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The un-Constitution - 11/24/2011 9:41:37 PM   
Termyn8or


Posts: 18681
Joined: 11/12/2005
Status: offline 		In a post a bit earlier I mentioned th at I had been bumbling around. This was to find a couple of references for a thread that headed into a legal decision.

Now many years ago I did actually read the Constitution and not everyone can say that, however I don't actually remember enough of that to make me special or anything. But like others who have read it, familiarity with the other documents can confuse.

For one example off the top of my head, many people here know - persuit of happiness is not in the Constitution. However I am thinking about people in general and I found this site that enumerates some common misconceptions about what is [not] in the Constitution.

http://www.usconstitution.net/constnot.html#life

"The Constitution was ratified in 1787, long, long before the advent of the airplane."

That means no Air Force ? Well while you're interpreting the second amendment to not include suitcase nukes under the bed in highrise apartments, I guess this must follow. Besides it started as the Army Air Corps anyway. But some people apparently have to argue it.

"It has often been seen on the Internet that to find God in the Constitution, all one has to do is read it, and see how often the Framers used the words "God," or "Creator," "Jesus," or "Lord." Except for one notable instance, however, none of these words ever appears in the Constitution, neither the original nor in any of the Amendments."

The only place it appears is as the date. It is not part of the body of the document. They didn't have CE then so it was either The Year Of Our Lord or Anno Domini.

"The word "impeachment" and the phrase "removal from office" are not synonymous."

Quick enough to see why Nixon resigned, he figured he would get convicted.

"The concept of the presumption of innocence is one of the most basic in our system of justice."

If it's law it's certainly unwritten.

"We often hear about the Supreme Court striking down a law or a provision in a law, or, more often, reaffirming some law or provision. Take a look in the Constitution — judicial review, as this is known, is nowhere to be found."

Fancy that.

"People often say "I have a right to have my case heard by a jury of my peers!" when there is no such right in the Constitution. "

What idiot would actually write that into law ? It doesn't work that way, if it did couldn't rapists demand to be tried by rapists and theives be tried by theives ? That only works in congress.

"marriage is not mentioned in the Constitution at any point."

OK now tis might be the hot one of the topic here. I thought that you could not be compelled to testify against your spouse. It may not be true now, but it certainly was. But that doesn't change the fact that some people thought that it meant that one cannot testify against their spouse. That was never true unless some state or local laws did that. Can you say that a local or regional prohibition would be in-Constitutional ?

"The Constitution does not directly mention paper money, a staple of today's economy. It does give the Congress the power to "coin money," however. The Constitution does prohibit states from issuing "bills of credit," but no such prohibition is in place for the federal government."

Should have been.

"But no where does the Constitution specify how federal judges are to be qualified."

We were starting to figure that out.

"It is interesting to note that though the 26th Amendment requires that 18-year-olds must be able to vote, states can allow persons younger than 18 to vote, if they chose to."

Interesting, and one of the things I didn't know and/or it never dawned on me because who thinks about that shit ?

Anyway, there are probably a few other things that website doesn't cover of course, but how many knew of all of the ones they did ? I didn't know a couple.

The site has a part on executive priveledge, and a summary of a couple executive orders. It used to be a proclamation but they changed the name. It states that they are subject to judicial review, but very very few have ever been challenged. Also that there were over 7,000 of them by the time of FDR.

???

T^T
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RE: The un-Constitution - 11/25/2011 2:49:22 AM   
tazzygirl


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Status: offline 		Its a living, breathing document designed with the intention of changing as our society changes. Franklin was an avid inventor, always trying to design something or another, and usually succeeding. Of course it was realized that our economy, our government, and our people would change... so must the Constitution.

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RE: The un-Constitution - 11/25/2011 6:31:06 AM   
hot4bondage


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quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

Its a living, breathing document designed with the intention of changing as our society changes. Franklin was an avid inventor, always trying to design something or another, and usually succeeding. Of course it was realized that our economy, our government, and our people would change... so must the Constitution.



...Through the Amendment process.

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RE: The un-Constitution - 11/25/2011 9:12:44 AM   
tazzygirl


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Status: offline 		Then put away your car, turn off your pc and inform your boss they no longer have to pay you a fair wage.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

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RE: The un-Constitution - 11/25/2011 9:32:51 AM   
Real0ne


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Status: offline 		way too many issues there to speak to, how ever when you get an attorney to re-present you in court ever notice until the judge says do you have anything you want to say after its over end done that no matter what you say prior is NOT part of the record?

well people have no waken up yet to realize that when yo uahve some asswipe that yo uvoted in to represent you that you have NO FUCKING SAY in what goes on.

