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The process of being dominated/dominating... - 5/25/2006 6:00:03 PM   
slavejali


Posts: 2918
Status: offline 		I've been thinking about this topic for awhile....

You read on these boards a lot that a lot of slaves and submissives arent just submissive or a slave to anyone..it takes that special someone who have either piqued their interest, or that they have clinically assessed as worthy, or there has just been a natural connection with..whatever the reason for you to have submitted to someone...considering you are not just submissive in your everyday life...were you/are you conscious of the process of your submission? What have been the factors present? Were there stages, or depths, or increased commitment to your submission to that person over a period of time or did you just drop down on your knees and give your heart, mind and soul over in the blink of an eye?

Just for your knowledge regarding this topic, I interchange the word slave and submissive cause basically I see the action of a slave as submission.

Considering slaves/submissives come with all types of personalities I'm pretty sure the requirements for each one to actually feel comfortable submitting to someone, giving over their authority to someone are going to be varied, although I'm also sure there are going to be some common factors brought up like trust etc...I guess I'm asking people to go into detail...if your going to talk about trust being a key factor..give examples that worked for you..how was it established in real situations...

How have you been handled most effectively in a Dominant person drawing out your submissive nature? Or were you in control all of the time? If that makes sense? Was there a point where you gave up control in how much you were going to submit and just surrendered to the level of control the dominant wanted to take?

If you have had previous owners, how has the transition played out for you between partners (knowing each dominant is different)?

Or were you just the perfect submissive/slave from the beginning of the relationship and never went through a process?

Were there significant hurdles for you to surmount.. ie. very willing to submit but through a part of your personality or your past there were some obstacles to overcome?

Were/are you aware of  different levels of realisation of your submission. Example: Those times when you feel that "Oh wow, Ive never felt so submitted, it feels like Ive never submitted before this.."...well thats till the next time you feel a movement and deeper realisation of what it means to you to be submissive/slave. What have been the circumstances around that...anything particularly provoke it?

For the dominants...are you consciously aware of a process of submission? How have you experienced it? How do you handle it?

_____________________________

Freedom in Bondage

Different Strokes for Different Folks

"I'll always have a *soft spot* for Sadists"
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RE: The process of being dominated/dominating... - 5/25/2006 6:51:09 PM   
LaTigresse


Posts: 26123
Joined: 1/15/2006
Status: offline 		jali, this topic more than any other has given me serious food for thought.......wow.....I will follow this closely. Your bringing it up and following it will be a learning experience for all following it. Thank you.

(in reply to slavejali)
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RE: The process of being dominated/dominating... - 5/25/2006 7:35:48 PM   
slavejali


Posts: 2918
Status: offline 		Here was/is the process within me that I am aware of:

When I was first introduced to the concept of a Master/slave relationship, I was totally ignorant to bdsm. In my past I had lived in an abusive relationship and after coming out of that, I spent some years alone, healing myself, part of that healing process was to become very strong and self-assured, part of that healing process was to really get to know myself and enjoy being with me. I travelled a lot, learned a lot..was totally independent.

Upon meeting my first Master, there was an instant physical D/s dynamic there. It was quite shocking to me. It seemed for a time that all my healing and thoughts of independence were just an illusion. I felt weakened by what I was feeling, I felt like I was betraying myself. Over time, I had to get to know myself all over again..part of that was realising and accepting that submission isnt a weakness..but that an unconscious submission could leave a submissive open to being mishandled by any old abuser..but a submission that was conscious was a very amazing thing....through this relationship I learned things like that. Over time, as I accepted this conscious submission within me I allowed myself to give over.....my sexuality was raw and primal and very very needy, I came home to the fact that my desire for intense physical interaction didn’t have to see me in an abusive situation. I felt safe, loved and lusted over. I think however my submissive/slave level was  immature at best..although love was present, sensation seeking desires were really prevalent in my motivation for submission.

In my next relationship, although not bdsm, I applied my submission to it. My vanilla partner was a very strong dominating type individual...and he taught me things..incredibly conscious things about submission. Although at first I felt the kinky sex and fun and games that were missing was kinda a bummer...yet from that aspect not being there..I think a really experienced a more profound realisation about my submissive nature...how I actually am fulfilled by serving and surrendering without any of my physical needs and desires being met. I felt an incredible fulfillment just from purely serving and surrendering point blank.

It was like my first conscious D/s relationship was based on pure primal physicalness and the second was based on some kind of  etheral spiritual inner experience.

