RE: Masochist Dom/me? (Full Version)

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FirmhandKY -> RE: Masochist Dom/me? (5/21/2006 6:20:12 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: ImpGrrl

quote:

ORIGINAL: FirmhandKY
To me ... masochists ... receive pain inflicted upon them by someone else.  This "someone else", is therefore in a position of control over the masochist, even if under the authority of the masochist.


Not necessarily.  If the top is giving the bottom pain *exactly as the bottom tells them to*, who is "controlling" the scene?



Hence ... under the authority.





KittenWithaTwist -> RE: Masochist Dom/me? (5/21/2006 7:40:38 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: losttreasure

During a discussion with FirmhandyKY today, an odd question occurred to me... are there Dominants who are masochists?  As it is generally accepted, sado/masochistic proclivities are a separate phenomenon from that of dominant/submissive tendencies; yet it appears that among those dominants who profess leanings one way or another, it tends to always be toward the sadistic side.

While our own suppositions were thought provoking, we felt it might be interesting to see if anyone else might be able to shed some light, or at least provide addition input.  FirmhandKY mused that perhaps dominants who are masochistic, may in fact be switches.  Thoughts?

On a personal note, our thanks to Gooddogbenji for being the catalyst for this post.  [;)]

~*~

LostTreasure



I disagree. Although I am a switch and a sadomasochist (I enjoy both), I don't believe that all dominants who are masochists are switches. There is no correlation, to my knowledge, between sadomasochism and domination. Some submissives are sadists (I certainly was one-when I thought I was only capable of enjoying submission). Some people are sadomasochistic and not at all interested in domination or submission.

There are no rules in BDSM. Anyone can be any combination of anything.



SweetSarijane -> RE: Masochist Dom/me? (5/21/2006 7:50:05 PM)

I know a few Doms male and female who are masochistic and at times will ask another to top them so they can experience pain. They are not switches, they just like to receive pain sometimes.



Level -> RE: Masochist Dom/me? (5/21/2006 7:52:21 PM)

Isn't that the very definition of switching? To go from one to the other? It does not make them less of a dominant to do so, necessarily.... but I think many fear that they'll be seen as such, so they shirk the switch label. Bottom does not have to equate with submissive.




KittenWithaTwist -> RE: Masochist Dom/me? (5/21/2006 7:52:25 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: FirmhandKY

Ok, So ... how does a dominant reconcil their desire for pain inflicted upon them, with what I consider a dominant's inherent basic characteristic - that of having and maintaining control?

It seems to me to be a receipe for internal conflict.  How does such a person label themselves, or explain themselves?

I can see a sub talking to such a potential dom: "And you want me to ... do what?!" [sub runs].

Intellectually, I can see and agree that D/s orientation and S&M orientation can be different - but emotionally, I'm not sure how a masochist dom/me can really be classified as anything other than a "switch".  Not that I've got a real good handle on what a "switch" is, but it just seems to me, if I were wired as a masochist dom, that I'd say something like "I'm a dominant switch.  I've a strong streak of the desire for control, but do like an occasional flogging."

I've read several threads about submissives who had "doms" or even "masters", who ended up turning the relationship around 180 degrees.  My initial conclusion has always been a dom or master who was deceptive, but perhaps it wasn't that (or not totally that, anyway).

Perhaps this thread should be in the "Ask a Switch" category?

FHky



I don't see it as conflicting at all, actually. After all, one can very much control how much pain they receive, esp. if it is from a maliable submissive partner. For instance,

"You will beat me, you worthless slut. You'll beat me until I scream, or I'll withold orgasms from you for a month! You'll hurt me and you'll like it! Harder you stupid wench! Harder damnit!"

Or something along those lines. Most submissives are eager to please, and struggle to be as pleasing as possible. Why should it matter if they're trying to be pleasing by inflicting pain or by taking pain?

I'm not sure why you can't see a flogging as controlled by the bottom. Many bottoms will shout desires that can be seen as commands. For instance, "harder", "faster", "not too much", "stop now", "I'm not ready yet", "a little to the left".

