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Religious Imagery and Bdsm ? - 7/19/2011 3:06:37 AM

Aneirin

Posts: 6121
Joined: 3/18/2006
From: Tamaris
Status: offline

As it appears to interest me greatly and I suppose oddly because I am not religious nor do I subscribe to the religious origin of such imagery, I just wanted to open a discussion about the subject of religious imagery as a scene for BDSM activity.

Subjects such as crucifixion as venerated by the websites;

Crucified women

Crux Dreams

Oddly but perhaps not so in some respects, very little depicting male crucifixion, or is that considered gay, what's wrong with male beauty ?

Then there is Altar sex, imagery of such I have not yet found aside from the alter christian type, which was probably part of my draw towards paganism back when I was younger.

With me, I do understand where lot of the imagery that excites comes from, as I have an interest in the beauty of vulnerability and display, the sodding church helped with that, all those very realistic crucifixes and saintly images that one saw in Roman Catholic churches. I often wonder if the imagery was designed to stir sexual feelings in the viewers for the purposes of guilt purification, a case of provide the bait and catch the sinner.

But anyway, the subject of religious imagery, sexual fantasies based upon religion, what do you think, wholesome or blasphemous ?

_____________________________

Everything we are is the result of what we have thought, the mind is everything, what we think, we become - Guatama Buddha

Conservatism is distrust of people tempered by fear - William Gladstone

Post #: 1

RE: Religious Imagery and Bdsm ? - 7/19/2011 3:33:19 AM

kalikshama

Posts: 14805
Joined: 8/8/2010
Status: offline

quote:

But anyway, the subject of religious imagery, sexual fantasies based upon religion, what do you think, wholesome or blasphemous ?

Neither. Edgy?

Here's photographer Alan Pedroso's nun series. Warning - the adult disclaimer is in effect for a reason.

http://scoptophilia.blogspot.com/2010/11/alan-pedroso-nun-sense.html?zx=b8b70d2e50297820

(in reply to Aneirin)

Post #: 2

RE: Religious Imagery and Bdsm ? - 7/19/2011 3:39:20 AM

LaTigresse

Posts: 26123
Joined: 1/15/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Aneirin

As it appears to interest me greatly and I suppose oddly because I am not religious nor do I subscribe to the religious origin of such imagery, I just wanted to open a discussion about the subject of religious imagery as a scene for BDSM activity.

Subjects such as crucifixion as venerated by the websites;

Crucified women

Crux Dreams

Oddly but perhaps not so in some respects, very little depicting male crucifixion, or is that considered gay, what's wrong with male beauty ?

Then there is Altar sex, imagery of such I have not yet found aside from the alter christian type, which was probably part of my draw towards paganism back when I was younger.

With me, I do understand where lot of the imagery that excites comes from, as I have an interest in the beauty of vulnerability and display, the sodding church helped with that, all those very realistic crucifixes and saintly images that one saw in Roman Catholic churches. I often wonder if the imagery was designed to stir sexual feelings in the viewers for the purposes of guilt purification, a case of provide the bait and catch the sinner.

But anyway, the subject of religious imagery, sexual fantasies based upon religion, what do you think, wholesome or blasphemous ?

To ME, neither. It's just a kink for some people. How each of those people came by their individual kinks is probably as individual as they are.

To determine whether or not they are wholesome or blasphemous would require buying into the dogma of most organized religiouns, and I don't.

_____________________________

My twisted, self deprecating, sense of humour, finds alot to laugh about, in your lack of one!

Just because you are well educated, articulate, and can use big, fancy words, properly........does not mean you are right!

(in reply to Aneirin)

Post #: 3

RE: Religious Imagery and Bdsm ? - 7/19/2011 4:06:21 AM

0ldhen

Posts: 2221
Joined: 12/27/2010
From: Henhouse in Trolltopia, Harleyville USA
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I am afraid I am also in the neither catagory.

It is appealing to some I guess, like peep shows are appealing to some because it strikes that chord in them that says it is dirty and or forbidden........

