaky voices, cares about others but not afraid to stand up for him/herself, etc. Yet I could see myself relating very nicely to a person with the above traits if other personality traits and interests meshed well.

The problem I have is that I know this is all gender and a lot of it is related to how we are raised. We live in a society where the idea of only two genders and only two sexes is appealing -- I hate that I could buy into any of that at all because my history knowledge and skills shows me that it is flexible.

So I'm left with how to describe the people I like and explaining it. Bah, I should just try to stick to personality traits and interests. Cause even using androgynous is buying into the constructs.

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RE: What is Your Definition of Masculine? - 5/17/2006 5:04:32 PM

anthrosub

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What is happening with Collarme's message boards? I can't edit my own posts anymore?

I used the word "eludes" above when I meant to use "exudes." No big deal but I hope folks will make the leap in meaning.

anthrosub

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RE: What is Your Definition of Masculine? - 5/17/2006 6:09:43 PM

Slipstreme

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I see masculine as taking on the roles, behaviour and personality traits inherent in the traditional "male" model. By this definition I consider myself masculine (although I seek to be more and more masculine as well).

Sorry Tammyjo, I want my muscles. :P

Of course, as society becomes more tolerant of people who decide to live more "masculine" or "feminine" lives so will the definitions and the thoughts behind these words change. Hopefully soon, too will the line between gender normally be seen as blurred. As it is, it makes genderqueer and transgendered living difficult, and as I have decided to start living my life more male, it will become harder for me as well. I know a couple of TS friends who have a very difficult existence.

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RE: What is Your Definition of Masculine? - 5/17/2006 7:01:01 PM

thetammyjo

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Slipstreme

I see masculine as taking on the roles, behaviour and personality traits inherent in the traditional "male" model. By this definition I consider myself masculine (although I seek to be more and more masculine as well).

Sorry Tammyjo, I want my muscles. :P

Of course, as society becomes more tolerant of people who decide to live more "masculine" or "feminine" lives so will the definitions and the thoughts behind these
words change. Hopefully soon, too will the line between gender normally be seen as blurred. As it is, it makes genderqueer and transgendered living difficult, and as I have decided to start living my life more male, it will become harder for me as well. I know a couple of TS friends who have a very difficult existence.

Muscles are useful.

Afterall they help me walk around and lift stuff. They help Fox bring in 12 bags of groceries at once. They help me feel capable of defending myself well should I have to.

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Love, Peace, Hugs, Kisses, Whips & Chains,

TammyJo

Check out my website at http://www.thetammyjo.com Or www.tammyjoeckhart.com

And my LJ where I post fiction in progress if you "friend" me at http://thetammyjo.livejournal.com/

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RE: What is Your Definition of Masculine? - 5/17/2006 7:04:48 PM

TeeGO

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Why me of course.

quote:

Main Entry: 1mas·cu·line
Pronunciation: 'mas-ky&-l&n
Function: adjective
Etymology: Middle English masculin, from Middle French, from Latin masculinus, from masculus, noun, male, diminutive of mas male
1 a : MALE b : having qualities appropriate to or usually associated with a man
2 : of, relating to, or constituting the gender that ordinarily includes most words or grammatical forms referring to males

Main Entry: 2masculine
Function: noun
1 : the masculine gender
2 : a noun, pronoun, adjective, or inflectional form or class of the masculine gender
3 : a male person

Bottom line, masculine means male. Nevermind what others use as criteria to describe this, to thine ownself be true. Simply put, if you are a male, it is you.

< Message edited by TeeGO -- 5/17/2006 7:05:57 PM >

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RE: What is Your Definition of Masculine? - 5/17/2006 7:46:13 PM

MsMacComb

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quote:

ORIGINAL: anthrosub
What is happening with Collarme's message boards? I can't edit my own posts anymore?
anthrosub

There is a time limit of a few minutes which allows you to edit. After that time has expired its "set".

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RE: What is Your Definition of Masculine? - 5/17/2006 7:53:14 PM

MsMacComb

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I see masculine as a male who never feels he has to prove he is masculine. Self confidence and good self esteem is not the same as false bravado, macho actions and stutting around like a peacock.
I see people like my husband as very masculine. For one reason is that he is obviously large, strong, built and could be more macho than most guys without trying, and all the other usual traits that go with that term. But more so is that he is kind, compassionate, intelligent and has no ego. His place in the world, acceptance of himself and the comfort that goes with that transcends the normal male ego. Its like his quiet strength, in more ways than one, surpasses the need for a "public ego".
I sometimes think (and have written) that sub males might be the truly most "masculine" males alive.

