RE: Well, shit. (Full Version)

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Owner59 -> RE: Well, shit. (1/15/2012 11:56:24 PM)

Well given that GM`s bailout was successful and saved hundreds of thousands of US jobs thanks to President Obama,perhaps one of the cons can explain to us how letting GM fail(as all of the GOP candidates said they would have)would have improved our economy and unemployment numbers and made things better?


Specifics please.Anyone can claim they`re scary talented.



MasterSlaveLA -> RE: Well, shit. (1/16/2012 12:27:30 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner59

Well given that GM`s bailout was successful...



Treasury Admits What Everybody Already Knew:
Taxpayer Losses On GM Bailout Are Going to be Massive
 
"The $23.6 billion represents a 25 percent loss on the feds $60 billion direct “investment” in GM. But that’s not all that taxpayers are on the hook for. As I explained previously, Uncle Sam’s special GM bankruptcy package allowed the company to write off $45 billion in previous losses going forward. This could work out to as much as $15 billion in tax savings that GM wouldn’t have had had it gone through a normal bankruptcy. Why? Because after bankruptcy, the tax liabilities of companies increase since they have no more losses to write off.
 
This means that the total hit to taxpayers, who still own about a quarter of the company, could add up to $38.6 billion."

http://reason.com/blog/2011/11/17/treasury-admits-what-everybody-already-k


Should the U.S. cut its losses on GM stock?
 
"Treasury spent $49.5 billion to help see the automaker through its 2009 bankruptcy reorganization, leaving the U.S. with 61% of the company. Even after taking into account Treasury's proceeds from GM's record IPO and federal loans that the company has repaid, taxpayers are still out about $25.5 billion."
 
http://money.cnn.com/2011/11/18/news/companies/gm_bailout/index.htm



[8|]




Owner59 -> RE: Well, shit. (1/16/2012 12:41:59 AM)

The company is making record profits and hiring people.


So again,....how would letting GM fail as Mitten`s said he would have done,made things better?





Lucylastic -> RE: Well, shit. (1/16/2012 12:45:29 AM)

Ford who didnt take a bailout also lost around 37 % of their figures..
in the same time frame... its the economy ......cupid
from your own link
CNN One
"I think the IPO price was a fair and reasonable valuation," he said. "I don't myself, at the moment, see any particular reason why the U.S. should rush to sell at a much lower price when the company is doing very well."



Sanity -> RE: Well, shit. (1/16/2012 6:00:18 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner59

Well given that GM`s bailout was successful and saved hundreds of thousands of US jobs thanks to President Obama,perhaps one of the cons can explain to us how letting GM fail(as all of the GOP candidates said they would have)would have improved our economy and unemployment numbers and made things better?


Specifics please.Anyone can claim they`re scary talented.



Successful for who?

http://www.collarchat.com/m_3984466/mpage_2/key_Volt/tm.htm#3985061

http://www.collarchat.com/m_2640967/mpage_1/key_obama%252Cmotors/tm.htm#2640967



DarkSteven -> RE: Well, shit. (1/16/2012 6:50:38 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

Isnt Gingrich's ads being paid for, mostly, by PACs?


In my understanding (someone please correct me if I'm wrong), ALL ads are paid for by PACs.  The PACs are the latest failed attempt to separate money and its intoxicating effects from candidates.  The natural effect is that a candidate's PAC can get away with making outrageous lies about opponents, and the candidate is not personally responsible.  That's one of the reasons that the GOP primary is so nasty this year.



EternalHoH -> RE: Well, shit. (1/16/2012 7:17:57 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity

Successful for who?




ALL taxpayers, that's who.

Without the government takeover of GM, the taxpayer would have paid out MORE than it ever did in GM takeover dollars in the form of CDS liabilities (something the Montana Freemen brigade knows nothing about), since the taxpayer (by then) owned the insurance company (AIG) that sold the ponzi CDS insurance in the first place.

By taking over GM and assuring it never went under, we avoided the CDS payments from triggering.  The GM takeover cost amounted to PENNIES ON THE DOLLAR for the taxpayer compared to the potential CDS liabilities had it gone under.

Seriously, there is plenty of stuff to legitimately criticize Obama over (specifically, for taking the approach that the 08 crisis was "only a blip" and not working hard enough to assure us that this elite gambling crap never happens again) without you needing to fabricate shit like VoltGate out of thin air.

Welcome to the new age of government bailouts.  Its not just going to be limited to just GM or AIG or Greece.   Brought to you by the gambling habits of too-big-to-fail members of the private sector playing with Wall Street's unregulated "engineered innovation".






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