_____________________________

Everyone crashes. Some get back on. Some don't.

Za'beeta Regal, Et Vogo O' Lurwadra'd Wyka Go Abosh Inunsey.

(in reply to Aneirin)

Post #: 4

RE: Religious Imagery and Bdsm ? - 7/19/2011 4:40:19 AM

ExSteelAgain

Posts: 1803
Joined: 7/2/2006
From: Georgia
Status: offline

I'm sure there are situations in churches of all kinds where the minister or whatever you call him develops submissive behavior in women who please him in many ways. Sure he probably uses every religious connotation he can come up with. That's been around a long time.

_____________________________

You can paint a cinder block bright pastel pink, but it's still a cinder block. (By Me.)

(in reply to 0ldhen)

Post #: 5

RE: Religious Imagery and Bdsm ? - 7/19/2011 5:16:32 AM

ChatteParfaitt

Posts: 6562
Joined: 3/22/2011
From: The t'aint of the Midwest -- Indiana
Status: offline

Very interesting topic, OP.

In my mind, certain things about BDSM attract certain types of people specifically b/c they see it as profane or perverse or blasphemous. I tend to think those who are seriously into religious blasphemy as a form of BDSM play are toying with the concept of how very "wrong" it is.

But as LaT so elegantly stated: "How each of those people came by their individual kinks is probably as individual as they are."

I recall a Christian phrase: judge not, lest you be judged.

_____________________________

(in reply to ExSteelAgain)

Post #: 6

RE: Religious Imagery and Bdsm ? - 7/19/2011 5:18:29 AM

Aneirin

Posts: 6121
Joined: 3/18/2006
From: Tamaris
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: LaTigresse

quote:

ORIGINAL: Aneirin

As it appears to interest me greatly and I suppose oddly because I am not religious nor do I subscribe to the religious origin of such imagery, I just wanted to open a discussion about the subject of religious imagery as a scene for BDSM activity.

Subjects such as crucifixion as venerated by the websites;

Crucified women

Crux Dreams

Oddly but perhaps not so in some respects, very little depicting male crucifixion, or is that considered gay, what's wrong with male beauty ?

Then there is Altar sex, imagery of such I have not yet found aside from the alter christian type, which was probably part of my draw towards paganism back when I was younger.

With me, I do understand where lot of the imagery that excites comes from, as I have an interest in the beauty of vulnerability and display, the sodding church helped with that, all those very realistic crucifixes and saintly images that one saw in Roman Catholic churches. I often wonder if the imagery was designed to stir sexual feelings in the viewers for the purposes of guilt purification, a case of provide the bait and catch the sinner.

But anyway, the subject of religious imagery, sexual fantasies based upon religion, what do you think, wholesome or blasphemous ?

To ME, neither. It's just a kink for some people. How each of those people came by their individual kinks is probably as individual as they are.

To determine whether or not they are wholesome or blasphemous would require buying into the dogma of most organized religiouns, and I don't.

That's it. I dont buy into the dogma but I know a lot of my kink interests come from the church and it's history, so I am wondering if it was my exposure to Roman Catholicism at an early age that set the questions up in my mind, questions that have become a kink in later life despite no longer being religious.

In fact early fantasies were inspired by religious imagery, the inquisition and of course the cruelties of Rome, which if you look BDSM has a lot of similarities in imagery with.

As I see it, the church, especially the Catholic Church is in a way steeped in sexuality and we all know what the catholic church has been accused of lately what with some very public cases involving some of the once thought of as bastions of moral society.

But then, if we as humans are a creation of the maker what does that say about those religious leaders of the past and present who engaged in the destruction of others, or is it what we are is what we are, just creatures out to learn, and learn, because my take on sexuality and all it's variations, is a learning exercise, we in the rawness of sexuality learn about ourselves and others.

But I can see how many would see sexualising religion as blasphemous, but isn't religion in reality; sexuality ?

