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Pedestrian convicted of vehicular homicide in own child... - 11/17/2011 8:46:13 AM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		I dont understand it... at all.

How can walking result in a conviction of vehicular homicide?

This case is bizarre.

Raquel Nelson, 30, could be sentenced to up to 36 months at a hearing July 26, said David Savoy, her attorney. She was convicted Tuesday of homicide by vehicle in the second degree, crossing roadway elsewhere than at crosswalk and reckless conduct, said Savoy.

Jerry L. Guy, the driver who admitted hitting the child when pleading guilty to hit-and-run, served a 6-month sentence. He was released Oct. 29, 2010, and will serve the remainder of a 5-year sentence on probation, according to Cobb court records.

Nelson was attempting to cross at the intersection of Austell Road and Austell Circle with her three children when her son was struck by a car, said Savoy. The child later died from his injuries. Nelson and her younger daughter suffered minor injuries and her older daughter was not injured.

Guy confessed to having consumed "a little" alcohol earlier in the day, being prescribed pain medication and being partially blind in his left eye, said David Simpson, his attorney.

Court records show that Guy was previously convicted of two-hit-and-runs on the same day, Feb. 17, 1997.

The first hit-and-run also happened on Austell Road, but when Guy fled from that scene he hit another car, seriously injuring that driver and passenger, records show.

Guy pleaded guilty and received a two-year prison sentence, but was out in less than a year, according to the Department of Corrections website.

http://www.ajc.com/news/cobb/pedestrian-convicted-of-vehicular-1014879.html

This is just one of many articles about this event. The Mother was offered probation if she plead guilty. She has decided to appeal.

In court Tuesday, Tanksley acknowledged that her office had received numerous letters and emails requesting leniency.

The standing-room-only courtroom erupted in applause when Tanksley initially announced the sentence – and that Nelson would not go to jail – but the judge quickly silenced family members and well-wishers who crowded in to support the mother.

Then, after reading through more legalese, Tanksley released the bombshell decision.

“The court grants you a new trial as to all the charges,” she said to Nelson.

http://www.ajc.com/news/cobb/cobb-mom-opts-for-1042791.html

Talk about insanity.

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RE: Pedestrian convicted of vehicular homicide in own c... - 11/17/2011 8:52:06 AM   
LaTigresse


Posts: 26123
Joined: 1/15/2006
Status: offline 		Crrraaaazzzzzzzzyyyyyyy.

The only way I could even imagine it would be IF she was incapacitated in some way (drugs or alcohol) or if she knowingly took a more dangerous route than was otherwise available. Like.....trying to cross a very busy street when there is a pedestrian over pass just down the street but she was too lazy to walk to it. Something like that.


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My twisted, self deprecating, sense of humour, finds alot to laugh about, in your lack of one!

Just because you are well educated, articulate, and can use big, fancy words, properly........does not mean you are right!

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RE: Pedestrian convicted of vehicular homicide in own c... - 11/17/2011 8:57:14 AM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		There was a cross walk down the street. It was dark, the cross walk would have added an extra half mile to the journey with three children in tow. Thats part of the complaint. The bus stop isnt in a spot that is accessible to riders.

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Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

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RE: Pedestrian convicted of vehicular homicide in own c... - 11/17/2011 9:18:16 AM   
Aylee


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Status: offline 		Accessory maybe?

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RE: Pedestrian convicted of vehicular homicide in own c... - 11/17/2011 9:32:45 AM   
Ishtarr


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quote:

ORIGINAL: LaTigresse

Crrraaaazzzzzzzzyyyyyyy.

The only way I could even imagine it would be IF she was incapacitated in some way (drugs or alcohol) or if she knowingly took a more dangerous route than was otherwise available. Like.....trying to cross a very busy street when there is a pedestrian over pass just down the street but she was too lazy to walk to it. Something like that.



