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Want a tomato with your salad? Get a bank loan - 10/7/2011 8:54:03 AM   
Fightdirecto


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Forbes.com
quote:

A sponsor of Alabama's tough new immigration law told desperate tomato farmers Monday that he won't change the law, even though they told him that their crops are rotting in the field and they are at risk of losing their farms.

Republican state Sen. Scott Beason of Gardendale met with about 50 growers, workers, brokers and business people Monday at a tomato packing shed on Chandler Mountain in northeast Alabama. They complained that the new law, which went into effect Thursday, scared off many of their migrant workers at harvest time.

"The tomatoes are rotting on the vine, and there is very little we can do," said Chad Smith, who farms tomatoes with his uncle, father and brother.

"My position is to stay with the law as it is," Beason told the farmers.

Beason helped write and sponsor a law the Legislature enacted in June to crack down on illegal immigration. It copied portions of laws enacted in Arizona, Georgia and other states, including allowing police to detain people indefinitely if they don't have legal status. Beason and other proponents said the law would help free up jobs for Alabamians in a state suffering through 9.9 percent unemployment.

The farmers said the some of their workers may have been in the country illegally, but they were the only ones willing to do the work.


"This law will be in effect this entire growing season," Beason told the farmers. He said he would talk to his congressman about the need for a federal temporary worker program that would help the farmers next season.

"There won't be no next growing season," farmer Wayne Smith said.

"Does America know how much this is going to affect them? They'll find out when they go to the grocery store. Prices on produce will double," he said....

After talking with famers at the tomato shed, Beason visited the Smith family's farm. Leroy Smith, Chad Smith's father, challenged the senator to pick a bucket full of tomatoes and experience the labor-intensive work.

Beason declined
but promised to see what could be done to help farmers while still trying to keep illegal immigrants out of Alabama.

Smith threw down the bucket he offered Beason and said, "There, I figured it would be like that."

Tough new immigration law hits Alabama farmers
quote:

Chad Smith's family grows tomatoes on a mountaintop in rural northeast Alabama, and ships them from to Canada.

The summer's crop has been good. But Smith sees thousands of overripe tomatoes rotting alongside his vines, and sees only trouble.

"As of right now, we could lose probably fifty percent of what we have left for the year," Smith said.

That, said Smith, is because of a stiff shortage of field hands, traditionally Hispanic migrant workers. And Smith doesn't sugar-coat their status.

"Farmers across the whole country and every state (rely) on illegal immigration workers to do this kind of work," Smith said, "because that's the only people that's willing to do it."

Backers of immigration reform say businesses like Smith Farms need to adapt, perhaps by paying a higher wage to attract local workers.

Monday, an Alabama state senator who sponsored the law spoke to angry Chandler Mountain growers, telling them he wants the law enforced despite their complaints.

Chad Smith says he's tried local workers.

"It ain't about the money, it's about the work physically. If a person can't do the work, they can't do it no matter how much you pay them,"
Smith said.

"As of next year, if nothing changes, there won't be a tomato grown here."

Smith says he expects to make his decision about next season by January - after he's able to evaluate this year's bottom line, and his prospects for labor next summer.

Luckily, I live in a suburb on 2/3 of an acre and have enough land to grow my own tomatoes, cucumbers, etc. - so I can afford to eat a salad at home - but I doubt if I'll be buying a salad in a restaurant in the future - by next year it will cost more than the sirloin steak.

Library of Economics and Liberty
quote:

The law of unintended consequences, often cited but rarely defined, is that actions of people - and especially of government - always have effects that are unanticipated or unintended. Economists and other social scientists have heeded its power for centuries; for just as long, politicians and popular opinion have largely ignored it.


Lastly, from comedian Jimmy Tingle:
quote:

These illegal aliens would make very good citizens; you look at what they do to get into this country. They do a triathlon in the dark, just to pick lettuce. I mean, think about that - walk the desert, swim the river, pay that man a five hundred dollar bribe, run across the border. First ten thousand get to pick lettuce. The government says, " We can't let them in ; they're taking our jobs." They're not taking our jobs ; they're doing all the jobs we don't want. I mean, when was the last time an American citizen went for a job picking lettuce?


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"I swore never to be silent whenever and wherever human beings endure suffering and humiliation. We must always take sides. Neutrality helps the oppressor, never the victim. Silence encourages the tormentor, never the tormented.””
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RE: Want a tomato with your salad? Get a bank loan - 10/7/2011 9:03:14 AM   
tazzygirl


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They are doing all the jobs we wont do at the wages they offer. Its just that simple.

