Where do you stand on this position? (Full Version)

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housesub4you -> Where do you stand on this position? (9/10/2011 7:26:09 AM)

Ok, I'm just going to make an assumption that most of the people on this site, have at least a somewhat liberal view of sexual freedoms.  I'm biasing that on the fact that we are on this site, and have the lifestyle as part of our life in one way or another.  So hopefully we feel that simply based on this lifestyle we should be free to enjoy it as we see fit.

which brings me to my point/question.  If you're a conservative or liberal where do you stand in supporting people who make statements like the one below.  I left out the party affiliation and name of the person who made the statement.  It was made this week in reference to 9/11

And you know, every day our young people…they’re bombarded with ‘homosexuality is normal and natural.’ It’s something they have to deal with every day. Fortunately we don’t have to deal with a terrorist attack every day, and that’s what I mean. It’s more dangerous, and yes I think that it’s also more dangerous because it will tear down the moral fiber of this nation.

If they are saying being gay is more dangerous to this country then terrorism, how long do you think it will be before this lifestyle is the target?



tolovetolaugh -> RE: Where do you stand on this position? (9/10/2011 7:31:49 AM)

The gay bashers will probably leave BDSM alone IMO. They just love power trips, so probably identify with it unless it is a woman over man or something outside of what they find natural.
The idea of women submitting to men probably just fits into their cave man eyes of the way the world should be.



zephyroftheNorth -> RE: Where do you stand on this position? (9/10/2011 7:39:26 AM)

The idea that us kinky folk are somehow more open and tolerant puzzles me. I've seen everything from gay bashers to eww your kink squicks me out! here.

As for your question, our lifestyle for lack of a better word is already a target. There's nothing new about that but that said, I don't think there will be a mass crackdown any time soon.



LaTigresse -> RE: Where do you stand on this position? (9/10/2011 7:43:13 AM)

Your choice of font indicates a sense of drama I don't want to play into.

Here is the reality. The U.S. was founded by puritans looking for a new place to practice their religious beliefs without persecution. Unfortunately, as with all religiouns, that foundation created a very narrow view of what is socially acceptable, basically a mindset that is exactly what the founders were escaping. It's not right, but it is human nature. We want the freedom to do what we believe is right but we also want everyone else to be just like us.

The majority of the U.S. is Christian. The majority of Christians in the U.S. have a problem with homosexuality. The majority of Christians in the U.S. have A LOT of weird sexual hangups, strange ideas about what is 'right' and 'wrong'.

Personal morality will always overflow into people's concepts of what should be law, and their political beliefs.

One thing that freaks people out more than anything else, any concept that challenges their core beliefs. Those beliefs that are with them since before they were able to consciously think about the feasibility of those beliefs. Morality and religioun challenges are terrifying to people. I call it the "Oh my god I might go to HELL!!!" reaction.

The only way to fight that stuff is by example. What you are seeing is the fear reaction to that. "If I put a face with gay it becomes human instead of some obscure satan. If I accept it as human, I might accept IT. IT is WRONG! If I accept wrong, I might go to hell!"



housesub4you -> RE: Where do you stand on this position? (9/10/2011 7:48:52 AM)

The choice of font was because when I put the quote in italics I could not get rid of the bold for some reason and the size of the font increased when I clicked off the italics.  It was not meant to imply any sense at all other than my lack of knowledge getting back to the original font.



willbeurdaddy -> RE: Where do you stand on this position? (9/10/2011 8:02:29 AM)

The narrow minded will always resist and isolate those who are "different". Because of our age difference we deal with those "sideways looks" and hushed conversations nearly every time we are out in public, and it isnt just from older people. We were at a bar after a concert and a table of 20 something girls were on swivel heads the whole time. We both thought there were even a gay couple or two at the table.

However, I don't see any party or faction of a party being powerful enough and extreme enough to make what is currently legal illegal.



lovmuffin -> RE: Where do you stand on this position? (9/10/2011 8:40:55 AM)

I'm going to venture to guess a republican said that.  I'm not so concerned as to worry about some extreme absurd law getting passed but it hurts the party.  I mean if a conservative is preaching to a gay person or any one else for that matter about the evil of gajillion dollar debts and deficits they seem to get it.  But when they start blabbering the nonsense the OP quoted, watch em dig in their heals.



tazzygirl -> RE: Where do you stand on this position? (9/10/2011 9:26:55 AM)

Today, 57 percent of the American public believes homosexuality should be sanctioned as an acceptable alternative lifestyle – the highest the Gallup Poll has recorded since 1982. Also indicating higher tolerance, 59 percent of Americans believe homosexual relations should be legal.

http://www.christianpost.com/news/gay-tolerance-in-u-s-reaching-record-marks-27674/



TheHeretic -> RE: Where do you stand on this position? (9/10/2011 9:46:31 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: housesub4you

If you're a conservative or liberal where do you stand in supporting people who make statements like the one below. 



