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RE: Prenups - 9/25/2011 8:44:58 AM   
Iamsemisweet


Posts: 3651
Joined: 4/9/2011
From: The Great Northwest, USA
Status: offline 		That is where it stands and no doubt will remain. I don't think DD is stupid, althgh I think maybe she was less than polite on this thread.
Well, my next thread will be about tomatoes. Wonder if that will turn into a cluster fuck too.
quote:

ORIGINAL: Arpig

quote:

still stuck in.....you are an evil untrusting person betting on the end of a relationship if you want one and you are a stupid naive twit if you are offended by the very idea..............?
I think that's pretty much where things stand.


_____________________________

Alice: But I don't want to go among mad people.
The Cat: Oh, you can't help that. We're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad.
Alice: How do you know I'm mad?
The Cat: You must be. Or you wouldn't have come here.

(in reply to Arpig)
Profile   Post #: 121
RE: Prenups - 9/25/2011 8:46:21 AM   
LaTigresse


Posts: 26123
Joined: 1/15/2006
Status: offline 		Will it be about the pros and cons of fucking clusters of tomatoes versus individual vegetables?

_____________________________

My twisted, self deprecating, sense of humour, finds alot to laugh about, in your lack of one!

Just because you are well educated, articulate, and can use big, fancy words, properly........does not mean you are right!

(in reply to Iamsemisweet)
Profile   Post #: 122
RE: Prenups - 9/25/2011 9:01:34 AM   
CeriseNin


Posts: 286
Joined: 4/8/2010
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: HeatherMcLeather

I wouldn't bother marrying somebody with whom I didn't plan on sharing my life, and that includes any and all assets I may have at the time of marriage and acquired afterward. It isn't a partnership, it is a union, you know, two become one and all that.

I would also consider it an insult to the person I was marrying to ask for one, implying that I didn't really think the marriage would last and that I wasn't really serious about it. When I marry, it will be for love, with the intent of remaining married for good. Not as a temporary arrangement for access to a benefits package or tax breaks. That is crass.


So would I, but I'd ask them to sign it anyway. I have assets that come from my family that they worked damn hard for. It absolutely will be protected. If any future wife is offended by that, then perhaps I'm not the woman for her. I can live with that.

(in reply to HeatherMcLeather)
Profile   Post #: 123
RE: Prenups - 9/25/2011 9:05:57 AM   
LaTigresse


Posts: 26123
Joined: 1/15/2006
Status: offline 		Ceris, I look at it this way. If they are insulted and would consider your asking, to be the death knell of the relationship, then it wasn't much of a relationship.

_____________________________

My twisted, self deprecating, sense of humour, finds alot to laugh about, in your lack of one!

Just because you are well educated, articulate, and can use big, fancy words, properly........does not mean you are right!

(in reply to CeriseNin)
Profile   Post #: 124
RE: Prenups - 9/25/2011 9:13:29 AM   
CeriseNin


Posts: 286
Joined: 4/8/2010
Status: offline 		Pretty much on the same page as you. It goes both ways, imo. If she loves me and not the assets, she'll sign the damn prenup. She can be insulted that I ask, if I can be insulted that she isn't willing to take her hand out of the cookie jar,

(in reply to LaTigresse)
Profile   Post #: 125
RE: Prenups - 9/25/2011 9:43:23 AM   
HeatherMcLeather


Posts: 2559
Joined: 5/21/2011
From: The dog house
Status: offline
quote:

Ceris, I look at it this way. If they are insulted and would consider your asking, to be the death knell of the relationship, then it wasn't much of a relationship.
I figure that if you need to have a pre-nup, then it isn't much of a relationship.

quote:

If she loves me and not the assets, she'll sign the damn prenup.
To my mind if you love me and not the assets, you won't even ask me to sign.

(in reply to LaTigresse)
Profile   Post #: 126
RE: Prenups - 9/25/2011 10:02:33 AM   
CeriseNin


Posts: 286
Joined: 4/8/2010
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: HeatherMcLeather

quote:

Ceris, I look at it this way. If they are insulted and would consider your asking, to be the death knell of the relationship, then it wasn't much of a relationship.
I figure that if you need to have a pre-nup, then it isn't much of a relationship.

quote:

If she loves me and not the assets, she'll sign the damn prenup.
To my mind if you love me and not the assets, you won't even ask me to sign.


