RE: Morality contracts concerning carreers (Full Version)

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Chaingang -> RE: Morality contracts concerning carreers (5/22/2006 5:46:18 AM)

I would ask if not signing is cause for dismissal or not being hired. You should attempt to record or get their answers in writing - perhaps via email. I would probably not sign it. Then I would talk to a lawyer. It's entirely possible that their morality clause or contract reaches to the height of discrimination. You may have actually won the lotto here...

Sometimes lawsuits are the solution and not the problem.



BlkTallFullfig -> RE: Morality contracts concerning carreers (5/22/2006 6:46:49 AM)

I would sign the contract because contrary to popular belief the economy is not wonderful, and the lifestyle is not going to pay for your nice car and house if you lose your job and you aren't already wealthy.  I know at least a couple of professionals who've lost their clost to 6fig salary and are looking for months now.
I'm all for being real, but first, you have to be a responsible adult.  Unless you can afford to live without that job, sign the contract and keep the public stuff to a minimum or go out of town for your fun.   JMO,  M



Proprietrix -> RE: Morality contracts concerning carreers (5/22/2006 8:01:55 AM)

I wouldn't sign it. I'd be at monster.com quicker than they could throw that contract in the trash. I don't even care what the wording is, what aspects of my life it covers, or whether or not an attorney looked at it. The mere fact that my employer felt he even had the right to ask such an absurd and intrusive thing in the first place would be enough for me to politely give him the finger.

I have yet to find a job that's so important to me that I'm willing to let my employer control my ethics. But I'm stubborn that way, sticking to my own morals and all. I'm also absolutely prepared to take the consequences of my refusal to sign any such ludicrous contract. I'm perfectly content to walk away from said job, knowing that I value my personally chosen morals and ethics more than I value a paycheck. I'd be that way even if I weren't out of the closet. Or even if I weren't in the lifestyle at all. My morals aren't in place to be bent by money.
That's just me though.



irvinecouple949 -> RE: Morality contracts concerning carreers (5/22/2006 9:08:28 AM)

Just my 2 cents- if you are in a "right to work" state, such as California, you don't lose anything by signing. You can be fired at any time for any reason anyway. If not- heed the above advice to find another job ASAP and make your reason for leaving clear. What they are primarily looking for here is recreational drug use- any one who ID'd you from an online forum or live event would be outing themselves in the process. One suggestion that I have seen in other forums on a related issue (non-competition agreements) suggested scanning the form, photoshopping out the text, and replacing it in the same font with nearly identical (but suitably changed) wording- with the idea that no one really reads every form in the huge stack that is part of the hiring process. Since I doubt this is legal I can't recommend this.



chamber -> RE: Morality contracts concerning carreers (5/22/2006 8:41:56 PM)

Unfortunately, most states are "at will employment" states, which means that an employer can terminate you for any reason (or no reason at all), except for a few specifically protected characteristics (race, religion, disability, etc).  Therefore if you do not sign the agreement, they can, and likely will, terminate you.

On a side note, it amazes me how, in a country founded on and theoretically still devoted to freedom, personal freedom is continually being eroded.



ama -> RE: Morality contracts concerning carreers (5/22/2006 8:51:12 PM)

My husband worked for a large restaurant chain and had to sign one of those.  It put a very small crimp in our lifestyle as we weren't about to give up the whole thing -- we still went to public events with the same belief that others have mentioned on here -- if they want to out you to someone, they have to explain how they came to be there as well.  We never had any problems with it.  The only thing we did trim back was hosting parties ourselves.That wasn't much of a problem as we had several others willing to host. Good luck,Ama



Chaingang -> RE: Morality contracts concerning carreers (5/22/2006 9:00:33 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: chamber
Unfortunately, most states are "at will employment" states, which means that an employer can terminate you for any reason (or no reason at all), except for a few specifically protected characteristics (race, religion, disability, etc). 


Exactly. Just stop right there.

They can't fire you for not signing a morality contract if it's content reaches into areas that are protected because of laws against discrimination.

I am not a lawyer, but it's sticky to fire someone for discriminatory reasons or just after an accident at work and the like - then the employer must be quite careful. People win wrongful termination lawsuits in California all the time, and this is one of those "at will" type states also.



candystripper -> RE: Morality contracts concerning carreers (5/23/2006 8:22:04 AM)

i was an attorney for a state with an Open Government law.  Nonetheless, the ethics code applicable to lawyers generally emphasized a client's right to confidentiality, so my position was that if i had been in the room during a discussion, it was priviledged. 
 
i honestly cannot remember if i signed anything such as a "morals" agreement when i commenced employment; certain laws were passed governing the conduct of present and past government employees, but there was a lack of consensus as to how they applied to attorneys due to client's right of the counsel of his/her choice.
 
i represented battered women....never had to seek them out....word got around.  i was forced to sign an agreement effectively preventing this pro bono work....but i believe it was aimed directly at me, as a batterer complained to my employer.  Naturally i found my employer's action on this matter really skanky.
 
IMHO, a "morals clause" in an employment agreement is a way for employers to help insulate themselves from suits for wrongful termination.  Unless specified, i cannot see attending a munch as "immoral" but of course, the employer should not be told of O/one's BDSM interests in any event.
 
i was offered several bribes in my time; i never accepted, but i know "where the bodies are buried" as to some other state employees.  Such is life.
 
candystripper



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