What if the Norwegian Right-wing terrorist is telling the truth? (Full Version)

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Fightdirecto -> What if the Norwegian Right-wing terrorist is telling the truth? (7/25/2011 11:18:21 AM)

Associated Press 7-25-11:
quote:

The self-described perpetrator of one of the worst modern mass murders in peacetime told Norwegian authorities that that he expects to spend the rest of his life in prison but two other cells of his terror network remain free, officials said Monday.

Anders Behring Breivik has admitted bombing Norway's capital and opening fire on a political youth group retreat, but he entered a plea of not guilty, saying he wanted to save Europe from Muslim immigration...

Breivik made clear in an Internet manifesto that he planned to turn his court appearance into theater, preparing a speech for his appearance in court even before launching the attacks, then requesting an open hearing in which he would wear a uniform. Both of those requests were denied.

The suspect has said staged the bombing and youth camp rampage as "marketing" for his manifesto calling for a revolution that would rid Europe of Muslims.

"The operation was not to kill as many people as possible but to give a strong signal that could not be misunderstood that as long as the Labor Party keeps driving its ideological lie and keeps deconstructing Norwegian culture and mass importing Muslims then they must assume responsibility for this treason," according to the English translation of Heger's ruling that was read out after the hearing.

Breivik alluded to two other "cells" of his network -- which he imagines as a new Knights Templar, the medieval cabal of crusaders who protected Christian pilgrims in the Holy Land. At one point, his manifesto briefly referred to an intention to contact two other cells, but no details were given.

European security officials said they were aware of increased Internet chatter from individuals claiming they belonged to the Knights Templar group and were investigating claims that Breivik, and other far-right individuals, attended a London meeting of the group in 2002.


Assuming Breivik is telling the truth and there are other cells of his "Knights Templar" group in Norway, the United Kingdom and the United States, as he claims - what should be done if they can be identified by investigators? If in the United States, should they receive the same treatment as Americans alleged to support al-Queda or al-Queda-like groups?

[image]local://upfiles/42188/7EECA87DA53341C886DD7DEB5BFD3CCF.jpg[/image]




Moonhead -> RE: What if the Norwegian Right-wing terrorist is telling the truth? (7/25/2011 11:32:23 AM)

That's quite a big assumption, at present: his claims that he was part of an Organisation (a la Andrew MacDonald) don't seem to have been supported by the Norwegian police investigation of his supposed firm as yet.

Bear in mind that the last Norwegian dickhead to get press attention in the 'States for murder also claimed to be the spokesman for a vast network of true aryans. And turned out to be so full of shit that he squelches as he walks.




Fightdirecto -> RE: What if the Norwegian Right-wing terrorist is telling the truth? (7/25/2011 11:46:57 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead

That's quite a big assumption, at present: his claims that he was part of an Organisation (a la Andrew MacDonald) don't seem to have been supported by the Norwegian police investigation of his supposed firm as yet.

Bear in mind that the last Norwegian dickhead to get press attention in the 'States for murder also claimed to be the spokesman for a vast network of true aryans. And turned out to be so full of shit that he squelches as he walks.


Admittedly, I am presenting a hypothetical.

However, for purposes of discussion, should an American found to be a member/supporter of Breivik's "Knights Templar" be treated in the same manner as an American supporter of al - Queda, or should he receive kinder, gentler treatment because he is a "Christian terrorist" and not a "Moslem terrorist"?




Moonhead -> RE: What if the Norwegian Right-wing terrorist is telling the truth? (7/25/2011 11:52:04 AM)

He should be treated exactly the same, if we're talking pure hypotheticals.
Of course "should" and "will" are different things in this context: I doubt they'll be dragging any American white surpremacists out of their trailer parkarmed camp and packing them off to camp x ray without a trial or Miranda...




BamaD -> RE: What if the Norwegian Right-wing terrorist is telling the truth? (7/25/2011 11:54:50 AM)

And the only terrorist to be executed in the U S was the white guy.




Moonhead -> RE: What if the Norwegian Right-wing terrorist is telling the truth? (7/25/2011 11:59:23 AM)

That's my point: you people still haven't bothered to bring any of the al queda suspects you've spent the last decade collecting to trial yet.




