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Chaz Bono vs. Far Rightwing Douchebaggery - 9/29/2011 5:27:50 PM   
VioletGray


Posts: 359
Joined: 10/29/2007
From: Baltimore, MD
Status: offline 		O.k. So there's this guy:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HEfAiQWJKlI

And there was public outcry and the attempt to organize a boycott by these douchebagettes:

http://onemillionmoms.com/IssueDetail.asp?id=424

Needless to say I don't agree with these people, and I'm willing to bet that neither do most of the people here, lib or con. But I at least like to understand the argument. The main theme seems to be that Chaz's transgender status may cause identity issues in children and possibly cause them to be trans. There is one GIANT problem with this, though:

Little trans kids grow completely submerged in cisgender (non-trans) families, schools, communities and TV. So my question is, how does seeing a transperson on TV make little cisgender kids trans?

And how come no one has pointed out this out?

< Message edited by VioletGray -- 9/29/2011 5:32:12 PM >
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RE: Chaz Bono vs. Far Rightwing Douchebaggery - 9/29/2011 5:42:14 PM   
SuzeCheri


Posts: 483
Joined: 7/19/2011
From: Outside looking in
Status: offline 		For the guy in the first clip and the OMM people, I will let George speak for me: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xeKfMNlQTho

And the idea that it would cause some sort of sudden surge in being transgender people is just well douchbaggy.
From the OMM rant:
quote:

Thousands of Christian counselors and pastors are available all across the country to help anyone who is struggling and living in any kind of sin including homosexuality, gender identity disorder or gender dysphoria. If you or someone you know needs help finding a Christian counselor go to www.AACC.net for more information.
I would think that a dispassionate explanation that gender identity issues do exist and what they are, would encourage some young person struggling silently with those issues would be more inclined to speak up and ask for help. I think the OMM douchebags are worried that those kids will seek sensible scientific medical assistance rather than subject themselves to the Christian solution of a life of shame, and suffering by attempting to deal with their problem through prayer, repression, and denial.

(in reply to VioletGray)
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RE: Chaz Bono vs. Far Rightwing Douchebaggery - 9/29/2011 5:42:32 PM   
LafayetteLady


Posts: 7683
Joined: 5/2/2007
From: Northern New Jersey
Status: offline 		C'mon, you know the answer. No one pointed it out because it doesn't exist.

I read the second link for One Million Moms and I did write a letter (under their organization), commending ABC and Disney for being progressive enough to have Chaz Bono on the show to give others hope that they can survive and find happiness.

I think it would be great if a lot of people did just what I did. Imagine, these vile, bigoted and ignorant people would have all these letters that actually SUPPORT Chaz Bono coming from their site.

(in reply to VioletGray)
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RE: Chaz Bono vs. Far Rightwing Douchebaggery - 9/29/2011 5:44:37 PM   
SuzeCheri


Posts: 483
Joined: 7/19/2011
From: Outside looking in
Status: offline 		EXTRA!!!

Consider it done! Four such letters going out straight away.

(in reply to LafayetteLady)
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RE: Chaz Bono vs. Far Rightwing Douchebaggery - 9/29/2011 5:45:02 PM   
LafayetteLady


Posts: 7683
Joined: 5/2/2007
From: Northern New Jersey
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SuzeCheri

....subject themselves to the Christian solution of a life of shame, and suffering by attempting to deal with their problem through prayer, repression, and denial.[/color]




The is a very large number of Christians who DO NOT follow that belief, and support Chaz Bono and his bravery for going public and offering hope to others, who like him, have struggled with gender identity issues.

(in reply to SuzeCheri)
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RE: Chaz Bono vs. Far Rightwing Douchebaggery - 9/29/2011 5:46:44 PM   
LafayetteLady


Posts: 7683
Joined: 5/2/2007
From: Northern New Jersey
Status: offline 		I figure if we get everyone we can to do it, those bigots will be totally humiliated and won't be able to figure out how they got so blindsided.

Now who wants to try to watch and see if they figure it out?