THEY represent you, that is THEY take your place at the debate table, and in a deMOBcracy what ever the institutionalized MOB decides is good for them will become DA-LEW and is good for you as well.

and only someone who does not understand the constitution would say it is a "living" document, thats the way it is in upper canada.







< Message edited by Real0ne -- 11/25/2011 9:33:19 AM >

_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

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RE: The un-Constitution - 11/25/2011 9:52:46 AM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		Its "living" as in it can be changed.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

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RE: The un-Constitution - 11/25/2011 10:00:20 AM   
Real0ne


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quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

Its "living" as in it can be changed.


that is NOT the meaning of "living" document.

we arent talking about your party plans here this is about corporate organic by-law and it is NOT a living document and you can see that in ANY dictinary definition even slick wiki


_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to tazzygirl)
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RE: The un-Constitution - 11/25/2011 10:07:03 AM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		Ok.

A living document or dynamic document is a document which may be continually edited and updated by either a limited or unrestricted group.

Wiki definition.

Before an amendment can take effect, it must be proposed to the states by a two-thirds vote of both houses of Congress or by a convention called by two-thirds of the states, and ratified by three-fourths of the states or by three-fourths of conventions thereof, the method of ratification being determined by Congress at the time of proposal.

Seems to fulfill the definition ot a living document.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to Real0ne)
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RE: The un-Constitution - 11/25/2011 10:39:55 AM   
Real0ne


Posts: 21189
Joined: 10/25/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

Ok.

A living document or dynamic document is a document which may be continually edited and updated by either a limited or unrestricted group.

Wiki definition.

Before an amendment can take effect, it must be proposed to the states by a two-thirds vote of both houses of Congress or by a convention called by two-thirds of the states, and ratified by three-fourths of the states or by three-fourths of conventions thereof, the method of ratification being determined by Congress at the time of proposal.

Seems to fulfill the definition ot a living document.


in the context that you and others that take your stand use it, well that can be said of any contract, or trust if not by negotiation by force.

You wont find "living constitution" in any law dictionary I ever seen.

logically if it cannot be properly defined as a living constitution then neither can it be considered a living document unless it has been reduced to a mere understanding and organic law not withstanding





< Message edited by Real0ne -- 11/25/2011 10:42:59 AM >

_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to tazzygirl)
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RE: The un-Constitution - 11/25/2011 11:03:16 AM   
Termyn8or


Posts: 18681
Joined: 11/12/2005
Status: offline
quote:

Then put away your car, turn off your pc and inform your boss they no longer have to pay you a fair wage.


The Constitution has absolutely nothing to do with those things.

T^T

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RE: The un-Constitution - 11/25/2011 1:56:19 PM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		Exactly T

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to Termyn8or)
Profile   Post #: 11
RE: The un-Constitution - 11/25/2011 3:04:03 PM   
Real0ne


Posts: 21189
Joined: 10/25/2004
Status: offline 		when its all said and done the constitution is NOT a grant of rights, it is acknowledgement and agreement by those whom we elect to govern to PROTECT our declared rights whatever they may be.

That has been stolen and rewritten by them to protect themselves and FUCK US!

If it is not lawfully prohibited in the constitution then it is our right to claim.

However the "people" of the states had not voted on any of that shit so where the lawfully part?

It aint.

With the retards in this country today can you imagine a constitutional convention?  

Duh I got the right to fart 3 times a day!

We are way more fucked if we create new than if we fix the old.

They stole the fucking rights from everyone and made everyone second class cityfuckingzens against our will by the glofied fucking STATE courts then the supreme fuckwads.


(123 u. s. 131) THE ANARCHISTS' CASE.1 Ex parte SPIES and others. (October 2 J, 1887.) ERROR, WRIT OF—FROM UNITED STATES SUPREME COURT—MOTION IN OPEN COURT.     That the first 10 articles of amendment were not intended to limit the powers of the state governments in respect to their own people, but to operate on the national government alone, was decided more than a half century ago, and that decision has been steadily adhered to since.

  Barron v. Baltimore., 7 Pet. 243, 247;   Livingston v. Moore, Id. 469, 552;   Fox v. Ohio, 5 How 410, 434;   Smith v. Maryland, 18 How. 71, 76;   Withers v. Buckley, 20 How. 84, 91;   Percear v. Com., 5 Wall. 475, 479;   Twitchell v. Com., 7 Wall. 321. 325;   Justices v. Murray, 9 Wall. 274, 278;   Edwards v. Elliott, 21 Wall. 532, 557;   Walker v. Sauvinet, 92 U. S. 90;   U. 8. v. Cruiksiiank, Id. 542, 552;   Pearson v. Tewdall, 95 U. S. 294, 296;   Davidson v. New Orleans, 96 U. S. 97, 101;   Kelly v. Pittsburgh, 104 U. S. 79;   Presser v. Illinois, 116 U. S. 252, 265, 6 Sup. Ct. Rep. 580.