Rule -> RE: What if the Norwegian Right-wing terrorist is telling the truth? (7/25/2011 12:06:06 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Fightdirecto
Assuming Breivik is telling the truth and there are other cells of his "Knights Templar" group in Norway, the United Kingdom and the United States, as he claims - what should be done if they can be identified by investigators?

Nothing. Simply ignore them. As long as they do not commit a crime, they do not pose a problem.

Most people in any country die because of the stupidity of their physicians. I therefore deem physicians the greater danger. In fact, I deem people who litter a greater danger than a couple of blood-thirsty killers who have not yet murdered anybody.




mnottertail -> RE: What if the Norwegian Right-wing terrorist is telling the truth? (7/25/2011 12:34:00 PM)

Well the women die due to lack of foreskins to gnaw on, it aint the same as potato skins, yanno.




Fightdirecto -> RE: What if the Norwegian Right-wing terrorist is telling the truth? (7/25/2011 1:19:50 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rule

Nothing. Simply ignore them. As long as they do not commit a crime, they do not pose a problem.


I agree, but then we run into the problem of "What is a crime?"

There have been American Muslims arrested for writing blogs favorable to al-Queda or translating an article from English into Arabic or Arabic into English on the grounds they were "providing support to a terrorist group".

Should those same standards apply to an anti-Muslim group or blogger if it turns out that anti-Muslim group or blogger in some way was "providing support to a terrorist group" such as Breivek's "Knights Templer"?.




Rule -> RE: What if the Norwegian Right-wing terrorist is telling the truth? (7/25/2011 2:40:38 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Fightdirecto
There have been American Muslims arrested for writing blogs favorable to al-Queda or translating an article from English into Arabic or Arabic into English on the grounds they were "providing support to a terrorist group".

Should those same standards apply to an anti-Muslim group or blogger if it turns out that anti-Muslim group or blogger in some way was "providing support to a terrorist group" such as Breivek's "Knights Templer"?.

Nearly all, if not all, socalled terrorist attacks in Western countries are (black ops that are) perpetrated by government (associated) black ops groups. As for example murders on a couple of Dutch politicians, the murder of JFK, the Murrah building and 911, and let's not forget both WWs. Of course other parties are blamed for these attacks - that in part is the reason why they are planned and executed.

Lot's of people infrequently have moments of murder in their heart - but nearly all of them never murder anyone. Personally, I would applaud it when at least once a year someone who litters, smokes, or terrorizes their neighbors with loud music is publicly beheaded. On the other hand I do am opposed against terrorizing people into socially ordained good behavior, as is the purpose of much of the cruel sharia law adhered to by populations that mutilate the penises of their male progeny.

So no, I would not waste time, effort and resources on people who write idle stuff on the Internet or wherever. A crime is only a crime when it has been executed.




Laymedown60 -> RE: What if the Norwegian Right-wing terrorist is telling the truth? (7/25/2011 5:35:17 PM)

[image]http://i85.photobucket.com/albums/k69/Daviskw2004/IMG_0067-as-Smart-Object-1.jpg[/image]

Butch




PeonForHer -> RE: What if the Norwegian Right-wing terrorist is telling the truth? (7/25/2011 5:50:51 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Fightdirecto

Assuming Breivik is telling the truth and there are other cells of his "Knights Templar" group in Norway, the United Kingdom and the United States, as he claims - what should be done if they can be identified by investigators? If in the United States, should they receive the same treatment as Americans alleged to support al-Queda or al-Queda-like groups?



Breivik is almost certainly a thick nutcase without any connections with anyone, FD. Even if he did have connections, it'd only be with other thick nutcases like the English Defence League. who are possibly the stupidest political organisation in the entire western world. Added together, their IQs probably don't get into double figures. They make Tea Party members look like intellectual giants.

Still, unglamorous as it is, I do think the very highly paid members of intelligence organisations should focus on these cretinous organisations. It would help if they could arrange to be a bit less looney than the people they're supposed to be protecting us against.




Aswad -> RE: What if the Norwegian Right-wing terrorist is telling the truth? (7/25/2011 9:58:00 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Fightdirecto

Should those same standards apply to an anti-Muslim group or blogger if it turns out that anti-Muslim group or blogger in some way was "providing support to a terrorist group" such as Breivek's "Knights Templer"?.


Turn the question around.

Should people have been charged for defending e.g. al-Quaeda in the first place?

If the public arena cannot have dissenting voices, then the public should not have a democracy.

Health,
al-Aswad.