So then enters Master....and the process for me with Master number 3 has been to integrate both types of relationship. It was challenging as for awhile there I was really aware of being confused..Am I this? or am I that? Which kind of relationship am I in..physical or spiritual? How do I integrate both? It wasn't like I was asking myself these questions..but I was totally aware of the conflict going on within me. Suddenly I wanted to serve in everyway, offer myself in everyway, be used in everyway. It was like everything I realised about submissive nature in the 2nd relationship was being pushed into the scenario of the first relationship...it was a very difficult scenario for me integrating absolute submission yet at the same time have all these desires floating around in me again.. and as you know, desires can be demanding things. I couldnt deal with it...I had to give the struggle up and just hand it over to Master....and suddenly everything made sense and I realised a new integrated and peaceful state of  submission/slavery that my body could participate in entirely....and in that way I have never felt so whole in my life.

All 3 relationships had a foundation of love...and I honor my past Masters....without them I would never have been able to offer the submission that I give to Master today...it really has been a process for me...and I am so grateful to Master as he has really taken the riens and integrated me...body, heart and soul, I love him so much.

I don't think I was aware of it at the time but Master had a plan for me, he set me on a path and walked me along it..it really makes me smile thinking about that. he wasnt satisfied with part of me, he wanted all of me.

_____________________________

Freedom in Bondage

Different Strokes for Different Folks

"I'll always have a *soft spot* for Sadists"

(in reply to LaTigresse)
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RE: The process of being dominated/dominating... - 5/25/2006 7:53:09 PM   
Sensualips


Posts: 1013
Joined: 10/8/2005
Status: offline
quote:

or there has just been a natural connection with..whatever the reason for you to have submitted to someone...considering you are not just submissive in your everyday life...were you/are you conscious of the process of your submission? What have been the factors present? Were there stages, or depths, or increased commitment to your submission to that person over a period of time or did you just drop down on your knees and give your heart, mind and soul over in the blink of an eye?


Interesting questions.  Plus I love to talk about myself.

When I first began exploring I considered myself a bottom, but not submissive.  This was because I enjoyed the physical and sexual aspects of bottoming but had no desire to surrendor any authority outside of that dynamic.  Even during play time, I would be very specific about what was okay and did not feel "out of control" at any time. I also considered myself a dominant becase I typically was the decision maker in all past relationships and that role was natural to me.  My first bdsm experiences were topping and the rush it gave me was intoxicating. 

Now I consider myself a switch, but I would say I am submissive to one person as part of an ongoing dynamic.  I was conscious of the process.  I don't make any grand claim that I am submissive "only to him" - that is just the way things have developed.

There were stages.  Initially it was a casual friendship that evolved into some casual sex-only play.  I was intrigued by him, by his submissive, by the dynamic they shared, and a s/D relationship in general.  As it evolved into more regular contact, I asked to bottom to him.  He laid out some expectations, and I rejected most of them.  We talked about it more and came up with something mutually acceptable.

There were some things I did because they were required and I was willing to do them, but did not really "feel it."  I was committed to maintaining my part of the agreement, and as we spent more time together (alone or the three of us) some things changed from odd and forced to normal. Little things, like calling him Sir in some situations or checking to be sure a drink was full or looking to him for a final decision on some item to requesting permission to cum during play.  I did notice this, but when I was not in their home or with them physically it was not integrated into other aspects of my life.

But the first times I really felt "submissive" came later, about six months into the relationship. Twice after we renegotiated, each time me giving a little more.  He gave more as well.

quote:

How have you been handled most effectively in a Dominant person drawing out your submissive nature? Or were you in control all of the time?


He cheats - he does it during sexual play. :)  That is when I am most likely to get into the mode, but I am still in control and responsible.  He can't "take" what I am not giving.

quote:

Was there a point where you gave up control in how much you were going to submit and just surrendered to the level of control the dominant wanted to take?


For me, no.  But I am still new.  I have had flashes where I could see me going there, but common sense told me it was a bad idea.  More fantasy than reality. That os not to say it couldn't happen for me.

quote:

Were there significant hurdles for you to surmount.. ie. very willing to submit but through a part of your personality or your past there were some obstacles to overcome?
 

I am not sure I want this, but I anticipate there would be internal struggle if I did.  I have internal struggle now.

quote:

Were/are you aware of  different levels of realisation of your submission. What have been the circumstances around that...anything particularly provoke it?


One afternoon I was in the bedroom with him and we were doing some making out and light play.  I knelt down (on my way give head), laid my head in his lap, and he stroked and tugged at my hair.  I had a flood of warm fuzzy feeling and the idea that at that exact moment I would possibly agree to anything for him.  I distinctly recall thinking, "is this what it feels like to be submissive?"