She took a shorter, more dangerous route, with a safer one available at a detour.
The street she crossed had limited visibility, 4 lanes and a 50mph speed limit.
She was crossing the street in the dark, with 3 children, ages 10, 4 and 3. The 4 year old was carrying a fish and got hit by the car.

Sorry, but I have a a 3 and a 5 year old and crossing the street in an orderly fashion with them AT a crosswalk can be a challenge.
I would never think to cross with them in a limited visibility situation on a 4 lane. They are little kids and they both still walk very slowly and are prone to tripping. Kids that age tend to walk at about half the speed an adult does, they are SLOW.

They do NOT have the reaction speed to take care of themselves in an unexpected situation if a car suddenly comes out of nowhere. And with a 50mph speed limit, the cars WILL come out of nowhere, especially considering that there are always people who speed.

They both still bounce all over the place and frequently fall because of this. If one of them would fall in the middle of the street, what would I do? Leave my other kids to go pick the one up? Leave the fallen kid while I put the rest on the side walk?

They get SUPER easily distracted, and when they do are very hard to control by voice control alone. Which is exactly what happened in this case. The 4 year old boy who got hit saw a teenager make a quick run and dash over the street in front of him, and instead of waiting with his mother for a wider gap that they could handle, he ran after her and got hit. The teenager was fast and agile enough to make it... the 4 year old was not.
But it's the MOTHER who put a 4 year old kid in a situation where he would try to outrun a speeding car on a 50mph road...

I consider what she did COMPLETELY irresponsible and I don't find the charge vehicular homicide to be far fetched at all in this case.

< Message edited by Ishtarr -- 11/17/2011 9:48:56 AM >

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RE: Pedestrian convicted of vehicular homicide in own c... - 11/17/2011 9:42:58 AM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		I find that charge insane. She didnt hit the kid. The driver of the car did, who was on pain meds, who was drinking, and who had a history of hit and run, which he attempted to do in this case as well.

Is she innocent? Nope. She does have some accountability as well.

But, how do you charge someone with vehicular manslaughter when you are not driving?

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
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Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

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RE: Pedestrian convicted of vehicular homicide in own c... - 11/17/2011 9:48:26 AM   
Ishtarr


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Joined: 4/30/2008
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quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

I find that charge insane. She didnt hit the kid. The driver of the car did, who was on pain meds, who was drinking, and who had a history of hit and run, which he attempted to do in this case as well.

Is she innocent? Nope. She does have some accountability as well.

But, how do you charge someone with vehicular manslaughter when you are not driving?


If I leave a loaded gun on the table for the kids to play with, is it me or the gun that kills the kids?
If I push a 4 year old in a lake, is it me or the lake that killed the 4 year old?
If encourage a 4 year old kid to play with matches, is it me or the matches that get the house burned down.
Granted, she didn't leave him a loaded gun, or push him, or made him play with matches... but that's about the ONLY thing she did right in this situation.

She deliberately provided a situation in which he could easily be killed. The car was the tool SHE used to kill her son. The driver- though in fault as well- was put in a dangerous situation BECAUSE of the mother.

< Message edited by Ishtarr -- 11/17/2011 9:53:43 AM >

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RE: Pedestrian convicted of vehicular homicide in own c... - 11/17/2011 9:50:31 AM   
Zonie63


Posts: 2826
Joined: 4/25/2011
From: The Old Pueblo
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

I dont understand it... at all.

How can walking result in a conviction of vehicular homicide?

This case is bizarre.

Raquel Nelson, 30, could be sentenced to up to 36 months at a hearing July 26, said David Savoy, her attorney. She was convicted Tuesday of homicide by vehicle in the second degree, crossing roadway elsewhere than at crosswalk and reckless conduct, said Savoy.


I could see the jaywalking and reckless conduct, but how can someone be convicted of vehicular homicide if they weren't driving?

