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What's it worth ? (Iran) - 12/31/2011 3:25:21 AM

Termyn8or

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Like driving ?

I just found out the Iran, if attacked, plans to close the Strait of Hormuz. In fact they contend that they have the right to do so under international law if their national security is threatened.

You think $3.50 a gallon is high ? That ain't shit. and just let me remind you, $8 a gallon won't bother the government one bit because they can print as much money as they want. What's more they can just take the oil from the Dakotas and leave us high and "dry". You think they won't ?

It's sort of a doomsday option it is said, but all they have to do is look over at Iraq to help them decide to use that option. If an attack actually occurs, they might get really pissed and mine the strait. This would not make the UN happy but if they have nothing left to lose, why shouldn't they ? It would take a long time to clear that up.

Another thing I don't think people realize, after looking around a bit I do not believe that Iran's leaders are as crazy as they're cracked up to be in the media. It's played up, and what people do not understand is that their sovereignty is in jeopardy. What would this government do under those circumstances ?

Remember the show Star Trek ? Well every time someone took over the ship they decided to blow it up, with themselves onboard. You see, nobody in Iran could possibly be crazy enough to actually nuke Isreal. They know damn well what would happen. Half the world would be kicking their ass and they know it.

I think they want the nukes to blow themselves up in case they find themselves in a position like Custer. You see, this removes one of the major incentives the warhawks have for attacking Iran - control of all that oil. Oh sure, someone else's name would be on it, but they would be "friendly" to "our" interests, like in Iraq (for the time being).

They might however, be insane enough to believe that in their afterlife they could look down and laugh at us trying to figure out how to pump oil out of a glass parking lot.

T^T

< Message edited by Termyn8or -- 12/31/2011 3:31:02 AM >

Post #: 1

RE: What's it worth ? (Iran) - 12/31/2011 3:41:58 AM

NeedToUseYou

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I think attacking Iran would dumbest thing we ever did.

So, we invaded Iraq, for whatever reason, and spent like a trillion dollars. If we invade Iran, I'm sure it will be of similiar or even greater cost.

So, those two would easily cost 2 trillion dollars, for 2 trillion dollars you could with zero doubt have improved solar pv, battery tech, ect, to levels that would make practical Electric vehicles, and home installed PV beat grid costs nearly everywhere.

We already are reaching grid parity with PV in certain sections of the country, it's not like the goal of beating Grid Electric costs is decades away anymore. Battery tech, well, they already have the tech in the lab to make lithium batteries that are 10 times more energy dense than current batteries. So, it's not like a sci-tech fantasy film based on a 100 years from now.

So, 2 trillion wasted on these stupid oil wars, if we do attack Iran, it will just be about controlling that oil rich region completely, as the whole nuke argument is a non-argument, they don't even have one, and if they do finally get one, they can't launch it over here, and if they did launch it on Israel, Iran would no longer exist. It's just fear mongering to get another war going, and it's not even needed, oil is not going to be needed at the present rate forever, and if given the choice to spend a trillion attacking Iran, or researching better PV, and batteries, well I'd select the latter, and just stay the hell out of there.

(in reply to Termyn8or)

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RE: What's it worth ? (Iran) - 12/31/2011 3:46:30 AM

Termyn8or

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At one time people would say to you - run for office. But looking at what is happening to Ron Paul I guess that's pretty much out.

I agree with you with or without solar power, but see those in power have a different goal. They need that AIPAC money.

T^T

(in reply to NeedToUseYou)

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RE: What's it worth ? (Iran) - 12/31/2011 6:55:41 AM

kdsub

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Nothing but a bluff...They may be radical but they are not stupid. Attempting to block the strait would assure a overwhelming response from the US and most likely their downfall. They will just rattle their antiquated swords it costs them nothing.

Butch

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RE: What's it worth ? (Iran) - 12/31/2011 7:02:33 AM

Hillwilliam

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quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

Nothing but a bluff...They may be radical but they are not stupid. Attempting to block the strait would assure a overwhelming response from the US and most likely their downfall. They will just rattle their antiquated swords it costs them nothing.

Butch

I'd bet they're more worried about the reaction from Saudi Arabia. If the cash flow to all those princes got cut off, there'd be hell to pay.

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RE: What's it worth ? (Iran) - 12/31/2011 7:19:01 AM

kdsub

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quote:

I'd bet they're more worried about the reaction from Saudi Arabia. If the cash flow to all those princes got cut off, there'd be hell to pay

They should be...

