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Unbearable. The ivory trade is back - 8/3/2011 10:47:01 PM   
Iamsemisweet


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From: The Great Northwest, USA
Status: offline 		http://www.vanityfair.com/culture/features/2011/08/elephants-201108

The demand for ivory in China, coupled with the extreme poverty in Africa, is creating an extinction vortex.

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RE: Unbearable. The ivory trade is back - 8/3/2011 11:36:58 PM   
tazzygirl


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Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		No offence,,, I feel for the elephants plight. But I am more concerned about those who are here going to bed hungry tonight, those who are in pain with no way to relive it, those who are homeless.

We have more issues that tusks at this point.

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RE: Unbearable. The ivory trade is back - 8/3/2011 11:40:39 PM   
LillyBoPeep


Posts: 6873
Joined: 12/29/2010
Status: offline 		this is awful... =( 

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RE: Unbearable. The ivory trade is back - 8/3/2011 11:48:44 PM   
Termyn8or


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Status: offline 		No need for the link.

They seem to find out about this every five to eight years or so, but it really never stopped. The just killed the people who blew the lid off it. Not so much gunned them down in the street but shut them the fuck up on the media. You stop hearing about ivory backscratxhers, then you stop hearing about dead elephants. Then you stop hearing about ivory period. There is a new "crisis".

Then you hear about it again and all the sudden it's brand new. Ivory trade is illegal for the last few decades, nobody reports it or pays sales tax or VAT on it. Come on, these people ooperate in secluded places, like their 7,000 square foot diningroom.

Now these whistleblowers will be cutup, shutup or put out. In about five to seven years the shit will start again.

Now over there, elephant meat is a delicacy. I've heard it's very good. Over here we shoot deer for their racks. But nobody is stupid enough to just take the rack and leave the venison, especially the tenderloin. You can get the out so fast you don't even have to worry about the piss sack. If you got the right tools. Rack and medallions and leave the carcass to rot. We just don't hear about it.

When elephants are slaughtered, they might have tusks. So what. But what brought it up in the past was the fact that rich Men would buy the tusks and people would kill elephants and take the tusks, leaving the edible meat to rot in the forest, jungle or whatever the fuck it is. I agree that it's fucked up, but it goes on all the time. Just like slavery, you think slavery was abolished ? I don't mean the economic slavery or any bullshit like that an I don't even mean what is called "white slavwery", or or maybe I do. I mean absolute nonconsentual slavery, you think it doesn't exist ? You know why ? Because the slaves can't tell you and the masters won't.

We really are not all as civilised we are cracked up to be.

T^T

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RE: Unbearable. The ivory trade is back - 8/4/2011 12:47:22 AM   
BitaTruble


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From: Texas
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Iamsemisweet

http://www.vanityfair.com/culture/features/2011/08/elephants-201108

The demand for ivory in China, coupled with the extreme poverty in Africa, is creating an extinction vortex.


What an informative article. I had no idea that elephants needed so little sleep and I loved the part about the 'sneaky-fucker' reference in the bull mating. I was very surprised at how closely aligned the forest elephants are to keeping the forests alive with the seed distribution. There is so much more to the article than simply talking about the demand for ivory. Well worth the time it took to read. Thanks so much for sharing it. I hope that people like Johnny Rodrigues and the others mentioned in the article can help them. What a shame and a waste of a precious resource for our world should their extinction vortex become a grim reality.

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RE: Unbearable. The ivory trade is back - 8/4/2011 7:05:50 AM   
LillyBoPeep


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Status: offline 		good points, Bita -- most people don't realize how important elephants are to their ecosystems. it's very important to save them for so many reasons. 

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RE: Unbearable. The ivory trade is back - 8/4/2011 7:07:40 AM   
Anarrus


Posts: 475
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Status: offline 		http://www.washingtonpost.com/national/environment/feds-philadelphia-art-shop-owner-smuggled-1-ton-of-banned-african-elephant-ivory/2011/07/26/gIQAOjKzaI_story.html

I hope they hang this guy.
The only way to stop the illegal trade is to go after those at the top of the chain i.e. the dealers and collectors as above.
However, much of the end trade is Asian based as the article states.

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RE: Unbearable. The ivory trade is back - 8/4/2011 10:05:47 AM   
popeye1250


Posts: 18104
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From: New Hampshire
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Iamsemisweet

http://www.vanityfair.com/culture/features/2011/08/elephants-201108

The demand for ivory in China, coupled with the extreme poverty in Africa, is creating an extinction vortex.


Africa and China? Then let them sort it out. What does this have to do with the U.S.?
We have elephants here but they're all in zoos, none in the wild.
I don't think we'll see the headline; "Pissed off elephants tip over cars in Colorado!"
"A youthful gang of elephants wearing black leather jackets...."


< Message edited by popeye1250 -- 8/4/2011 10:11:18 AM >

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RE: Unbearable. The ivory trade is back - 8/4/2011 11:16:37 AM   
Hillwilliam


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Status: offline 		You folks do realize that in parts of Africa, elephants are so common they have to be professionally culled to keep the population within a reasonable number.

They kill entire herds babies and all. Otherwise, the survivors will remember and totally avoid the area for decades.

The ivory from these 'culls' is warehoused or destroyed so it can't enter the market. I'd like to see that ivory put on the market and the proceeds paying to help the people out of poverty. It would also have the effect of destroying the 'black market' if sales were legal and regulated.

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RE: Unbearable. The ivory trade is back - 8/4/2011 11:41:01 AM   
popeye1250


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From: New Hampshire
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam

You folks do realize that in parts of Africa, elephants are so common they have to be professionally culled to keep the population within a reasonable number.