I've seen people with kids and toddlers jaywalking (sometimes running) across busy streets on a regular basis, even in situations where a crosswalk isn't that too far away. I was always taught "Cross at the green, not in between." Even if you have to walk a little ways to get to a crosswalk or an intersection with a traffic signal, it's still better than getting run over.

But I can also see where a lot of areas are not very pedestrian friendly (such as LA or PHX), although I'm not sure about Atlanta.



< Message edited by Zonie63 -- 11/17/2011 9:52:12 AM >

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RE: Pedestrian convicted of vehicular homicide in own c... - 11/17/2011 9:51:42 AM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		If the driver had been obeying the laws, he would not have hit the kid. That was the "push".

As I said, she was wrong in her decision. But I dont believe her decision caused the child's death alone. And for her to get more time than the driver...

Its no wonder she got a new trial.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

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RE: Pedestrian convicted of vehicular homicide in own c... - 11/17/2011 9:55:11 AM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline
quote:

But I can also see where a lot of areas are not very pedestrian friendly (such as LA or PHX), although I'm not sure about Atlanta.


Dark, arms full of packages (from the report I saw on TV) three kids and you are all tired. Yeah, I can see trying to cross 4 lanes. Its a wonder the driver didnt hit them all. It was poor judgement on her part. But not as poor as the driver's judgement.

From my reading, they are petitioning the City council to review those stops. If the stop had been at the cross walk, then there would have been no excuse.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to Zonie63)
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RE: Pedestrian convicted of vehicular homicide in own c... - 11/17/2011 9:58:18 AM   
Ishtarr


Posts: 1130
Joined: 4/30/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

If the driver had been obeying the laws, he would not have hit the kid. That was the "push".

As I said, she was wrong in her decision. But I dont believe her decision caused the child's death alone. And for her to get more time than the driver...

Its no wonder she got a new trial.


That isn't for sure.
It could have very possible have been a case of a person driving with the utmost care and obeying the law to the letter, and this kid, who RAN out in traffic, just ran in front of their car, with nothing they could have done to stop.
In that case, not only would the mother have the death of her son on her conscious, she would also have ruined the life and sleep of a perfectly innocent driver.
The fact that the driver in this case wasn't innocent is a coincident, and has no bearing on the guilt of the mother.

Of course she's getting more than the driver... she encouraged her 4 year old son to run out in traffic while carrying a fish.

_____________________________


Du blutest für mein Seelenheil
Ein kleiner Schnitt und du wirst geil
Egal, erlaubt ist, was gefällt

Ich tu' dir weh.
Tut mir nicht Leid!
Das tut dir gut.
Hör wie es schreit!

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RE: Pedestrian convicted of vehicular homicide in own c... - 11/17/2011 10:04:49 AM   
Iamsemisweet


Posts: 3651
Joined: 4/9/2011
From: The Great Northwest, USA
Status: offline 		The judge must have been distracted by someone breastfeeding in the court room

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RE: Pedestrian convicted of vehicular homicide in own c... - 11/17/2011 10:13:26 AM   
Zonie63


Posts: 2826
Joined: 4/25/2011
From: The Old Pueblo
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

quote:

But I can also see where a lot of areas are not very pedestrian friendly (such as LA or PHX), although I'm not sure about Atlanta.


Dark, arms full of packages (from the report I saw on TV) three kids and you are all tired. Yeah, I can see trying to cross 4 lanes. Its a wonder the driver didnt hit them all. It was poor judgement on her part. But not as poor as the driver's judgement.

From my reading, they are petitioning the City council to review those stops. If the stop had been at the cross walk, then there would have been no excuse.


I found another article about this case: http://www.forbes.com/sites/erikkain/2011/07/19/raquel-nelson-was-not-jaywalking-when-hit-and-run-driver-killed-her-child/

This article shows a picture of the actual intersection: http://t4america.org/blog/2011/07/18/prosecuting-the-victim-absolving-the-perpetrators/

The question was whether Georgia state law would recognize it as an unmarked crosswalk or not, since it was not a cross intersection with four corners. If it had been, then it would have been considered as having an unmarked crosswalk, even if it wasn't painted.