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RE: What is Your Definition of Masculine? - 5/17/2006 8:06:22 PM

LadyHugs

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Dear TeeGO, Ladies and Gentlemen;

TeeGO has nailed what masculine is all about. Being male and proud of it.

Other than the Washington Redskin's football "Hog-ettes" -- I just have eyes for men who are naked in their glory.

Respectfully submitted,
Lady Hugs

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RE: What is Your Definition of Masculine? - 5/17/2006 8:38:11 PM

MistressLorelei

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I view someone masculine as someone who possesses mental and physical strength, yet does not need to prove to the world that he is indeed 'masculine'. He can surrender totally to the right dominant woman... not just *any* dominant woman. Mentally, it's attitude, ambition, and self confidence. Physically, it's the way he carries himself, it's how he dresses and cares for himself, it's the presence of the attributes specific to the male gender (chest, body hair, 5:00 shadow, height, voice), I like if a male looks like a male... if I want him to appear feminine I will give him panties.

The more confidence a male has in his masculinity, the easier he can be sensitive, compassionate, and in touch with his feminine side. I agree... submissive males are often the most masculine males there are.

I think sure, all males are males, but some are more 'masculine' than others. Some women have masculine traits, and some men have feminine traits. A textbook case of male is different than how I view the question posed by the OP.

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RE: What is Your Definition of Masculine? - 5/17/2006 8:46:13 PM

Lashra

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quote:

ORIGINAL: MsMacComb

I see masculine as a male who never feels he has to prove he is masculine. Self confidence and good self esteem is not the same as false bravado, macho actions and stutting around like a peacock.
I see people like my husband as very masculine. For one reason is that he is obviously large, strong, built and could be more macho than most guys without trying, and all the other usual traits that go with that term. But more so is that he is kind, compassionate, intelligent and has no ego. His place in the world, acceptance of himself and the comfort that goes with that transcends the normal male ego. Its like his quiet strength, in more ways than one, surpasses the need for a "public ego".
I sometimes think (and have written) that sub males might be the truly most "masculine" males alive.

I would most certainly agree with that. Give me a sub male any day. For some reason really Alpha males remind me of brute creatures. They do alot of chest beating and preening and really don't make a whole lot of sense. I don't find them sexy at all, you can't really talk to them because they are usually to busy telling you how great they are.

~Lashra

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RE: What is Your Definition of Masculine? - 5/17/2006 10:22:14 PM

MochaMistress

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Masculine is TeeGo. I agree. Just because a male is submissive doesnt mean he cant be masculine. He is all male and freaking proud of if.

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RE: What is Your Definition of Masculine? - 5/17/2006 11:25:20 PM

MsMacComb

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lashra
I would most certainly agree with that. Give me a sub male any day. For some reason really Alpha males remind me of brute creatures. They do alot of chest beating and preening and really don't make a whole lot of sense. I don't find them sexy at all, you can't really talk to them because they are usually to busy telling you how great they are.
~Lashra

All talk and no cock, lol?

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RE: What is Your Definition of Masculine? - 5/17/2006 11:35:50 PM

DigitBox

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Masculinity is kind of a social template for the normal male behaviour. Women can posses it too, just as men can possess feminine traits.

I grew up in a culture of masculinity and wore it like a mask until I was able to cast it off and just be myself. That's not to say I abandoned all masculine traits. I simply reverted to my natural state.

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RE: What is Your Definition of Masculine? - 5/18/2006 4:40:01 AM

Lashra

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quote:

ORIGINAL: MsMacComb

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lashra
I would most certainly agree with that. Give me a sub male any day. For some reason really Alpha males remind me of brute creatures. They do alot of chest beating and preening and really don't make a whole lot of sense. I don't find them sexy at all, you can't really talk to them because they are usually to busy telling you how great they are.
~Lashra

All talk and no cock, lol?

Oh most of them have cock they just don't know how to use it.

Or they are trying to hump everything that gets into their path, its all very ridculous really.

~Lashra

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RE: What is Your Definition of Masculine? - 5/18/2006 5:51:12 AM

DiannaVesta

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I believe masculine and feminine is not gender specific. I’ve dated bio women that were more masculine then the men I know and know effeminate men who don’t have a masculine thread in their body.
IMO I believe that masculine and feminine is identity. Like yin and yang – positive and negative they both exist within us. If your identity projects more of one type of energy that is how you ID. If you balance both, such a androgyny then that is how you ID.