_____________________________

Everything we are is the result of what we have thought, the mind is everything, what we think, we become - Guatama Buddha

Conservatism is distrust of people tempered by fear - William Gladstone

(in reply to LaTigresse)

Post #: 7

RE: Religious Imagery and Bdsm ? - 7/19/2011 6:31:19 AM

xssve

Posts: 3589
Joined: 10/10/2009
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Read this paper; The Elegiac Puella as Virgin Martyr, Sadomasochism is a very common element in religion, particularly Christianity.

All primitive religion essentially extends from animism, and fertility/virility is a central value, if not the central value around which nearly all religion revolves - even religious architecture is full of phallic and vulval metaphor, from the obelisks and Baal's, to the underground chambers of the mystery religions - the arches and spires of the Gothic cathedral.

Sheela na Gig is a religious symbol of good fortune, presumably, a protector of women in childbirth.

But back to the virgin martyr, the symbolism of penetration is mixed up in Christianity with the symbols of martyrdom and torture, presumably due to the Manichean dualism of the early Christians, who eschewed reproduction and embraced martyrdom.

In Manichean dualism, the physical world is the work of the demiurge, subject to worldly corruption by it's nature: only the spirit is pure. To reproduce was to prolong the reign of Satan-El, to be martyred was to demonstrate ones disdain for the physical realm - this makes the act of coitus sort a double martydom, martyrdom without the release of death, bound to the suffering of the material world of reproduction.

It might illuminate some of the drama surrounding the Christian neuroses when it comes to sexuality - see also Theresa of Avila, and her "penetration" by a shaft of light.

Fascinating stuff, the crucifix represents the dualistic nature of reality, and also represents the human body: crucifixion itself is in some sense, symbolic of fate, and how we are bound to the material world until released by death.

(in reply to Aneirin)

Post #: 8

RE: Religious Imagery and Bdsm ? - 7/19/2011 7:13:38 AM

LaTigresse

Posts: 26123
Joined: 1/15/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Aneirin

But I can see how many would see sexualising religion as blasphemous, but isn't religion in reality; sexuality ?

I have never once seen religioun as sexuality. I see it only as a way of controlling people and taking away from them.

_____________________________

My twisted, self deprecating, sense of humour, finds alot to laugh about, in your lack of one!

Just because you are well educated, articulate, and can use big, fancy words, properly........does not mean you are right!

(in reply to Aneirin)

Post #: 9

RE: Religious Imagery and Bdsm ? - 7/19/2011 7:25:13 AM

DesFIP

Posts: 25191
Joined: 11/25/2007
From: Apple County NY
Status: offline

Since I sincerely doubt that most people see a picture of a martyr being tortured and immediately get a stiffy, I have to say that the notion that these pictures are designed to do so never crossed my mind. Sometimes a cigar really is just a cigar.

_____________________________

Slave to laundry

Cynical and proud of it!

(in reply to LaTigresse)

Post #: 10

RE: Religious Imagery and Bdsm ? - 7/19/2011 7:52:33 AM

LadyConstanze

Posts: 9722
Joined: 2/18/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: LaTigresse

quote:

ORIGINAL: Aneirin

But I can see how many would see sexualising religion as blasphemous, but isn't religion in reality; sexuality ?

I have never once seen religioun as sexuality. I see it only as a way of controlling people and taking away from them.

The basis of every religion was fairly sexual, at least the old and primitive religions, the mother goddess was a fertility goddess. In case you are interested in mythology, look into the development (the best one seems to be Greek mythology), it was absolutely female based, then guys realized that they actually do have a part in procreation and things changed, the female goddesses were replaced with male gods, the male before that was only a son or consort, the rights of the women were cut down more and more, they basically became property of the males who kept them away from other males to make sure they didn't raise the child of another guy, before that it was the female who picked the guy.