Owner59 -> RE: What if the Norwegian Right-wing terrorist is telling the truth? (7/25/2011 10:00:59 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD

And the only terrorist to be executed in the U S was the white guy.


Does it matter where bin-ladden died?




Aswad -> RE: What if the Norwegian Right-wing terrorist is telling the truth? (7/25/2011 10:04:31 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: PeonForHer

Breivik is almost certainly a thick nutcase without any connections with anyone, FD.


I think it is dangerous to dismiss him so casually.

For one thing, he has had the discipline to set goals and attain them since childhood. Also, he stayed below the radar of the intelligence service entirely (we've had a department of homeland security for decades, and it's actually been doing its job, indeed a bit too well at times). It has been voiced that even Stasi wouldn't have been able to pick up on his activities until it was too late.

quote:

Still, unglamorous as it is, I do think the very highly paid members of intelligence organisations should focus on these cretinous organisations. It would help if they could arrange to be a bit less looney than the people they're supposed to be protecting us against.


I don't know about the USA, but up here, they do keep an eye on such things. Indeed, they actively follow whole communities to look out for people who may actually decide to do something. Not that it helped in this case, but he didn't give any warnings to go by. They have, however, caught other events ahead of time.

Health,
al-Aswad.




Owner59 -> RE: What if the Norwegian Right-wing terrorist is telling the truth? (7/25/2011 10:19:38 PM)

Heard today that the police are thinking he`s acting alone,but not sure yet.The killer says he has links with other extremest groups but every one of them say they don`t know the guy.Of course those groups are getting a proctological exam right now and aren`t happy about it.He may very well have a few friends in on it.

The killer said he wanted to address the court in public and read from his "manifesto".The courts are saying no way.The hearing was private and he`ll be held in isolation for 4 weeks.Then in a regular cell but without contact with anyone for another 4 weeks.They believe he may want to communicate with others who might do more attacks.

Sounds like a pretty self-absorbed guy,with grandiose ideas of starting a race war.Kind of charles manson-like and probably just as profoundly disturbed.




lockedaway -> RE: What if the Norwegian Right-wing terrorist is telling the truth? (7/25/2011 10:23:36 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Fightdirecto

Associated Press 7-25-11:
quote:

The self-described perpetrator of one of the worst modern mass murders in peacetime told Norwegian authorities that that he expects to spend the rest of his life in prison but two other cells of his terror network remain free, officials said Monday.

Anders Behring Breivik has admitted bombing Norway's capital and opening fire on a political youth group retreat, but he entered a plea of not guilty, saying he wanted to save Europe from Muslim immigration...

Breivik made clear in an Internet manifesto that he planned to turn his court appearance into theater, preparing a speech for his appearance in court even before launching the attacks, then requesting an open hearing in which he would wear a uniform. Both of those requests were denied.

The suspect has said staged the bombing and youth camp rampage as "marketing" for his manifesto calling for a revolution that would rid Europe of Muslims.

"The operation was not to kill as many people as possible but to give a strong signal that could not be misunderstood that as long as the Labor Party keeps driving its ideological lie and keeps deconstructing Norwegian culture and mass importing Muslims then they must assume responsibility for this treason," according to the English translation of Heger's ruling that was read out after the hearing.

Breivik alluded to two other "cells" of his network -- which he imagines as a new Knights Templar, the medieval cabal of crusaders who protected Christian pilgrims in the Holy Land. At one point, his manifesto briefly referred to an intention to contact two other cells, but no details were given.

European security officials said they were aware of increased Internet chatter from individuals claiming they belonged to the Knights Templar group and were investigating claims that Breivik, and other far-right individuals, attended a London meeting of the group in 2002.


Assuming Breivik is telling the truth and there are other cells of his "Knights Templar" group in Norway, the United Kingdom and the United States, as he claims - what should be done if they can be identified by investigators? If in the United States, should they receive the same treatment as Americans alleged to support al-Queda or al-Queda-like groups?

[image]local://upfiles/42188/7EECA87DA53341C886DD7DEB5BFD3CCF.jpg[/image]


Goddamn, Fight, and you call yourself a liberal?  The answer is right in front of your eyes for the love of God.  Impose an anti-terrorist tax against them until they leave like American business. Use the tax proceeds to write checks to people who do not work.  Eventually the Muslims will get so pissed off at the defacto slavery you impose on them that they will leave.