Well, I fully support their right to say it.  One of the great things about free speech, is how it can make it so easy to spot the idiots and assholes, regardless of their affiliation.



GreedyTop -> RE: Where do you stand on this position? (9/10/2011 9:48:47 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

Today, 57 percent of the American public believes homosexuality should be sanctioned as an acceptable alternative lifestyle – the highest the Gallup Poll has recorded since 1982. Also indicating higher tolerance, 59 percent of Americans believe homosexual relations should be legal.

http://www.christianpost.com/news/gay-tolerance-in-u-s-reaching-record-marks-27674/



that applies to those who were polled.. what about the umpteen millions that weren't?

I agree with LaT.



Kaliko -> RE: Where do you stand on this position? (9/10/2011 9:50:28 AM)

What we do is not out there and threatening family values in the way that some people think homosexuality is. There may be the occasional public display, of course, but we're not fighting to have collaring ceremonies to act as legal matrimony, or for the right to cane a sub at the local park. Much of what we do is behind closed doors. (The internet is a different story, of course.)

The acceptance of homosexuality is being pushed on people that don't want it pushed on them. Nobody is pushing BDSM on them, as far as I know. I think that's the difference. There always was and always has been homosexuality and kink. But now, people are being threatened by the one, even expected to support it publicly and possibly financially, but not by the other. Even further, it's now politically correct to consider someone closed-minded, ignorant, discriminatory, etc., if they say they're against homosexuality. No one says that if someone says they're against hitting a woman who misbehaves. If one vocalizes that they don't support BDSM, they're not judged like they are with homosexuality, and so, there is no threat to their values in regards to BDSM like there is with homosexuality.

Just my thoughts.




ClassIsInSession -> RE: Where do you stand on this position? (9/10/2011 10:14:34 AM)

While there are those who like to point the finger and condemn, across a broad spectrum of "groups" of thought, and liberals can be just as guilty of this as "conservatives", the recent accusations flying that "The Tea Party" wants to hang black people from trees being a glaring example of it, I really think most of the problems that stem from intolerance are the result of inappropriate behavior causing a knee jerk reaction.

My case for this is simple. First, when you identify yourself purely by one facet of your character, be it race, sexual preference, religion or anything else, you are essentially narrowing who you are down to "poster child" status, and that's like tarring and feathering yourself. Because someone is black, white, yellow or red, gay, straight or bisexual, christian, muslim, buddhist or athiest....all of these things are one-dimensional. Just like not all italians are mobsters...we are all complex, individual people. By forcing one dimension of our character....we cause a violent reaction because we are becoming a stereotype by not bringing the whole of ourselves to the table. I've said for decades that if equality were the issue, then it's all about being a part of humanity, not about being part of a race, religion, gender, sexual preference or economic level.

Second, I don't like to see vanilla heterosexual people making out in public, particularly when there are children around...and the same holds true for homesexual relations or BDSM relations. I just don't think children need to be exposed to that arbitrarily. But I completely believe that couples of any sexual preference should be able to cohabitate, pass on property, share benefits, etc....in precisely the same ways that a traditional couple have been able to. Without question. Really even polygamy should be more tolerated than it is.

Bear in mind also that it hasn't just been in the United States where homosexual behavior, and most aspects of BDSM have been considered abnormal or even mental illness. Sadism/Masochism specifically were listed as mental illnesses in psychiatric practices for a very long time.

As I've had friends from pretty much every facet of sexual preference, race, religion and other distinguishing differences, throughout almost my entire life, I think it boils down to being a whole person rather than portraying that one aspect. It's when we highlight the differences rather than the commonalities that we create problems for ourselves. Ask yourself this question, do you think this is my friend Steve, or this is my (insert stereotype) friend Steve?




willbeurdaddy -> RE: Where do you stand on this position? (9/10/2011 5:50:48 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

Today, 57 percent of the American public believes homosexuality should be sanctioned as an acceptable alternative lifestyle –


Today 87 percent of the American public doesnt know whether "sanctioned" means approved of or restricted.