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RE: Want a tomato with your salad? Get a bank loan - 10/7/2011 9:08:34 AM   
mnottertail


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Tell me, Mr. President; is it true that only a year ago, you were cutting sugar cane?


Groucho Marx (paraphrase)

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RE: Want a tomato with your salad? Get a bank loan - 10/7/2011 9:18:05 AM   
Fightdirecto


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quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

They are doing all the jobs we wont do at the wages they offer. Its just that simple.

Agreed.

Alabama, I believe, is a anti-union “Right To Work” state (AKA “Right To Work For Less” state) where over 50% of the jobs pay only minimum wage or slightly more.

If you can get a job at the local McDonald's for $0.25 more than minimum wage, why would you take a job working in someone’s' s field picking tomatoes by hand for minimum wage or less?

I doubt it.

IMO, the “Law Of Unintended Consequences” will kick in regarding this latest anti-illegal-immigrant law – many Alabama farmers will go out of business and food prices nation-wide will go up. The new anti-illegal-immigrant law will not result in unemployed or under-employed Alabama citizens rushing out of the towns and cities to take jobs in the fields picking tomatoes, lettuce, sweet potatoes, etc. by hand for minimum wage.

_____________________________

"I swore never to be silent whenever and wherever human beings endure suffering and humiliation. We must always take sides. Neutrality helps the oppressor, never the victim. Silence encourages the tormentor, never the tormented.””
- Ellie Wiesel

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RE: Want a tomato with your salad? Get a bank loan - 10/7/2011 9:27:35 AM   
Hillwilliam


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Those who are physically able, you offer them those jobs. If they refuse, it will reflect negatively on their benefits.

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RE: Want a tomato with your salad? Get a bank loan - 10/7/2011 9:29:49 AM   
tazzygirl


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How many illegals do you honestly believe are paid minimum?

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Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

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RE: Want a tomato with your salad? Get a bank loan - 10/7/2011 9:33:41 AM   
Hillwilliam


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quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

How many illegals do you honestly believe are paid minimum?

This info is 20 years old when I was teaching in FL. I don't know that they were illegals but I do know that the parents of some of the kids in my classes were migrant workers making over minimum wage. I'd asume that a LOT of them were illegals.

As I said. Those who are physically able and drawing benefits. Offer them the job. If they refuse, it should reflect negatively.
I've worked that hard in the past for damn little money and it didn't kill me.

_____________________________

Kinkier than a cheap garden hose.

Whoever said "Religion is the opiate of the masses" never heard Right Wing talk radio.

Don't blame me, I voted for Gary Johnson.

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RE: Want a tomato with your salad? Get a bank loan - 10/7/2011 9:43:33 AM   
tazzygirl


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I agree with offering them jobs.. if they refuse, their benefits are cut. I got no problem with that.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

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RE: Want a tomato with your salad? Get a bank loan - 10/7/2011 9:45:33 AM   
Hillwilliam


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That's all I was saying.

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Don't blame me, I voted for Gary Johnson.

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RE: Want a tomato with your salad? Get a bank loan - 10/7/2011 9:47:06 AM   
FirmhandKY


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Gee, wouldn't the real problem be that the US Federal Government isn't doing its job in this area, and hasn't for a long time (border security)?

So, the actual cause of any pain might be someone else's fault, not the government of Alabama, who is left holding the bag, and trying to address a national issue on a local basis.

Yanno, kinda like a janitor trying to clean all the vomit and shit off of the stadium after the stadium guards turned a blind eye to the drugs and alcohol all the fans were bringing to the concert?

You're blaming for fucking janitor for the mess, IMHO.

Firm

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RE: Want a tomato with your salad? Get a bank loan - 10/7/2011 10:32:42 AM   
popeye1250


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I think there was a post in here not long ago stating that illegal pickers in Calif. earned an average of $18 an hour due to being paid by "piece-work",  i.e. how much they were paid an hour for the production they accomplished.
Easy solution in Alabama, round up all the high school dropouts and people with bogus degrees and start first with any welfare recipients.
That would be good for them, fresh air, exercise and they'd lose weight.
Under extreme conditions we could import workers from China and India for say, 6 months at a time.
Just workers, no families and farmers would be responsable for all expenses, no tax-payer dollars involved.


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RE: Want a tomato with your salad? Get a bank loan - 10/7/2011 10:43:16 AM   
rulemylife


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quote:

ORIGINAL: FirmhandKY

Gee, wouldn't the real problem be that the US Federal Government isn't doing its job in this area, and hasn't for a long time (border security)?