(in reply to SuzeCheri)
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RE: Chaz Bono vs. Far Rightwing Douchebaggery - 9/29/2011 6:09:14 PM   
Lucylastic


Posts: 40310
Status: offline 		The kids may well be a little confused the first time they are faced with a transgendered person. It has so much to do with how the parent deals with it that makes the difference.
The kids will shrug, its the parents that scream and pee themselves.
Im off to write :)

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(in reply to LafayetteLady)
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RE: Chaz Bono vs. Far Rightwing Douchebaggery - 9/29/2011 6:14:47 PM   
SuzeCheri


Posts: 483
Joined: 7/19/2011
From: Outside looking in
Status: offline 		Yes Ma'am, but those Christians are not the ones who are protesting this, nor are they the ones who would send their children to "Christian counsellors" to deal with it as a question of sin rather than as a medical problem.

Perhaps I should have put it: subject themselves to the "Christian" solution, or in some way been more specific that I was referring to the fundamentalist type of Christian.

EPD: I have sent my letter, now for the rest of Haytch House to follow suite.

C.


< Message edited by SuzeCheri -- 9/29/2011 6:16:25 PM >

(in reply to LafayetteLady)
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RE: Chaz Bono vs. Far Rightwing Douchebaggery - 9/29/2011 7:07:18 PM   
Termyn8or


Posts: 18681
Joined: 11/12/2005
Status: offline 		VG, it is a psychological thing. Straight vanillas who are secure in their sexuality have no problem with those in any alternative lifestyle or situation. It is those who have their own insecurities who must trumpet to the world their supposed disdain for these alternatives, when in fact they are intrigued by them usually. Fear is the problem, they fear discovey to the point which they will deny their own desires to stay "popular" with their crowd.

It is those people who are the most dangerous because they are the most bitter, in fact the most jealous. Of course that is what makes them bitter, and sometimes dangerous and violent. In this regard, I personally know people who have grown up and changed up and truly regret their former actions. Hopefully none of those actions were of the most permanent type, and I am not asking.

You see in the old days before a textbook was written people thought. They thought things out and they were well capable of doing so, unlike those of today who get to do  it just because they have letters after their name. Psychology was alot better, they did things that shrinks of today could never do without drugs. They understood human nature much better and in more detail. I have read their words.

I am not going to perv you right now so I don't know your age, but I am 51. When I was young I remember older Men chiding us youngins for having long hair. Later when I learned, it came clear to me. They were jealous. The most vocal of these oldsters were bald or nearly bald. THEY WERE JEALOUS !
How many other interhuman situations might there be to which such an axiom could apply ?

You [all] tell me.

T^T

(in reply to VioletGray)
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RE: Chaz Bono vs. Far Rightwing Douchebaggery - 9/29/2011 8:00:15 PM   
Fightdirecto


Posts: 1101
Joined: 8/3/2004
Status: offline 		As the dad of a transgendered kid - I think my kid is a better dance than Chaz Bono.

< Message edited by Fightdirecto -- 9/29/2011 8:01:25 PM >

_____________________________

"I swore never to be silent whenever and wherever human beings endure suffering and humiliation. We must always take sides. Neutrality helps the oppressor, never the victim. Silence encourages the tormentor, never the tormented.””
- Ellie Wiesel

(in reply to Termyn8or)
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RE: Chaz Bono vs. Far Rightwing Douchebaggery - 9/29/2011 10:08:53 PM   
LafayetteLady


Posts: 7683
Joined: 5/2/2007
From: Northern New Jersey
Status: offline 		But is your kid as heavy as Chaz? Because that is what is really messing up Chaz's performances - his weight. He more often than not remembers to point his toes and stays in count. I know that sounds silly, but that is something the judges will always pick on.

More importantly, Chaz, who was on the bottom in scores coming into elimination night beat that Elisabetta who was second. THAT woman can't keep count at all and moves as though she isn't even hearing the music. They said she did better, but I think it was just they put a longer dress on her so you couldn't see the train wreck that was her leg work. Her sole "claim to fame" was being George Clooney's ex girlfriend. George is one of America's sweethearts and she is no longer with him, so America will no longer be with her. In my opinion, that is what got her eliminated.