Some of the Celtic religions are also examples, you know the queen picking a consort and keeping him around, he was usually also the one who led the army, when things got wrong, like the land went through a drought, the consort was sacrificed to give new life and his blood for the land and she picked another consort, some tribes actually had consorts only for a limited amount of time before they were done away with (for the good of the land and stuff) and the queens often resigned when they reached menopause. Also the Christian holy days were pagan fertility festivals, coupling was seen as something holy and life giving and on certain days things got a bit out of hand and it was almost an orgy. I think it was called the beltane fires or something like that, kids conceived there were believed to be very lucky...

_____________________________

There are 10 kinds of people who understand binary
Those who do and those who don't!

http://exdomme.blogspot.com/2012/07/public-service-announcement.html

(in reply to LaTigresse)

Post #: 11

RE: Religious Imagery and Bdsm ? - 7/19/2011 9:35:07 AM

LaTigresse

Posts: 26123
Joined: 1/15/2006
Status: offline

Ah well..........you see I've no exposure to any of that so don't have the same images and thoughts come to mind.

Everything I've been exposed to has been the dried up, crusty, aniti-sex, variety.

Thank you for the info on something outside of my own experiences!

_____________________________

My twisted, self deprecating, sense of humour, finds alot to laugh about, in your lack of one!

Just because you are well educated, articulate, and can use big, fancy words, properly........does not mean you are right!

(in reply to LadyConstanze)

Post #: 12

RE: Religious Imagery and Bdsm ? - 7/19/2011 9:56:00 AM

Elcross

Posts: 1
Joined: 7/16/2011
Status: offline

I have quite the interest in symbols and ritual, and admit that I have drawn some inspiration from Catholicism.

LaTigresse, you are right about religion controlling people (group singing, all the stand/kneel/sit stuff- all subtle mind control), though this stuff is something I see as worth emulating, it is an effective way to achieve an altered emotional state, which is after all what we seek to achieve.

I do personally find general occult (inspired by Crowley and LaVey.) methods more effective, at least for me.

(in reply to LaTigresse)

Post #: 13

RE: Religious Imagery and Bdsm ? - 7/19/2011 10:50:20 AM

LadyConstanze

Posts: 9722
Joined: 2/18/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: LaTigresse

Ah well..........you see I've no exposure to any of that so don't have the same images and thoughts come to mind.

Everything I've been exposed to has been the dried up, crusty, aniti-sex, variety.

Thank you for the info on something outside of my own experiences!

Something that's a bit of a hobby of mine, goes basically hand in hand with the roles of women in history, you take a look at the religions as they were more or less mirrors of the society... (humans tend to create the gods in their own images)

http://www.greekmythology.com/Titans/Gaea/gaea.html#

http://www.greekmythology.com/Myths/The_Myths/The_Creation/the_creation.html (that's basically the evolution of from earth goddess to olympians in fast forward)

_____________________________

There are 10 kinds of people who understand binary
Those who do and those who don't!

http://exdomme.blogspot.com/2012/07/public-service-announcement.html

(in reply to LaTigresse)

Post #: 14

RE: Religious Imagery and Bdsm ? - 7/19/2011 11:42:50 AM

CrazyCats

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Joined: 2/15/2009
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http://www.smbc-comics.com/index.php?db=comics&id=2289#comic

Probably a little of both to answer the OP. Eventually, somethere, it will arouse someone.

_____________________________

quote:

Niccolo Machiavelli
Severities should be dealt out all at once, so that their suddenness may give less offense; benefits ought to be handed out drop by drop, so that they may be relished the more.

(in reply to LadyConstanze)

Post #: 15

RE: Religious Imagery and Bdsm ? - 7/19/2011 11:48:08 AM

LaTigresse

Posts: 26123
Joined: 1/15/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Elcross

I have quite the interest in symbols and ritual, and admit that I have drawn some inspiration from Catholicism.

LaTigresse, you are right about religion controlling people (group singing, all the stand/kneel/sit stuff- all subtle mind control), though this stuff is something I see as worth emulating, it is an effective way to achieve an altered emotional state, which is after all what we seek to achieve.