Then I decided I had been reading too many collarme postings and and I should get busy on the head thing.  But even now the kneeling with my head in his lap, hands on my hair, gives me a similar feeling.

Other circumstances would be the branding ritual.  Certain voice tones or looks.  (I'll leave out the hands part, so I won't make Tross' bad poetry list.) 

If we are disagreeing and it is the appropriate time for me to listen and say "yes sir," I really hate it.  I have a bad habit of interrupting combined with a dislike of waiting my turn to speak freely. I hate it and it frustrates me, but it also does give me a humbled / disciplined / submissive feeling. Not in a warm fuzzy way.

I don't know if I am submissive, or just a bottom with a crush on her Dom play partner. He believes it is a little of both.


(in reply to slavejali)
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RE: The process of being dominated/dominating... - 5/25/2006 8:03:29 PM   
slavejali


Posts: 2918
Status: offline
quote:


Original Quote: Sensualips
Plus I love to talk about myself.


Its the best person we've got to talk about hey...well the person we are most qualified to talk about *grin*

quote:

 I had a flood of warm fuzzy feeling and the idea that at that exact moment I would possibly agree to anything for him.  I distinctly recall thinking, "is this what it feels like to be submissive?"


Smiled at that



_____________________________

Freedom in Bondage

Different Strokes for Different Folks

"I'll always have a *soft spot* for Sadists"

(in reply to Sensualips)
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RE: The process of being dominated/dominating... - 5/25/2006 8:08:53 PM   
VvShadowspawnvV


Posts: 218
Joined: 3/27/2006
Status: offline 		Hi jali  =) This is my first M/s relationship.  i have been collared almost two years.  We live together, and are raising children together.  We are Master/slave, and also a family.  (There's the background for ya.)   When i first met the man who is my Master, there was an instant feeling of submission. We had been casual friends online for about a year, and one weekend when He happened to be in the neighborhood, i invited Him to see a movie.  i have been His ever since.  i had only been consciously identifying myself as a "submissive" for a few months... before that, i had certainly BEEN submissive, but hadn't had the knowledge to classify myself as such. Before we met in person, Master and i had had discussions about Gor (He is Gorean), and D/s, and the sort of girls He is attracted to.  My initial reaction to the whole Gor idea was flippancy- i am afraid i knee-jerked it without thinking beyond the "hel-LO, it's FICTION" aspect.  Sooo, when we met, even though i had been attracted to Him, and felt that i trusted Him, online, i never imagined that HE would be interested in ME... My reaction to Him was incredible.  i could barely look Him in the eye... my stomach was twisting and churning and flopping... i was shaky and wet... and all we were doing was sitting on the couch talking about His trip to the mall earlier that day.  It was like nothing i'd ever felt... and when He leaned towards me, and brushed my hair back from my face so He could look me in the eye (i was hiding, i admit it), i was gone.  i ended up begging Him to stay, this man i had never met before.  *sighhhhhh* We have been together since.  It was two months after that first night that He collared me.  i asked for His collar; begged for His collar... really had not much of an idea what exactly that collar would entail.  Not that He didn't tell me- not that He didn't ask me several times whether i was sure it was what i wanted- not that He didn't make me wait longer than i thought i possibly could- it's only that understanding slavery as a concept, and desiring slavery as a fantasy are so very different from living slavery as a life.  i could say, "Yes, Master, i understand that i belong to You.  i understand that i am property."  But FEELING it, whether in a good way, or a downright scary way, is so much more.   There are periods when i feel my level of submission and... resignation is the closest word i can think of... drop almost hourly.  There are moments when He drops me a whole level instantly.  There are days, to be sure, when i struggle, when i feel that this is so hard, when i cry and cry.  Those are the days when He takes me in hand, shows me my place, and then puts me in it.  It always works.  Thinking back to when we first began, and when we first began living together, i am amazed.  Not only do i behave differently- i think differently.  i find myself having thoughts and then saying to myself, "Wow- i sound more like Master than me".  i guess my IMAGE of myself hasn't quite caught up with the REALITY of myself.  My thought patterns have actually changed course.  At first i had lots of, "not fair" moments... Master has shown me that "fair" is a construct, and a state of mind.  i was whiny, i see that now... but i am getting much better.  =P As i said, this is my first M/s relationship.  It is the only one i ever hope to have.  Master says that He will keep me so long as i am "His".  i need that.  It has gone beyond a want- it is a need.  And that, i think, is the biggest difference between where i am now and where i was two years ago.   Thank you for the topic, jali, and i hope you don't mind my ramble.  =) becca 

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RE: The process of being dominated/dominating... - 5/25/2006 8:14:17 PM   
SweetEscravo


Posts: 193
Joined: 12/17/2005
Status: offline 		Some parts of my personality are just "submissive", but I am not always a submissive person.  It takes a special man to bring that truly out in me.  For me, being sexually submissive and having a submissive personality are two different things and they only come together for one dom.