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052970203899504577128674022827702.html

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Post #: 6

RE: What's it worth ? (Iran) - 12/31/2011 8:57:08 AM

Sanity

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So, Obamas selling billions of dollars in sophisticated weaponry to non-democratic nations now...

Doesnt this make him a neocon?

Re Iran, this blister has been festering for a very long time, eventually its got to pop somehow

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RE: What's it worth ? (Iran) - 12/31/2011 9:01:15 AM

mnottertail

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No, it makes him an American President. You might want to brush the dust off your history books and crack em once, the US has done this at least once before, St. Wrinklemeat to Iran and Iraq, for example, and I think you could find other anecdotal evidence if you could only try to be aware of the real world.

I will leave it as an exercise to those who would really like to engage in debate, and would have a desire to bring at least one fact to their buncombe occasionally.

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RE: What's it worth ? (Iran) - 12/31/2011 11:30:34 AM

Anaxagoras

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quote:

ORIGINAL: NeedToUseYou
the whole nuke argument is a non-argument, they don't even have one, and if they do finally get one, they can't launch it over here, and if they did launch it on Israel, Iran would no longer exist. It's just fear mongering to get another war going,

It has been shown that Iran is developing the technology for nuclear weaponry for years. Israel is one of the smaller countries in the world, whilst Iran is a sizeable nation many times its size so if Iran got in there first there would not necessarily be any sort of mutually assured destruction which put off the USSR and the US going to war for so long. Many bang on about Iran not having attacked another country in centuries ignoring the regime's religious extremism, the fact that they are one of the biggest sponsors of international terrorism today, having driven a fair amount of the terrorism in Iraq, and give Hizbullah up to 200 million annually (Hizbullah's funding was exposed this year when a Lebanese bank's records were opened). Iran has threatened Israel's annihilation on numerous occasions so at the very least the threat ought to be taken seriously rather than dismissed.

< Message edited by Anaxagoras -- 12/31/2011 11:38:30 AM >

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RE: What's it worth ? (Iran) - 12/31/2011 11:42:14 AM

Sanity

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Despite all their open bragging about all the killing they will do once they have the bomb, and despite all the energy theyre sitting on in the form of oil reserves... rest assured that Iran is only developing said technology for purely peaceful purposes

quote:

ORIGINAL: Anaxagoras
It has been shown that Iran is developing the technology for nuclear weaponry for years. Israel is one of the smaller countries in the world, whilst Iran is a sizeable nation many times its size so if Iran got in there first there would not necessarily be any sort of mutually assured destruction which put off the USSR and the US going to war for so long. Many bang on about Iran not having attacked another country in centuries ignoring the regime's religious extremism, the fact that they are one of the biggest sponsors of international terrorism today, having driven a fair amount of the terrorism in Iraq, and give Hizbullah up to 200 million annually (Hizbullah's funding was exposed this year when a Lebanese bank's records were opened). Iran has threatened Israel's annihilation on numerous occasions so at the very least the threat ought to be taken seriously rather than dismissed.

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RE: What's it worth ? (Iran) - 12/31/2011 11:54:28 AM

Anaxagoras

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity
Despite all their open bragging about all the killing they will do once they have the bomb, and despite all the energy theyre sitting on in the form of oil reserves... rest assured that Iran is only developing said technology for purely peaceful purposes

quote:

ORIGINAL: Anaxagoras
It has been shown that Iran is developing the technology for nuclear weaponry for years. Israel is one of the smaller countries in the world, whilst Iran is a sizeable nation many times its size so if Iran got in there first there would not necessarily be any sort of mutually assured destruction which put off the USSR and the US going to war for so long. Many bang on about Iran not having attacked another country in centuries ignoring the regime's religious extremism, the fact that they are one of the biggest sponsors of international terrorism today, having driven a fair amount of the terrorism in Iraq, and give Hizbullah up to 200 million annually (Hizbullah's funding was exposed this year when a Lebanese bank's records were opened). Iran has threatened Israel's annihilation on numerous occasions so at the very least the threat ought to be taken seriously rather than dismissed.

Well said, and even Iran's Muslim neighbours are running scared due to the possibility http://frontpagemag.com/2011/11/17/the-iran-issue-festers/2/ as they see Iran haveing expansionist ambitions though I have a feeling Iran may back down over the Straits issue as obtaining nuclear weaponry will be a key element for future strategies and conflict.