I do personally find general occult (inspired by Crowley and LaVey.) methods more effective, at least for me.

I was thinking much bigger picture than a few simple actions.

_____________________________

My twisted, self deprecating, sense of humour, finds alot to laugh about, in your lack of one!

Just because you are well educated, articulate, and can use big, fancy words, properly........does not mean you are right!

(in reply to Elcross)

Post #: 16

RE: Religious Imagery and Bdsm ? - 7/19/2011 12:29:35 PM

needlesandpins

Posts: 3901
Status: offline

i'm actually not religeous in the whole 'god' concept as it is as a modern thing. but the rituals surounding the pagans and nature worship are right up my street.

i guess that's why i have no problem with sexual pervertion of modern religeous icons and imagery.

i even have my own personal jesus;

that image lead to this poem

A martyr on the crucifix held for his sins,
I’m stood in front; this is where it begins,
Touching his body with taloned hands,
Raising the skin in single red strands,
He’s clad in black that shines and glistens,
Ready for the whip that sings if you listen,
The lust in his sole so easy to see,
As he opens his eyes to look at me,
Held in his gaze, trapped by his need,
Without spoken word I’ll follow his lead,
My breath that quickens; heart won’t be still,
To feast his body I’ll have my fill,
I’m here to punish but I can not find,
The will and strength to control my own mind,
He’s stuck on the cross, spread and impaled,
There for the taking, but oh so nailed,
To be here forever, to stay for all time,
He belongs to me now, Oh mine divine,
So here am I to kiss your lips,
And offer tortured, sinful worship.
An eternity to pass with so much between us,
I’ll pray to you, my personal Jesus.

this all in turn leads to a painting i have in mind that is very much based on a bdsm crucifixion.

needles

Attachment (1)

< Message edited by needlesandpins -- 7/19/2011 12:38:36 PM >

(in reply to LaTigresse)

Post #: 17

RE: Religious Imagery and Bdsm ? - 7/19/2011 12:39:58 PM

Aneirin

Posts: 6121
Joined: 3/18/2006
From: Tamaris
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: CrazyCats

http://www.smbc-comics.com/index.php?db=comics&id=2289#comic

Probably a little of both to answer the OP. Eventually, somethere, it will arouse someone.

Oh yes, I agree with that, as it is what is reportedly happening at GTMO, a torture called water boarding, is now firmly wedged into bdsm activities, what with waterboarding masks and such, but then water boarding is I believe a variation of an ancient torture practice as venerated by websites such as ;

Waterbondage.com.

Everything we come to understand as happening as a means of the torture of humans, is oddly a bdsm activity, which says what about our society, perhaps the only condemnation we can offer the modern torturers outside of BDSM, is the fact that what they do is unconsensual consent being the difference between the distasteful people and us perhaps, but then even that to an outsider could vary.

As an aside, I looked into the groups section on that other popular BDSM social networking website some of us here also belong to and was surprised, well, not really surprised to find there were groups dealing with the very question I have asked here, the things that attract me, attract others, and the common factor, is Roman Catholicism.

_____________________________

Everything we are is the result of what we have thought, the mind is everything, what we think, we become - Guatama Buddha

Conservatism is distrust of people tempered by fear - William Gladstone

(in reply to CrazyCats)

Post #: 18

RE: Religious Imagery and Bdsm ? - 7/19/2011 12:48:56 PM

popularDemand

Posts: 228
Status: offline

St Sebastian is best.... full of arra;s.

pD

_____________________________

A sentence should be like a serpent: Quick with a sting in its tail. String me a line that has meaning and depth.
There's no small talk with walky-talkies.
Small talk stinks.

(in reply to Aneirin)

Post #: 19

RE: Religious Imagery and Bdsm ? - 7/19/2011 12:56:39 PM

needlesandpins

Posts: 3901
Status: offline

the poem i wrote prompted my playmate to be creative too and so he did this, which hangs on my bedroom wall.

Attachment (1)

(in reply to Aneirin)

Post #: 20

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