The coordinates if anyone wants to check on Google Maps: 33.906996,-84.561502

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RE: Pedestrian convicted of vehicular homicide in own c... - 11/17/2011 10:22:54 AM   
kalikshama


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Joined: 8/8/2010
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quote:

The judge must have been distracted by someone breastfeeding in the court room


*SNORT*

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RE: Pedestrian convicted of vehicular homicide in own c... - 11/17/2011 10:25:32 AM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Ishtarr


quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

If the driver had been obeying the laws, he would not have hit the kid. That was the "push".

As I said, she was wrong in her decision. But I dont believe her decision caused the child's death alone. And for her to get more time than the driver...

Its no wonder she got a new trial.


That isn't for sure.
It could have very possible have been a case of a person driving with the utmost care and obeying the law to the letter, and this kid, who RAN out in traffic, just ran in front of their car, with nothing they could have done to stop.
In that case, not only would the mother have the death of her son on her conscious, she would also have ruined the life and sleep of a perfectly innocent driver.
The fact that the driver in this case wasn't innocent is a coincident, and has no bearing on the guilt of the mother.

Of course she's getting more than the driver... she encouraged her 4 year old son to run out in traffic while carrying a fish.


But that isnt the case. We can do "what ifs" all day. It doesnt change the facts.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to Ishtarr)
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RE: Pedestrian convicted of vehicular homicide in own c... - 11/17/2011 10:27:25 AM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		Nelson, 30 and African-American, was convicted on the charge this week by six jurors who were not her peers: All were middle-class whites, and none had ever taken a bus in metro Atlanta. In other words, none had ever been in Nelson’s shoes:

Told you this was a bizarre case.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to Zonie63)
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RE: Pedestrian convicted of vehicular homicide in own c... - 11/17/2011 10:30:13 AM   
hlen5


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Iamsemisweet

The judge must have been distracted by someone breastfeeding in the court room


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RE: Pedestrian convicted of vehicular homicide in own c... - 11/17/2011 10:36:57 AM   
xssve


Posts: 3589
Joined: 10/10/2009
Status: offline 		I would say the city would have to accept some liability if there is a need for a crosswalk at that intersection.

Ultimately, a child's safety is the parents responsibility, but the guy who hit the kid was clearly going to kill somebody that day - two other hit and runs the same day?

The question is whether the mother could have anticipated that, but I'm forced to agree with Ishtarr that crossing a 50 mph Four lane is a questionable proposition even for an agile adult.

Technically, pedestrians always have the right of way, at least in California, and possibly some other states, I think it is here too, since otherwise, a lot of drivers seem to operate under the delusion they're playing Grand Theft Auto and get points for plowing down pedestrians.

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RE: Pedestrian convicted of vehicular homicide in own c... - 11/17/2011 10:38:50 AM   
Kirata


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From: USA
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quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

Nelson, 30 and African-American, was convicted on the charge this week by six jurors who were not her peers: All were middle-class whites, and none had ever taken a bus in metro Atlanta. In other words, none had ever been in Nelson’s shoes:

Told you this was a bizarre case.

Bizarre is right...

Jones, the wealthy 30 year old heir of a banking family, was convicted of murder this week by twelve jurors who were not his peers: All were middle-class, worked for a living, and none had ever felt provoked to kill anyone. In other words, none had ever been in Jones' shoes.

K.



< Message edited by Kirata -- 11/17/2011 10:40:21 AM >

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RE: Pedestrian convicted of vehicular homicide in own c... - 11/17/2011 10:39:10 AM   
xssve


Posts: 3589
Joined: 10/10/2009
Status: offline 		Here's an article on the subject: http://www.examiner.com/sf-in-san-francisco/do-pedestrians-always-have-the-right-of-way

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