But they aren't just assets; it's everything my father, his father, and his father before him worked hard to build, so that future generations may have. If it were about some money and a car, I wouldn't ask for a prenup, but it's not. It's about my entire family and everything they built. It's my duty to protect that. If a woman can't understand that, then she and I aren't meant to be.

< Message edited by CeriseNin -- 9/25/2011 10:03:43 AM >

(in reply to HeatherMcLeather)
Profile   Post #: 127
RE: Prenups - 9/25/2011 10:07:18 AM   
HeatherMcLeather


Posts: 2559
Joined: 5/21/2011
From: The dog house
Status: offline 		If you care more about the assets than her, then you are right, you are not meant to be.

(in reply to CeriseNin)
Profile   Post #: 128
RE: Prenups - 9/25/2011 10:15:15 AM   
CeriseNin


Posts: 286
Joined: 4/8/2010
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: HeatherMcLeather

If you care more about the assets than her, then you are right, you are not meant to be.

The assets were earned by my family's sweat, blood, and hardships they endured to get where they are. As my father's daughter, I get to share in his good fortune. But the reality is I didn't earn any of it, it's not my assets to gamble on, hence the prenup.

If I earned it all myself, I'd never ask anyone to sign a prenup.

(in reply to HeatherMcLeather)
Profile   Post #: 129
RE: Prenups - 9/25/2011 10:16:03 AM   
GreedyTop


Posts: 52100
Joined: 5/2/2007
From: Savannah, GA
Status: offline 		Heather.. I have to go with cerise on this.. do you not see that she isnt talking about just me/you/us? She's talking about a family legacy that extends beyond just the relationship between 2(or more) people.. the family was there first.. the legacy was there first.. and (personally) I see it it as protecting the interests of the family of blood.

I need to go sleep soon, I'm friggin TIRED.. but I will be happy to later go into the advantages of having shit spelled out in legal paperwork, from the POV of someone who has lost heritage items because shit wasnt exactly spelled out...

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(in reply to HeatherMcLeather)
Profile   Post #: 130
RE: Prenups - 9/25/2011 10:18:19 AM   
HeatherMcLeather


Posts: 2559
Joined: 5/21/2011
From: The dog house
Status: offline 		The origin or extent of the assets don't make things any different to me. If the assets mean more to you than marrying her does, then you shouldn't even be considering marriage..

(in reply to CeriseNin)
Profile   Post #: 131
RE: Prenups - 9/25/2011 10:20:48 AM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline
quote:

But they aren't just assets; it's everything my father, his father, and his father before him worked hard to build, so that future generations may have. If it were about some money and a car, I wouldn't ask for a prenup, but it's not. It's about my entire family and everything they built. It's my duty to protect that. If a woman can't understand that, then she and I aren't meant to be.


Cerise, I happen to agree with you. And if someone cant see how items such as those would mean a great deal not only to you but to future generations.... then she needs to hit the road.



_____________________________

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Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to CeriseNin)
Profile   Post #: 132
RE: Prenups - 9/25/2011 10:22:43 AM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline
quote:

To my mind if you love me and not the assets, you won't even ask me to sign.


The flip is also true.

If you love her and not her assets, then signing should not be a big deal.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to HeatherMcLeather)
Profile   Post #: 133
RE: Prenups - 9/25/2011 10:32:34 AM   
LaTigresse


Posts: 26123
Joined: 1/15/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: HeatherMcLeather

The origin or extent of the assets don't make things any different to me. If the assets mean more to you than marrying her does, then you shouldn't even be considering marriage..


Heather, I like you very much and I appreciate your intelligence. However, I do see your words as being representative of a very narrow point of view.

If I have been given the task of being responsible of something valuable that belonged to my grandmother. Which the expectation it would be kept in the family. I will use a chest and some family photos that my paternal grandmother gave me as example. I actually do not see these items as MINE. I see them as belonging to the family. My children, grand children, their children, etc.......

Because I do not look at these items as mere material possessions but instead family history. They are part of my family's story and heritage. They were intrusted to me, because I was trusted to care for them, and provide a safe place to store them, and make certain they stayed with the family and, along with the stories that goes with them, passed along. As my family heritage, something that will long outlive me and anyone I may have a relationship with.