(in reply to VvShadowspawnvV)
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RE: The process of being dominated/dominating... - 5/25/2006 8:25:31 PM   
LadyHugs


Posts: 2299
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline 		Dear slavejali, Ladies and Gentlemen;

You wrote,

quote:

ORIGINAL: slavejali

I've been thinking about this topic for awhile....

Excerpt]]

For the dominants...are you consciously aware of a process of submission? How have you experienced it? How do you handle it?


As a dominant, I am consciously aware of a slave's process of submission, as it is my responsibility to clear a path per se for the spiritual, mental and emotional process that moves before the physical process of submission.

How have I experienced this "process of submission," is often manifested in subtle ways before the physical service takes place.  Body language, voice tone and behavior coupled with attitude fluidly changes as they "think/process" submission.

For me, I handle an individual's submission as a fluid experience, to which I watch the body work in harmony with the many internal dialogs a slave has with themselves, to which transmits through the body.  It is evident, what slaves are doing in service, doing such because they have to and the difference because they want to.
It might be considered that I am many things to that slave, to which my duty and responsibility to allow slaves to process on their own and as soon as there is a snag in pleasure in service, to help them through it.  The slave is often a more severe Master than any other can be.  But, more often than not--I am a witness to the most beautiful human soul in a state of submission which is comfortable for them and to them.  I am an admirer of the grace they obtain in that state of submission.

Slaves process submission in many levels and in many ways, depending on what is before them at the moment.  A bad day, injury or some other pain, emotional issues effect slaves, just as much as the good.  This trickles down into the acts of submission, effecting the quality of it as well.  This is where support is so necessary, rather than adding to a rough time of it.

Respectfully submitted,
Lady Hugs

(in reply to slavejali)
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RE: The process of being dominated/dominating... - 5/25/2006 8:28:10 PM   
slavejali


Posts: 2918
Status: offline
quote:


Orginal Quote:  becca
understanding slavery as a concept, and desiring slavery as a fantasy are so very different from living slavery as a life.  i could say, "Yes, Master, i understand that i belong to You.  i understand that i am property."  But FEELING it, whether in a good way, or a downright scary way, is so much more. 


So, so true...and thats pretty much what I was getting at...taking it from a concept or a superficial idea to the actual realisation of it and what it means...its really a process hey. There are still areas now where I kinda stop myself and think "whoa" when I take a step further and I didnt even know that a further step existed....kinda like that moment Sensualips described...a moment of realisation of something new...some new degree ...or something.

_____________________________

Freedom in Bondage

Different Strokes for Different Folks

"I'll always have a *soft spot* for Sadists"

(in reply to VvShadowspawnvV)
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RE: The process of being dominated/dominating... - 5/25/2006 8:47:49 PM   
Sensualips


Posts: 1013
Joined: 10/8/2005
Status: offline
quote:

taking it from a concept or a superficial idea to the actual realisation of it and what it means...its really a process


That is funny because that wa spart of my rationale for exploring submission - to understand it at a real level.

quote:

like that moment Sensualips described


Mmmm, glad you liked that.  Now I am getting lonely though...wahaa waaah.

Oh, I thought of another one.  I started with a whole bunch of soft limits that were no-way-unless-I-one-day-specifically-tell-you-differently.  One was breath play, which is one of his areas of skill/desire.  One day were were rolling around in bed for some goodl= old fashioned rough sex (I do apologize my stories always seem to contain sex) and I reached down to grab his hand.  He was using that hand for something else and could not figure out why I was dragging it up to my face.  Until I took it and placed it on my throat and looked up at him.  His eyes lit up, first in surprise and then in raw lustful eagerness.  With his hands wrapped around my throat, in a very symbolic sign of faith, I felt very vulnerable and submissive.  Not in a helpless way though - it was a very powerful and strong feeling.

I have done breath play a few times with another since, but it is not the same feeling at all.

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RE: The process of being dominated/dominating... - 5/26/2006 12:16:40 AM   
becca333


Posts: 1050
Joined: 4/11/2006
Status: offline 		I met someone online, we clicked, did all the getting-to-know-you stuff.  Then we met to have some r/l fun.