Dude...before you post another bullshit thread, read your liberal manifesto on how to socially engineer society.  The answers to your milk-toast questions are all right there.

Glad to be of assistance,

Your friend,

lockedaway




MrRodgers -> RE: What if the Norwegian Right-wing terrorist is telling the truth? (7/25/2011 10:30:06 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead

That's my point: you people still haven't bothered to bring any of the al queda suspects you've spent the last decade collecting to trial yet.

Don't want to take this OP in another direction but it's obvious they can't bring these people to trial. It would expose govt. incompetence or complicity...or both. Anybody know of a single 9/11 suspect brought to trial ? I am thinking...none. If so and I am thinking I am right...why not ?

This Norwegian incident is I think something else entirely.

I wonder when we will start getting reports of 9/11 suspects, oh I am sorry, terrorists...committing suicide ? 9/11 eye-witnesses are...several now have.

BTW, if we can round up 'terrorists' why can't we just round up all murderers, rapists and thieves ?




Owner59 -> RE: What if the Norwegian Right-wing terrorist is telling the truth? (7/25/2011 10:47:39 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: lockedaway

quote:

ORIGINAL: Fightdirecto

Associated Press 7-25-11:
quote:

The self-described perpetrator of one of the worst modern mass murders in peacetime told Norwegian authorities that that he expects to spend the rest of his life in prison but two other cells of his terror network remain free, officials said Monday.

Anders Behring Breivik has admitted bombing Norway's capital and opening fire on a political youth group retreat, but he entered a plea of not guilty, saying he wanted to save Europe from Muslim immigration...

Breivik made clear in an Internet manifesto that he planned to turn his court appearance into theater, preparing a speech for his appearance in court even before launching the attacks, then requesting an open hearing in which he would wear a uniform. Both of those requests were denied.

The suspect has said staged the bombing and youth camp rampage as "marketing" for his manifesto calling for a revolution that would rid Europe of Muslims.

"The operation was not to kill as many people as possible but to give a strong signal that could not be misunderstood that as long as the Labor Party keeps driving its ideological lie and keeps deconstructing Norwegian culture and mass importing Muslims then they must assume responsibility for this treason," according to the English translation of Heger's ruling that was read out after the hearing.

Breivik alluded to two other "cells" of his network -- which he imagines as a new Knights Templar, the medieval cabal of crusaders who protected Christian pilgrims in the Holy Land. At one point, his manifesto briefly referred to an intention to contact two other cells, but no details were given.

European security officials said they were aware of increased Internet chatter from individuals claiming they belonged to the Knights Templar group and were investigating claims that Breivik, and other far-right individuals, attended a London meeting of the group in 2002.


Assuming Breivik is telling the truth and there are other cells of his "Knights Templar" group in Norway, the United Kingdom and the United States, as he claims - what should be done if they can be identified by investigators? If in the United States, should they receive the same treatment as Americans alleged to support al-Queda or al-Queda-like groups?

[image]local://upfiles/42188/7EECA87DA53341C886DD7DEB5BFD3CCF.jpg[/image]


Goddamn, Fight, and you call yourself a liberal?  The answer is right in front of your eyes for the love of God.  Impose an anti-terrorist tax against them until they leave like American business. Use the tax proceeds to write checks to people who do not work.  Eventually the Muslims will get so pissed off at the defacto slavery you impose on them that they will leave.

Dude...before you post another bullshit thread, read your liberal manifesto on how to socially engineer society.  The answers to your milk-toast questions are all right there.

Glad to be of assistance,

Your friend,

lockedaway


Ummm,injecting your dumb childish digs into this thread and subject is low-class and stinks.

A lot of people just died or is nothing sacred?

It`s not funny or welcome.




Aswad -> RE: What if the Norwegian Right-wing terrorist is telling the truth? (7/25/2011 11:18:18 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: MrRodgers

This Norwegian incident is I think something else entirely.


Yeah. For one thing, ours was arrested, interrogated with a lawyer present, arraigned and placed in custody.

And the arraignment hearing was on monday, while the attacks were on friday.

I think the courts are closed on the weekends.

So, no years at Gitmo here.

Health,
al-Aswad.

P.S.: Gitmo is small potatoes, compared to the alleged leak behind cablegate...
... you know, the guy that did what we love to see movie heroes do.




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