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FirstQuaker -> RE: Afghanistan in the 80's vs Libya now (9/5/2011 4:57:18 PM)
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ORIGINAL: hardcybermaster
if you can't see the difference between Iraq and Libya then there are some serious problems. America( plus helpers) invaded Iraq, the Libyans started their own revo lution and we helped. I have no idea how it will pan out in the long run but I am fairly sure that there is a clear difference between the two events
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ORIGINAL: FirstQuaker
quote:
ORIGINAL: hardcybermaster
so there is no one here who gives any credence to the idea that the people of Libya, emboldened by the other uprisings in north africa and to a certain extent the unrest in the middle east decided to rise up against a tyranical leader and "free" their country? if they free their own country then hopefully they get the chance to decide on their future, and whatever they decide is their choice, no matter who or how that came about. If they choose, democratically, to be.....{ insert religion/idealogy}....then that is their choice, not ours.
it's not our country, we don't decide their future, they do
Really buying into the "Humanitarian Regime Change" thing are we?
It so resembles the one told about Iraq.
But again, without NATO, just what do you think would have happened? And just how long do you think this EU installed "democracy" is going to last, without aq bunch of outside "help?"
The only difference is in that this time the Anglosphere did not use conventional ground troops. Probably why it has taken six months instead of six weeks.
But look at it like this -
quote:
Let's start with the basics. The Frogs did it. It's always worth repeating; this is a French war. The Americans don't even call it a war; it's a "kinetic action" or something. The "rebel" Transitional National Council" (TNC) is a French invention.
And yes - this is above all neo-Napoleonic President Nicolas Sarkozy's war. He's the George Clooney character in the movie (poor Clooney). Everybody else, from David of Arabia Cameron to Nobel Peace Prize winner and multiple war developer Barack Obama, are supporting actors.
As already reported by Asia Times Online, this war started in October 2010 when Gaddafi's chief of protocol, Nuri Mesmari, defected to Paris, was approached by French intelligence and for all practical purposes a military coup d'etat was concocted, involving defectors in Cyrenaica.
Sarko had a bag full of motives to exact revenge on The Big G.
French banks had told him that Gaddafi was about to transfer his billions of euros to Chinese banks. Thus Gaddafi could not by any means become an example to other Arab nations or sovereign funds.
French corporations told Sarko that Gaddafi had decided not to buy Rafale fighters anymore, and not to hire the French to build a nuclear plant; he was more concerned in investing in social services.
Energy giant Total wanted a much bigger piece of the Libyan energy cake - which was being largely eaten, on the European side, by Italy's ENI, especially because Premier Silvio "bunga bunga" Berlusconi, a certified Big G fan, had clinched a complex deal with Gaddafi.
Thus the military coup was perfected in Paris until December; the first popular demonstrations in Cyrenaica in February - largely instigated by the plotters - were hijacked. The self-promoting philosopher Bernard Henri-Levy flew his white shirt over an open torso to Benghazi to meet the "rebels" and phone Sarkozy, virtually ordering him to recognize them in early March as legitimate (not that Sarko needed any encouragement). - How do you Brits feel about being the French errand boys and goon squad?
At least Canada can claim to be in significant large part French, as an excuse (and we have oil companies there too.)
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