I was a bottom, he was to be my Top. And then he used the Dom voice, and I went into total sub mode without thought or hesitation.  I didn't know what was happening to me (I was VERY new to it all), it was just purely amazing,  Then he told me I was a perfect sub.  And I had a conniption, I wasn't a sub!

But the Voice... every time, it just took me there. And after a while I researched a bit, and I found out what pure joy it is to be a sub.  And I love it.

So for me there really weren't a lot of stages.  It took one word in the Dom Voice.  And it's been bliss since then.

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RE: The process of being dominated/dominating... - 5/26/2006 6:04:12 AM   
LuckyAlbatross


Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: slavejali
How have you been handled most effectively in a Dominant person drawing out your submissive nature? Or were you in control all of the time? If that makes sense? Was there a point where you gave up control in how much you were going to submit and just surrendered to the level of control the dominant wanted to take?

For me what worked the most was someone getting to know and understand me.  The more they did that, the more the dynamic formed on its own.

There's never, in any of my relationships, been a point where I said "Yes, I give this to you."  It's always been a case of coming to the point and realizing "Oh yeah, it's there."
quote:


If you have had previous owners, how has the transition played out for you between partners (knowing each dominant is different)?

Pretty well and normal I think. 
quote:


Or were you just the perfect submissive/slave from the beginning of the relationship and never went through a process?

HA I wish.
quote:


Were there significant hurdles for you to surmount.. ie. very willing to submit but through a part of your personality or your past there were some obstacles to overcome?

In the past, my biggest hurdles were always accepting being the non-primary.  I knew it's what I wanted in terms of being in the relationship with the owner, but it's a very hard place to be sometimes.
quote:


Were/are you aware of  different levels of realisation of your submission. Example: Those times when you feel that "Oh wow, Ive never felt so submitted, it feels like Ive never submitted before this.."...well thats till the next time you feel a movement and deeper realisation of what it means to you to be submissive/slave. What have been the circumstances around that...anything particularly provoke it?

Not really.  There are times when I think "wow, we've come a long way together."  And I feel like I understand my submission and how it relates to myself as a whole a lot better than I did before, but that mostly came through the break downs and break ups and crash times.
quote:


For the dominants...are you consciously aware of a process of submission? How have you experienced it? How do you handle it?

As a switch I think my perspective is a bit unique on this. But I handle it the same way as I would in submitting.  We're all just trying to connect.

_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

(in reply to slavejali)
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RE: The process of being dominated/dominating... - 5/26/2006 7:17:15 AM   
spectreandnectre


Posts: 401
Joined: 3/20/2006
From: nebraska
Status: offline 		my first experience was a little offbeat.  i always knew that their was something different about me but didn't realize it had a name.  One day i was at the local pizza shop and a man approached me and W/we started dating, a few weeks into the relationship He sat me down and told me of His lifestyle choices and how when He saw me standing there He knew i was submissive just by looking at me (i still dont see it lol). W/we agreed to try and did until He died about two weeks later in a car accident.  i was hooked and knew i needed my time to mourn but that this was something i was going to explore even more deeply.
 
my first Master and i it was just a slow progressive thing i learned more and more each day but i have always had the people pleasing personality so it was an easy concept, but boy was i scared at first.  For me it was the gentleness in the learning process.
 
After Robs death i did alot of research (i mean tons) and when i thought i was ready i began looking.  i knew going in how much control i would give and every potential Master i spoke with i knew whether O/our ideas meshed with each other.
 
Maybe i got a bit off topic but thats about the jist of it
 
 

_____________________________

"When I see you, the world stops as if the only purpose in life was for me to please you."

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RE: The process of being dominated/dominating... - 5/26/2006 8:18:55 PM   
Petronius


Posts: 289
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline
No sub is perfect from the beginning. They might have been perfect for their last Dom but I'm not him. So "perfection" is the proces of learning to be perfect for me and unlearning a lot of the behavior they learned to excite their last Dom.

(On the other hand, if their last Dom they were deeply in love with was named something like "Master Sir Simon 10 1/2 inches" I don'

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RE: The process of being dominated/dominating... - 5/26/2006 8:25:46 PM   
littlesarbonn


Posts: 1710
Joined: 12/3/2005
From: Stockton, California
Status: offline 		For me, it's been a very long time, but it's so part of my inner being that I don't think I'm even capable of a "normal" relationship with a woman that doesn't involve a power exchange.

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