And as much as I like Chaz, and think it is great he is on the show and working so hard, I'm rooting for JR Martinez, the injured vet/soap star. He is a very good dancer and another that by competing shows you that his disability isn't going to destroy him.

(in reply to Fightdirecto)
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RE: Chaz Bono vs. Far Rightwing Douchebaggery - 9/29/2011 10:33:54 PM   
tweakabelle


Posts: 7522
Joined: 10/16/2007
From: Sydney Australia
Status: offline 		I read the link at OMM. What an ugly set of values those people articulated there. Life is hard enough for trans kids without adding an additional layer of guilt and self-hate. Trans people seem to face more entrenched virulent hatred than any other grouping it seems to me. It's sad that these OMM people are claiming to be motivated by "love" when their actions are anything but loving.

I wish there was something I could do to help. Sadly, living this far away it seems there are few options open to me. If there is anything I can do please forward your suggestion to me and I'll do it if I can.

BTW 'conventional gender identity theory claims that gender identity is "fixed and immutable" at about age 18 months. If this is valid, then it really doesn't matter what children are exposed to - their sense of gender is supposed to be unchangeable. Lucy's point about parents hiding behind their children to ventilate their own hatred and neuroses seems spot on to me.

Children accept things easily. It takes adults to inculcate problems into the children before children internalise those issues. This is a graphic illustration of that process at work.

< Message edited by tweakabelle -- 9/29/2011 10:38:59 PM >

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RE: Chaz Bono vs. Far Rightwing Douchebaggery - 9/29/2011 10:42:38 PM   
Edwynn


Posts: 4105
Joined: 10/26/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: VioletGray

And how come no one has pointed out this out?



Maybe because some people have a life, and were/are completely unaware of this little corner of "Entertainment Tonight!" soap opera. 

I knew I came to this site for a reason. I actually take a glance at 'the tube' 2-4 times a year, so I'm likely to miss out on really important things like this. Thanks for keeping 'the unwashed' up on things.

But now that I have dived in; well heck, she was funny back in the day, and he is at least somewhat interesting to listen to today.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w8M_-CJkO2A&feature=related


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mhia4_QPlEc



But I really like this little ditty, from the second link in the OP, at the tail of the 'OneMillionKnottedKnickersMoms' diatribe;


"NOTE: If you see a commercial or program which is offensive, email us the information."


That would be quite a task there, to say the least. Shoot, something like 64 channels, just for basic cable, and then each and every commercial within. I actually do not take offense all that easily, but those TV and advert guys and gals get paid the big bucks for a reason. What was that show? "American Idolotry," or something like that. Even higher ratings than the 58 police/crime shows ranking immediately beneath it.



If that group calling themselves 'Anonymous' had anything to do with betterment of society whatsoever,  why are we still having to hear about Charlie Sheen or Justin Bieber, or even Simon Cowell for that matter. Oh, right. Nevermind. (when in doubt, read the OP)




< Message edited by Edwynn -- 9/29/2011 11:05:47 PM >

(in reply to VioletGray)
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RE: Chaz Bono vs. Far Rightwing Douchebaggery - 9/29/2011 11:26:36 PM   
Edwynn


Posts: 4105
Joined: 10/26/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: VioletGray

Chaz Bono vs. Far Rightwing Douchebaggery




quote:

ORIGINAL: SuzeCheri

For the guy in the first clip and the OMM people, I will let George speak for me: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xeKfMNlQTho

And the idea that it would cause some sort of sudden surge in being transgender people is just well douchbaggy.





Thanks ladies! I knew we could count on you to keep up the oldest and most worn out and anachronistic insult to the female gender ever devised. Thanks again for keeping us up on 'the modern world' here.




< Message edited by Edwynn -- 9/29/2011 11:48:21 PM >

(in reply to VioletGray)
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