If I was still with my exhusband, if he needed booze or drug money, he would have, without a doubt, looked at these items only for their material value and done his level best to sell these items without a thought or care for his children's heritage. I would venture to say that if I had stayed with him, I would very likely not have been intrusted with the care of these items.

As it is now......these items will remain in the family. They will continue to be a part of my family's heritage long after I am gone. No person I am in a relationship with will ever be able to change that, regardless of whether I am dead, or just totally batshit crazy.

That is the mindset of many prenups.

There are also prenups that actually protect the person being asked to sign them. Especially consider if you have some material wealth or the potential of such, and the person you are marrying is a part of a family business or some sort of partnership/business. That prenup can protect YOU in the event that an outside party sues the person/family/business you are marrying into.

You are approaching this topic from an irrational romantic mindset and the reality is that there is a lot more to it. Depending upon the individual situation, a prenup might be the best thing a person could ask you to sign. For your own well being.

< Message edited by LaTigresse -- 9/25/2011 10:34:35 AM >

_____________________________

My twisted, self deprecating, sense of humour, finds alot to laugh about, in your lack of one!

Just because you are well educated, articulate, and can use big, fancy words, properly........does not mean you are right!

(in reply to HeatherMcLeather)
Profile   Post #: 134
RE: Prenups - 9/25/2011 10:34:34 AM   
CeriseNin


Posts: 286
Joined: 4/8/2010
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: HeatherMcLeather

The origin or extent of the assets don't make things any different to me. If the assets mean more to you than marrying her does, then you shouldn't even be considering marriage..

But they make things very different to me and my family to whom I am loyal, and feel duty bound to protect what they worked for. It would be a betrayal to my father, indeed, to my entire family for me to take a gamble on assets that I didn't even earn.

(in reply to HeatherMcLeather)
Profile   Post #: 135
RE: Prenups - 9/25/2011 10:34:43 AM   
HeatherMcLeather


Posts: 2559
Joined: 5/21/2011
From: The dog house
Status: offline
quote:

If you love her and not her assets, then signing should not be a big deal.
Except that by asking me to sign she has already shown I am secondary to her assets in her mind, so I wouldn't be marrying her anyway. 

(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 136
RE: Prenups - 9/25/2011 10:36:32 AM   
LaTigresse


Posts: 26123
Joined: 1/15/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: HeatherMcLeather

quote:

If you love her and not her assets, then signing should not be a big deal.
Except that by asking me to sign she has already shown I am secondary to her assets in her mind, so I wouldn't be marrying her anyway. 


Maybe, but maybe not.

Maybe she is simply honouring a commitment she made prior to knowing you.

Would you want to be in a relationship with someone with whom you could could not trust to give her word, just because of a newer relationship?

_____________________________

My twisted, self deprecating, sense of humour, finds alot to laugh about, in your lack of one!

Just because you are well educated, articulate, and can use big, fancy words, properly........does not mean you are right!

(in reply to HeatherMcLeather)
Profile   Post #: 137
RE: Prenups - 9/25/2011 10:41:42 AM   
HeatherMcLeather


Posts: 2559
Joined: 5/21/2011
From: The dog house
Status: offline
quote:

the reality is that there is a lot more to it.
Not to me. None of the points put forward so far address what is the central issue. If you don't feel you can trust the person then you shouldn't be marrying them. If the assets are more important to you than marrying the person is, then you shouldn't be marrying that person.

(in reply to LaTigresse)
Profile   Post #: 138
RE: Prenups - 9/25/2011 10:42:18 AM   
LillyBoPeep


Posts: 6873
Joined: 12/29/2010
Status: offline 		i can understand where Heather's coming from. i mean, if you're concerned that your partner might do something awful with your family's history/historical property, then, to me, that means you don't trust them.

i would hope that as i got to know someone, my character would show him that that was not a risk with me.
if that worry persisted, i would assume he didn't trust me, and i probably wouldn't marry him because what do you have if you don't have trust?


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"Obey your Master." Metallica


(in reply to LaTigresse)
Profile   Post #: 139
RE: Prenups - 9/25/2011 10:43:09 AM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		I can see Heathers pov....

If you loved me, you wouldnt ask.

But I dont think Heather has thought of the flip side of that coin.

If you loved me, I wouldnt have to ask.... you would offer.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to LaTigresse)
Profile   Post #: 140
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