They kill entire herds babies and all. Otherwise, the survivors will remember and totally avoid the area for decades.

The ivory from these 'culls' is warehoused or destroyed so it can't enter the market. I'd like to see that ivory put on the market and the proceeds paying to help the people out of poverty. It would also have the effect of destroying the 'black market' if sales were legal and regulated.


Hill, that makes perfect sense, that's why they won't do it.


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RE: Unbearable. The ivory trade is back - 8/4/2011 11:52:27 AM   
Anarrus


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Joined: 11/8/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam

You folks do realize that in parts of Africa, elephants are so common they have to be professionally culled to keep the population within a reasonable number.

They kill entire herds babies and all. Otherwise, the survivors will remember and totally avoid the area for decades.

The ivory from these 'culls' is warehoused or destroyed so it can't enter the market. I'd like to see that ivory put on the market and the proceeds paying to help the people out of poverty. It would also have the effect of destroying the 'black market' if sales were legal and regulated.


There is some debate over whether the culling is neccessary or not. The practice in S. Africa had been stopped for quite some time but recently started up again. That said, if culling is necessary it should be done as humanely as possible. I just read about the practices of culling in the 1960's and before in S. Africa and the method used was about as inhumane as it gets.

I agree though if it's to be done the ivory should be used in the ways you suggested. I'm not sure what effect it would have on the black market trade unless the regualtions were Africa wide.

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RE: Unbearable. The ivory trade is back - 8/4/2011 7:50:26 PM   
popeye1250


Posts: 18104
Joined: 1/27/2006
From: New Hampshire
Status: offline 		Think giant rodents eating all the vegetables in your garden and stomping down anything left.

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RE: Unbearable. The ivory trade is back - 8/4/2011 7:53:17 PM   
playfulotter


Posts: 2195
Joined: 6/27/2005
Status: offline 		This should be an offense punishable by death...I am sorry but it is so wrong...Anything like this...it is all borne out of ignorance and we should wipe that out..right?

< Message edited by playfulotter -- 8/4/2011 7:55:15 PM >

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RE: Unbearable. The ivory trade is back - 8/4/2011 8:01:02 PM   
Aynne88


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Status: offline 		Otter....I agree completely. 

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RE: Unbearable. The ivory trade is back - 8/4/2011 8:02:10 PM   
popeye1250


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From: New Hampshire
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quote:

ORIGINAL: playfulotter

This should be an offense punishable by death...I am sorry but it is so wrong...Anything like this...it is all borne out of ignorance and we should wipe that out..right?


Does that mean I should cancel my annual trip up to Newfoundland for Seal clubbing?


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RE: Unbearable. The ivory trade is back - 8/4/2011 8:04:41 PM   
Aynne88


Posts: 3873
Joined: 8/29/2008
Status: offline 		Yep. For every seal clubbed, I shoot a Tea Partier. Hey it's Maine and we all pack heat.  Even us liberal bitches. So be careful Popeye. 


< Message edited by Aynne88 -- 8/4/2011 8:06:00 PM >

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As long as people will shed the blood of innocent creatures there can be no peace, no liberty, no harmony between people. Slaughter and justice cannot dwell together.
—Isaac Bashevis Singer, writer and Nobel laureate (1902–1991)



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RE: Unbearable. The ivory trade is back - 8/4/2011 8:08:14 PM   
playfulotter


Posts: 2195
Joined: 6/27/2005
Status: offline 		Come on....be serious Popeye...  although I do have a good sense of humor and remember this kind of " man walks into bar joke"..so I do have a sense of humor...the joke whole entire joke  is....simply..."A seal walks into a club".......Ughhh!

Aynne,  We are on the same page..I wish I could pack heat or something else for those idiots!...Imagine a world without Elephants, Tigers, Polar Bears...etc...we will be lacking something..deep down to our souls.......did the people who killed off the Dodo bird say this..I don't know how they thought....but that is equally if more sad as they didn't even try to save some of them!

< Message edited by playfulotter -- 8/4/2011 8:39:45 PM >

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We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid.” ― Benjamin Franklin

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RE: Unbearable. The ivory trade is back - 8/4/2011 8:12:06 PM   
Aynne88


Posts: 3873
Joined: 8/29/2008
Status: offline 		No I can't imagine that Otter, it's horrible. Bless these creatures. I mean that. So so sad. 

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As long as people will shed the blood of innocent creatures there can be no peace, no liberty, no harmony between people. Slaughter and justice cannot dwell together.
—Isaac Bashevis Singer, writer and Nobel laureate (1902–1991)



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RE: Unbearable. The ivory trade is back - 8/4/2011 8:34:30 PM   
playfulotter


Posts: 2195
Joined: 6/27/2005
Status: offline 		I think the best charitable contribution anyone can give to this cause and any endangered animal cause that  can do the most is the "World Wildlife Fund"...but I am sure there are many others out there...just check them out first.....but the WWF is the best one for me...Hey even if it is $20 a year...think about saving an endangered species and you were a part of it!  How neat is that!

Did you know sea otters are endangered..there are only between 25,000 and 40,000 worldwide..think if that was how many humans were left....Yikes!

< Message edited by playfulotter -- 8/4/2011 8:56:41 PM >

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We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid.” ― Benjamin Franklin

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RE: Unbearable. The ivory trade is back - 8/4/2011 9:03:55 PM   
Owner59


Posts: 17033
Joined: 3/14/2006
From: Dirty Jersey
Status: offline 		The middle class in China is growing fast and starting to enjoy extra money.This is only going to drive up demand there.

Very sad.

Do not google or you-tube China and dogs for fur/food.Just don`t.

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