In the butch femme world I ID as femme. As with D/s there is a dynamic between the ID’s and that’s what they strive for. In D/s the energy projected is projective and receptive, literally feeding off this energy. I really want to use another term here but I just haven’t had enough coffee yet!

Anyhow the dichotomy he is that we’ve been taught that masculine is projective and feminine receptive. This is fine in procreation, however it’s a fact that each ID can be both or adopt elements of what is perceptive as their opposite. Ex: I am a dominant woman – he is an effeminate man. Perhaps this is why there is such a struggle with femdom relationships. Its not that it goes against ones nature but that it conflicts with the archetypes we’ve been taught to believe. Once you free yourself from this and allow you energy to naturally flow the end result is balance. There is so much guilt associated with these dynamics. Rather then debate them I try to just understand the complexity of them as one of life’s great mysteries.

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RE: What is Your Definition of Masculine? - 5/18/2006 5:58:43 AM

DiannaVesta

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lashra

quote:

ORIGINAL: MsMacComb

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lashra
I would most certainly agree with that. Give me a sub male any day. For some reason really Alpha males remind me of brute creatures. They do alot of chest beating and preening and really don't make a whole lot of sense. I don't find them sexy at all, you can't really talk to them because they are usually to busy telling you how great they are.
~Lashra

All talk and no cock, lol?

Oh most of them have cock they just don't know how to use it. Or they are trying to hump everything that gets into their path, its all very ridculous really.

~Lashra

Lol- OH MY I admit this type of thing turns me on. I better be careful or I will be accused of being a man hater. I agree with you. Although I can get along in almost any space, if needed, I prefer the company of submissive men. It just suits my nature better and I love the dynamic.

BUT when it comes to cocks I prefer mine in the nightstand. I use them when I want, they never make a mess, let me down, always the size I want BIG and they never go soft. Yes, of course I find real cocks amusing. I like hanging things from them, laughing at them and I learned a very long time ago that the little head controls the big head IN ANY MAN.

< Message edited by DiannaVesta -- 5/18/2006 6:11:51 AM >

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RE: What is Your Definition of Masculine? - 5/18/2006 6:08:02 AM

GddssBella

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G'morning all:

Having aleady expressed my views regarding masculinity, I'll simply provide the link. Got to love that search function. Post # 206 on the link. http://www.collarchat.com/m_74787/mpage_11/key_/tm.htm

Stay safe, play nice, & share your toys w/ others...

Bella

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RE: What is Your Definition of Masculine? - 5/18/2006 7:25:10 AM

LadyMedhbh

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My definition of masculine comes from a Female Supremacist point of view. I personally find that men who are completely secure in their masculinity also feel a strong need to submit to a Woman. Ergo, that is what I view as masculine.

Mind you, this is my experience and you may disagree... more power to anyone who can think for themselves and not be a sheep.

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RE: What is Your Definition of Masculine? - 5/18/2006 7:38:01 AM

cloudboy

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I've been into watching BIG VALLEY these days on Encore, and to me HEATH BARKLEY is the architypal Male. I also think the TV wonks back then saw Lee MAJORS as the epitome of Masculine. I would agree with their assessment.

1. Physically strong
2. Independent (makes up his own mind about things)
3. Gentle and Considerate
4. Comfortable with himself
5. Intuitive
6. Kind of Quiet / Reflective
7. Open Minded
8. Devoted to family
9. Self sacrificing
10. Generally effective
11. Prefers action over words
12. In tune with nature, animals, and the outdoors.
13. A keen sense of fairness
14. Is not self centered and connects well with others.
15. Brings out the better side of those around him.
16. Is modest but confidant.
17. Communicates directly and sometimes with subtlety when needed.
18. Is fundamentally honest.
19. Holds firm to his principles
20. Is a quick draw, has a mean uppercut, and is otherwise someone you don't want to tangle with, but who never
ever picks on anyone out of mean spiritedness.
21. Is always aware of his surroundings
22. Knows how to enjoy himself and derive satisfaction out of living.
23. Can get away with wearing a pink shirt.
24. Is hairly, but not too hairy.
25. Has high octane common sense.

< Message edited by cloudboy -- 5/18/2006 7:45:26 AM >

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