So, the actual cause of any pain might be someone else's fault, not the government of Alabama, who is left holding the bag, and trying to address a national issue on a local basis.

Yanno, kinda like a janitor trying to clean all the vomit and shit off of the stadium after the stadium guards turned a blind eye to the drugs and alcohol all the fans were bringing to the concert?

You're blaming for fucking janitor for the mess, IMHO.

Firm


No, the mess is caused by consumers wanting the cheapest prices possible.

It is equivalent to why we import so many goods from third world countries.

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RE: Want a tomato with your salad? Get a bank loan - 10/7/2011 11:02:42 AM   
rulemylife


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quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

I think there was a post in here not long ago stating that illegal pickers in Calif. earned an average of $18 an hour due to being paid by "piece-work",  i.e. how much they were paid an hour for the production they accomplished.
Easy solution in Alabama, round up all the high school dropouts and people with bogus degrees and start first with any welfare recipients.
That would be good for them, fresh air, exercise and they'd lose weight.
Under extreme conditions we could import workers from China and India for say, 6 months at a time.
Just workers, no families and farmers would be responsable for all expenses, no tax-payer dollars involved.



Maybe you should go there and pick tomatoes Popeye.

Then you can be part of the solution to the illegal immigration problem instead of just constantly whining about it.

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RE: Want a tomato with your salad? Get a bank loan - 10/7/2011 11:04:00 AM   
mnottertail


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Yeah, the USDA website has the AVERAGE at 10 bucks an hour.

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RE: Want a tomato with your salad? Get a bank loan - 10/7/2011 11:04:40 AM   
Hillwilliam


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quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

Yeah, the USDA website has the AVERAGE at 10 bucks an hour.

Ive worked as hard for less.
And more.

_____________________________

Kinkier than a cheap garden hose.

Whoever said "Religion is the opiate of the masses" never heard Right Wing talk radio.

Don't blame me, I voted for Gary Johnson.

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RE: Want a tomato with your salad? Get a bank loan - 10/7/2011 11:06:17 AM   
mnottertail


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As have I. So we have the gamers with the buttonfingers and couch asses covered. Nothing in there for adults though.

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RE: Want a tomato with your salad? Get a bank loan - 10/7/2011 11:10:40 AM   
LaTigresse


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Here in Iowa, in the area around Muscatine where a lot of produce is grown we've always had migrant workers. All Hispanic because none of the locals would work for the pay they would. A few have always stuck around and were always welcome into the community. I know that quite a few work for IBP in Columbus Junction (not far from Muscatine). It's a crappy job and not many people want it. They will do it without complaint. IBP even set up a bunch of trailers, in an old trailer park in Washington, for any of their workers that wanted to live there.

It's gonna be funny when all the immigrant hating people start bitching about grocery prices going up.


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RE: Want a tomato with your salad? Get a bank loan - 10/7/2011 11:41:11 AM   
subrob1967


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quote:

ORIGINAL: LaTigresse
It's gonna be funny when all the immigrant hating people start bitching about grocery prices going up.


Nobody hate immigrants, we hate ILLEGAL immigrants, even you should be able to see the difference.


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RE: Want a tomato with your salad? Get a bank loan - 10/7/2011 12:23:24 PM   
LaTigresse


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Then make it easier for them to become legal instead of wasting precious government money and time, prosecuting and shipping them back. Let them become tax paying citizens. Novel idea I know...

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Just because you are well educated, articulate, and can use big, fancy words, properly........does not mean you are right!

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RE: Want a tomato with your salad? Get a bank loan - 10/7/2011 12:57:17 PM   
DomKen


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quote:

ORIGINAL: LaTigresse

Here in Iowa, in the area around Muscatine where a lot of produce is grown we've always had migrant workers. All Hispanic because none of the locals would work for the pay they would. A few have always stuck around and were always welcome into the community. I know that quite a few work for IBP in Columbus Junction (not far from Muscatine). It's a crappy job and not many people want it. They will do it without complaint. IBP even set up a bunch of trailers, in an old trailer park in Washington, for any of their workers that wanted to live there.

It's gonna be funny when all the immigrant hating people start bitching about grocery prices going up.


That's the way its been in the part of Alabama the OP's story is from. They do tend to put the migrant labor trailers and shacks off private drives that run through the bigger farms so the local bigots can't see them.

The fact is stoop labor, which definitely includes picking tomatoes, is back breaking work that has traditionally paid almost nothing. Only the poorest and most desperate will do it.

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