< Message edited by Anaxagoras -- 12/31/2011 11:59:05 AM >

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"That woman, as nature has created her, and man at present is educating her, is man's enemy. She can only be his slave or his despot, but never his companion." (Venus in Furs)

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RE: What's it worth ? (Iran) - 12/31/2011 12:03:58 PM

Termyn8or

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If you were about to be invaded by another country, wouldn't you want weapons ?

My guns are not just for killing other people, they are there in case I ever have to check out. This is what I am saying. Iran is getting like everyone else - if I can't have it, nobody can.

Look at Israel, they got nukes but they would never use them, their worst enemies are too local. They would fuck themselves up. But if the whole world turned against them (which could happen if they keep their shit up) and they have nothing to lose, I think they would blow thenselves up.

T^T

(in reply to Sanity)

Post #: 12

RE: What's it worth ? (Iran) - 12/31/2011 12:04:59 PM

mnottertail

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity

Despite all their open bragging about all the killing they will do once they have the bomb, and despite all the energy theyre sitting on in the form of oil reserves... rest assured that Iran is only developing said technology for purely peaceful purposes

quote:

ORIGINAL: Anaxagoras
It has been shown that Iran is developing the technology for nuclear weaponry for years. Israel is one of the smaller countries in the world, whilst Iran is a sizeable nation many times its size so if Iran got in there first there would not necessarily be any sort of mutually assured destruction which put off the USSR and the US going to war for so long. Many bang on about Iran not having attacked another country in centuries ignoring the regime's religious extremism, the fact that they are one of the biggest sponsors of international terrorism today, having driven a fair amount of the terrorism in Iraq, and give Hizbullah up to 200 million annually (Hizbullah's funding was exposed this year when a Lebanese bank's records were opened). Iran has threatened Israel's annihilation on numerous occasions so at the very least the threat ought to be taken seriously rather than dismissed.

This will be an excellent point for you to insert credible citations, so one might have to give pause to this rather novel notion that they have been doing this, since nobody on this site has seen those accounts in the papers or watched that explosive newscast.

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Post #: 13

RE: What's it worth ? (Iran) - 12/31/2011 12:32:53 PM

hlen5

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Anaxagoras

quote:

ORIGINAL: NeedToUseYou
the whole nuke argument is a non-argument, they don't even have one, and if they do finally get one, they can't launch it over here, and if they did launch it on Israel, Iran would no longer exist. It's just fear mongering to get another war going,

It has been shown that Iran is developing the technology for nuclear weaponry for years. Israel is one of the smaller countries in the world, whilst Iran is a sizeable nation many times its size so if Iran got in there first there would not necessarily be any sort of mutually assured destruction which put off the USSR and the US going to war for so long. Many bang on about Iran not having attacked another country in centuries ignoring the regime's religious extremism, the fact that they are one of the biggest sponsors of international terrorism today, having driven a fair amount of the terrorism in Iraq, and give Hizbullah up to 200 million annually (Hizbullah's funding was exposed this year when a Lebanese bank's records were opened). Iran has threatened Israel's annihilation on numerous occasions so at the very least the threat ought to be taken seriously rather than dismissed.

Pssssst... there is no USSR

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Post #: 14

RE: What's it worth ? (Iran) - 12/31/2011 3:14:23 PM

Sanity

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Psst - he used the past tense in writing about it

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RE: What's it worth ? (Iran) - 12/31/2011 5:51:04 PM

Fellow

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quote:

I just found out the Iran, if attacked, plans to close the Strait of Hormuz. In fact they contend that they have the right to do so under international law if their national security is threatened.

They will certainly not close Strait of Hormuz. This capability will be taken away if attacked by the US. Regardless of this, the oil prices will skyrocket and all kind of hell (not foreseen by war planners as usual) will break loose. As a distraction the "Peace president" may still try it in order to create chances to be re-elected.

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RE: What's it worth ? (Iran) - 12/31/2011 7:13:14 PM

hlen5

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity

Psst - he used the past tense in writing about it

D'oh!! Busted!! My apologies!

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Post #: 17

RE: What's it worth ? (Iran) - 12/31/2011 7:32:16 PM

tweakabelle

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Israeli newspaper Haaretz reports that Mossad chief Tamir Pardo dismisses the claim that a nuclear armed Iran represents an existential threat to Israel. I would imagine that the boss of Mossad is uniquely situated to make informed judgements on matters like this.

http://www.haaretz.com/print-edition/news/mossad-chief-nuclear-iran-not-necessarily-existential-threat-to-israel-1.404227

< Message edited by tweakabelle -- 12/31/2011 7:36:28 PM >

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