Wikileaks ... the legacy> (Full Version)

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FirmhandKY -> Wikileaks ... the legacy> (9/28/2011 6:32:29 AM)

Well, it's been a few months (has it been a year already?), and while that is still a very short time in historical terms, I just read an article about the impact of the "Wikileaks" release of all the secret documents from the US.

It's a pretty long, detailed read, and it makes a lot more points than are made in the extract below, so if you are interested in the subject, I'd recommend that you go to the article and read the whole thing.

What I find interesting is the sheer ... boredom ... associated with the release of all the documents.  The Iraq, Afghanistan and Iraq war material had basically no effect on anything, but the unintended consequences are also notable: the damage to the meme that simply releasing data will somehow "free the world" is just one.

Here is a short extract:

The WikiLeaks Illusion
by Alasdair Roberts

Late last November, the antisecrecy group WikiLeaks achieved the greatest triumph in its short history. A consortium of major news media organizations—including The New York Times, The Guardian, Der Spiegel, Le Monde, and El País—began publishing excerpts from a quarter-million cables between the U.S. State Department and its diplomatic outposts that WikiLeaks had obtained. The group claimed that the cables constituted “the largest set of confidential documents ever to be released into the public domain.” The Guardian predicted that the disclosures would trigger a “global diplomatic crisis.”

...

The 2010 disclosures also revealed fundamental problems with the WikiLeaks project. The logic that initially motivated Assange and his colleagues was straightforward: WikiLeaks would post leaked information on the Internet and rely on the public to interpret it, become outraged, and demand reform.

...

This proposition was soon tested and found wanting. When WikiLeaks released a series of U.S. military counterinsurgency manuals in 2008, Domscheit-Berg thought there would be “outrage around the world, and I expected journalists to beat down our doors.” The manuals described techniques for preventing the overthrow of governments friendly to the United States. In fact, the reaction was negligible. “No one cared,” writes Domscheit-Berg ...

...

WikiLeaks itself wanted bigger things to flow from its work. It continued to expect outrage and political action. Assange told Britain’s Channel 4 News last July that he anticipated that the release of the Afghan war documents would shift public opinion against the war. There was a similar expectation following release of the Iraq war documents. But these hopes were again disappointed. In some polls, perceptions about the conduct of the Afghan war actually became more favorable after the WikiLeaks release. Meanwhile, opinion about American engagement in Iraq remained essentially unchanged, as it had been for several years.

...

We live in very different times. There is no popular movement against U.S. military engagement overseas, no broad reaction against established authority in American society, no youth rebellion. The public mood in the United States is one of economic uncertainty and physical insecurity. Many Americans want an assurance that their government is willing and able to act forcefully in the pursuit of U.S. interests. In this climate, the incidents revealed by WikiLeaks—spying on United Nations diplomats, covert military action against terrorists, negotiations with regimes that are corrupt or guilty of human rights abuses—might not even be construed as abuses of power at all. On the contrary, they could be regarded as proof that the U.S. government is prepared to get its hands dirty to protect its citizens.

...

The more WikiLeaks disclosed last year, the more American public opinion hardened against it. By December, according to a CNN poll, almost 80 percent of Americans disapproved of WikiLeaks’ release of U.S. diplomatic and military documents. In a CBS News poll, most respondents said they thought the disclosures were likely to hurt U.S. foreign relations. Three-quarters affirmed that there are “some things the public does not have a right to know if it might affect national security.”


...

Beyond this, there is a final and larger problem. It may well be that many of the things WikiLeaks imagines are secrets are not really secrets at all. It may be that what WikiLeaks revealed when it drew back the curtain is more or less what most Americans already suspected had been going on, and were therefore prepared to tolerate.

To put it another way, much of what WikiLeaks has released might best be described as open secrets. It would have been no great shock to most Americans, for example, to learn about the United States’ covert activities against terrorists in Yemen. “The only surprising thing about the WikiLeaks revelations is that they contain no surprises,” says the noted Slovenian philosopher Slavoj Zizek, a professor at the European Graduate School. “The real disturbance was at the level of appearances: We can no longer pretend we don’t know what everyone knows we know.”

Do you believe that the release of all the material had any long-term, positive effects?

Firm




Aneirin -> RE: Wikileaks ... the legacy> (9/28/2011 6:42:28 AM)

The only thing to come out of the saga, I believe is those that hold the secrets, hold them closer, trust has been eroded and the belief that whatever a document might be called in terms of who can see it, well the world stage holds more power than threats of incarceration.

But with all the information that is bobbing around the world, people are simply overwhelmed with it, there is so much, so what is the point anything being secret anymore, because all the majority do when they receive it via web forums such as these, is be outraged for a time until the next topic of interest comes up, then the outrage is quickly forgotten. Just view page two on this forum, then page three, then four then deep into the archives.

Perhaps there is much truth in the fact that secrets can be hidden in plain sight




SternSkipper -> RE: Wikileaks ... the legacy> (9/28/2011 6:54:24 AM)

Alasdair Roberts Pretty much nailed it... not much more to say besides it's become boring seeing these dopes that operate more like gossip columnists and thieves besmirch the good name of hacking. Jerks like that are why I went 'commercial' two decades ago.
"Hi. My name's Julian want some ghb? I'm a famous hacker"




farglebargle -> RE: Wikileaks ... the legacy> (9/28/2011 7:43:34 AM)

It reminded the crooks to not leave evidence around, if anything...




Kirata -> RE: Wikileaks ... the legacy> (9/28/2011 7:59:14 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: FirmhandKY

Do you believe that the release of all the material had any long-term, positive effects?

Not for the public.

I think the boredom simply reflects the fact that so many people already distrust the government and view politicians as liars. So what's new here? How deep and pervasive it is? Gee what a surprise.

Fargle nailed the real benefit, and to whom it will accrue. They're going to make sure this can't happen again.

K.




Owner59 -> RE: Wikileaks ... the legacy> (9/28/2011 8:27:28 AM)


"They're going to make sure this can't happen again."


This I doubt.


At some point in the near future,20 - 30 years,we will get suckered into another disaster/killing field/adventure like Iraq or Viet Nam,etc.


It won`t be because folks don`t know history or it`s lessons.


It`ll be because folks don`t listen to them.




SternSkipper -> RE: Wikileaks ... the legacy> (9/28/2011 8:56:58 PM)

quote:

It reminded the crooks to not leave evidence around, if anything...


Yeah, if only he had been on tour with us to clean up the 'Great Weed Bandit of Route 90' ... If he'd simply been there to check his Wreck Du' Tour, could've saved a fortune in Protopipes[:D]




FirstQuaker -> RE: Wikileaks ... the legacy> (9/28/2011 9:03:48 PM)

History is filled with leaks and revalations, and if the fools haven't learned in 7,000 years, I doubt any lesson learned will last more then a generation, at best.

We have a saying that translates to "The Sun eventually rises on all things done at night."




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