DomYngBlk -> RE: Where do you stand on this position? (9/10/2011 5:53:06 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: housesub4you

Ok, I'm just going to make an assumption that most of the people on this site, have at least a somewhat liberal view of sexual freedoms.  I'm biasing that on the fact that we are on this site, and have the lifestyle as part of our life in one way or another.  So hopefully we feel that simply based on this lifestyle we should be free to enjoy it as we see fit.

which brings me to my point/question.  If you're a conservative or liberal where do you stand in supporting people who make statements like the one below.  I left out the party affiliation and name of the person who made the statement.  It was made this week in reference to 9/11

And you know, every day our young people…they’re bombarded with ‘homosexuality is normal and natural.’ It’s something they have to deal with every day. Fortunately we don’t have to deal with a terrorist attack every day, and that’s what I mean. It’s more dangerous, and yes I think that it’s also more dangerous because it will tear down the moral fiber of this nation.

If they are saying being gay is more dangerous to this country then terrorism, how long do you think it will be before this lifestyle is the target?



I am not in that lifestyle but from where I sit I sure see it as being a target in our society everyday....that statement just proves the point



DomImus -> RE: Where do you stand on this position? (9/11/2011 12:05:58 AM)

Let it become a target. It already is a target in case you haven't been paying attention. Maybe not as big of a target as homosexuality but a target nonetheless. I couldn't care less either way. I practice BDSM within the confines of a stable, monogamous heterosexual relationship. What BDSM does take place happens in the privacy of our homes. Not a single person I know has any inkling of the kinky shit I am into unless I have told them about it. Let them come. I'll be dead by the time they find me.

It was extremely difficult to cut and paste the quote and identify the name and party affiliation of the author. Is this the kind of left field shit you really worry about? I never even heard of the woman before your post. He's about as bat shit crazy as she is but I would be far more concerned about Al Sharpton than I would be about anything she says.




tazzygirl -> RE: Where do you stand on this position? (9/11/2011 12:15:02 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy


quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

Today, 57 percent of the American public believes homosexuality should be sanctioned as an acceptable alternative lifestyle –


Today 87 percent of the American public doesnt know whether "sanctioned" means approved of or restricted.


Hell, 97% of the posters here dont know either.



M4S73R -> RE: Where do you stand on this position? (9/11/2011 1:28:31 AM)

First, isnt BDSM illiegal? Secondly, as long as there is "something" that people can say is "Against god" their will be bigotry. Unless everyone wants to run around burning down churches and burning bibles, this wont change imo



tazzygirl -> RE: Where do you stand on this position? (9/11/2011 2:14:56 AM)

Legal aspects

Several of the activities in sexual BDSM play would be considered illegal and fall under the definitions of rape, assault or similar crimes or torts, if performed without consent. However, most legal systems include a general defense that activities performed with the victim's consent shall not be considered a crime or a tort.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Consent_(BDSM)

Its a good read, for wiki. If you want to expand upon this, a new thread might be the ticket.



Aneirin -> RE: Where do you stand on this position? (9/11/2011 5:32:52 AM)

As far as I am aware, politicians and would be politicians depend on others for their position or future position, therefore if someone standing in a position of leadership by being a spokesman although entitled to freedom of speech in your system runs the risk of fucking themselves up with such statements as although they may be chanting to other so bigotted, their words are heard by others via the media. Words which those alone could change a persons oppinion of them, but personally no matter how much I liked a propective leader, the utterance of something like that that affects people who cause no harm to society whould make me change my mind about them as a leader.

But for someone to say such about moral fibre, one has to first understand what that thing is, perhaps certain entities are in fact brainwashed by out of date books written by out of date people. The world moves on, it evolves and must evolve as to go backwards risks so much.

Anyone want a return to executing women because of mouldy grain ?

Perhaps it is we are all afraid of change, we fear the unknown future and so by default we prefer the past, but that past to us was someone elses future, yet they made it, and so shall we to become the future's past.

But Nazism isn't dead, those ideas still ferment, but it is up to us to recognise them where they exist and not give them power, becsuse the vendors might happen to stand for something else you agree on, let the ass holes in, they will fuck you when it is they have lost touch with the mob preferring their new masters.



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