I'm a switch. I enjoy dominating someone (being in control of their pleasure, their pain, their desire, their terror, inflicting my pleasure upon them, watching them succumb to my will) and I enjoy submitting to someone (being out of control of my own pleasure, my own pain, my own desire, my own fear, being inflicted with someone's pleasure, being responsible for fulfilling someone's pleasure). I enjoy being a top in S&M (hurting someone) and being a bottom (being hurt).

I guess I don't understand why people who don't switch can't understand it. But then, a lot of people don't understand bisexuality (being genuinely attracted to persons of both sexes-and not just sexually). I just wish they did. :)



KittenWithaTwist -> RE: Masochist Dom/me? (5/21/2006 7:57:36 PM)

quote:

What I do find amazing is how on websites such as this people tend to use the word "switch" like people forty years ago used the word "queer," as if those described by it are somehow shameful and dirty.


I agree. In fact, that is specifically why it took me a long time to admit to myself that I am a switch. It's as though many people online (though fewer but still some in my community) see being as a switch as some weird cross-breed of person. Gasp! She's not normal. She's a switch. Eww!



SweetSarijane -> RE: Masochist Dom/me? (5/21/2006 7:59:37 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Level

Isn't that the very definition of switching? To go from one to the other? It does not make them less of a dominant to do so, necessarily.... but I think many fear that they'll be seen as such, so they shirk the switch label.


I don't see that as switching per se. The ones I know aren't in any way submissive and to me, a switch has both dominant and submissive tendencies and/or needs. Bottoming to get a pain fix every now and then just doesn't seem like a switch to me. Just my opinion from my observations.

The ones I know and have seen being topped to get pain are definitely dominant lol and that dominance is very obvious even while they are bottoming for their masochistic fix. I don't deny that some masochistic Dominants are switches. That's easily possible and probable. I'm just saying not all are and the ones I know aren't.



ZenDragoness -> RE: Masochist Dom/me? (5/21/2006 8:20:43 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Level

Isn't that the very definition of switching? To go from one to the other? It does not make them less of a dominant to do so, necessarily.... but I think many fear that they'll be seen as such, so they shirk the switch label. Bottom does not have to equate with submissive.




I am with you on this one Level. In my case there is a definite difference, between dominant bottoming (where, when, how long and so forth) and the times i am able to submit. Sometimes one leads to the other with my beloved, this are the times he is craving, because only then, he is having his BDSM the way he had it always before we met. In the around 25 years he praticed BDSM before, he had only relationships with submissives or slaves. I am sure he never planned to fall so deep in love with somebody like me, as i never planned to fall in love with a domiant onesider. It surely makes for very interesting situations, not only in the bedroom, but also in daily life. We both were the leaders of our past relationships and now we (after 5 beautiful years together) are still learning to ähm lead together:.-).



Slipstreme -> RE: Masochist Dom/me? (5/21/2006 10:54:06 PM)

quote:

If he's giving you pain, technically you *are* "bottoming to" him


Yes. This is where I have problems doing it. Although bottoming is different than submitting. In scene, yes you are beating me, but we are equals the whole time. No one Doms me during scene, although yes, I do give up "control."

quote:

  If the top is giving the bottom pain *exactly as the bottom tells them to*, who is "controlling" the scene?



I refuse to do so because I know that I will not go as far as I can if I do. I do not, however, equate this with submission, and will often mention, if my Top isn't pressing hard enough, for the intensity to increase. I have to give up "control" to push my limits, and every pain scene I do, for the purpose of pain, is one that pushes limits.



MasterFireMaam -> RE: Masochist Dom/me? (5/22/2006 8:20:31 AM)

Yes, there are masochistic Doms. I am masochistic in some ways, usually for specific purposes, such as being branded for spiritual reasons. I doubt I'd enjoy a full out scene. However, I do know Dominants (Masters, actually) who do. I know slaves who are wicked sadists, too.

Fire




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