  It was contended, however, in argument, that, "though originally the first ten amendments were adopted as limitations on federal power, yet, in so far as they secure and recognize fundamental rights—common-law rights—of the man, they make them privileges and immunities of the man as a citizen of the United States, and cannot now be abridged by a state under the fourteenth amendment. In other words, while the ten amendments as limitations on power only apply to the federal government, and not to the states, yet in so far as they declare or recognize rights of persons, these rights are theirs, as citizens of the United States, and the fourteenth amendment as to such 'rights limits state power, as the ten amendments had limited federal power." It is also contended that the provision of the fourteenth amendment, which declares that no state shall deprive "any person of life, liberty, or property without due process of law," implies that every person charged with crime in a state shall be entitled to a trial by an impartial jury, and shall not be compelled to testify against himself. The objections are, in brief,



.you rights hence YOU have been reduced to subjects and second class citizens by the gubafia.

they fucked you all and most people cannot tell me the damn difference, they think its all the same!  mark my words if anyone has the guts to run this course.  LOL




< Message edited by Real0ne -- 11/25/2011 3:08:16 PM >

_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to Termyn8or)
Profile   Post #: 12
RE: The un-Constitution - 11/26/2011 2:58:49 AM   
mons


Posts: 2400
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Status: offline 		wow

mons

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RE: The un-Constitution - 11/27/2011 7:02:09 PM   
Termyn8or


Posts: 18681
Joined: 11/12/2005
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quote:

.you rights hence YOU have been reduced to subjects and second class citizens by the gubafia.


That happened a very long time ago, before this country was a twinkle in it's aristocratic, slave holding, traitorous founding Father's eye.

Nothing gets done until the class war really begins.

T^T

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RE: The un-Constitution - 11/27/2011 7:58:40 PM   
SternSkipper


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quote:

and only someone who does not understand the constitution would say it is a "living" document, thats the way it is in upper canada.


RO... that is ONE BUSSY LITTLE .GIF ya got there... Did you read about that Adam Kokesh guy I was telling you about?



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RE: The un-Constitution - 11/27/2011 8:08:44 PM   
seekerofslut


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quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

Its a living, breathing document


Evidently, since it has been skillfully suffocated to death.

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RE: The un-Constitution - 11/27/2011 8:09:27 PM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		Its being smothered, no doubt about that. But we only have ourselves to thank.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to seekerofslut)
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RE: The un-Constitution - 11/27/2011 8:10:14 PM   
SternSkipper


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quote:


Nothing gets done until the class war really begins.


I'm curious Termy what in your opinion will be the defining moment when we know that there has in fact been a beginning to the class war? I hear people all the time saying it's begun.



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RE: The un-Constitution - 11/27/2011 8:21:06 PM   
Real0ne


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Joined: 10/25/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: SternSkipper

quote:

and only someone who does not understand the constitution would say it is a "living" document, thats the way it is in upper canada.


RO... that is ONE BUSSY LITTLE .GIF ya got there... Did you read about that Adam Kokesh guy I was telling you about?





yeh

yeh sums it up quite well, and that spies case and supporting states cases are a real kick in the nuts. 

Its right shove in our faces complete with sandpapered assholes what they did and they keep moving forward and its shocking that people havent revolted.

Hell they had way more rights and representation before the revolution and our now 51 kings.

Feel sorry for those poor american kids gotta bear the brunt of our stoopid asses. 

What is bond slavery?  When a child is born into his fathers debt.

Whats that debt up to now days?  40,000 bucks for every man woman child and new born?

Yet the retards sing the we is free mantra? 

Only in america are people that incredibly fucking stoopid!

Lights are on but the lot is vacant!

anything in particular you were referring to?




< Message edited by Real0ne -- 11/27/2011 8:34:17 PM >

_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to SternSkipper)
Profile   Post #: 19
RE: The un-Constitution - 11/27/2011 8:49:00 PM   
SternSkipper


Posts: 7546
Joined: 3/7/2004
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quote:

Lights are on but the lot is vacant!

anything in particular you were referring to?


Not really... I was mainly wondering if you'd seen some of the crap on that guy... He's fuckin' creepy and I have a feeling his main job is to bring down the movement through some "act".
  He recently showed up at the Occupy College Hill over at Brown Univ. And he was escorted out of town by the cops with a special message not to return. What I heard is that one of the watch commanders daughters is very politically active and camping on her campus. She apparently fingered him to the cops and her dad took an interest. He has not been seen in Boston or NYC yet, but I think that is because they are watching for him.

   


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