RE: Glass houses and stones don't mix

RE: Glass houses and stones don't mix (Full Version)

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tazzygirl -> RE: Glass houses and stones don't mix (1/16/2012 11:36:03 PM)
quote: That's funny considering your stance on the politician you used as your example. I believe the words you used were "how many times was he not caught," or words to that effect. So, let's turn that around.. Only 2% tested positive. We all know there are many ways to thwart a test and many drugs that don't even show up. So how many more than that 2% simply "got lucky" and didn't get caught? Exactly, how many politicians got lucky? How many are known to have used drugs? How many headlines do we see about politicians who got caught?

Lucylastic -> RE: Glass houses and stones don't mix (1/16/2012 11:40:50 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: DarqueMirror quote: ORIGINAL: Lucylastic Do you not understand plain English? done with your hate bye bye.... Oh I do, but you apparently don't. You're the one filled with hate. But I understand that you can't form a viable defense in this debate and must therefore say "bye bye." So leave already. Doesn't bother me one way or the other. I put forward that it was unconstitutional, because people actually more qualified than you have actually said it is looking that way. That isnt from emotional defense that is a verifiable FACT.

Lucylastic -> RE: Glass houses and stones don't mix (1/16/2012 11:47:56 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl quote: As someone else has pointed out, if we required perfection of our politicians, no one would ever be able to hold office. So our welfare recipients are supposed to be more perfect than our politicians? well I doubt any welfare recipient would ever get close to being a politican, they dont know how to screw people out of millions and get away with it

tazzygirl -> RE: Glass houses and stones don't mix (1/16/2012 11:48:45 PM)
Its on the job training... at least for those who didnt go to college to learn how. [;)]

DarqueMirror -> RE: Glass houses and stones don't mix (1/17/2012 12:03:34 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl Nope. You get an income. You can cover expenses until you get that money. People signing up for welfare, for the most part, have no income. Do you disagree? I absolutely disagree. When you bring in less than $2K per month and have almost $3K going out... Money is beyond tight. It's practically non-existent. Yet somehow I pay my school costs and wait to be "reimbursed" later.

DarqueMirror -> RE: Glass houses and stones don't mix (1/17/2012 12:05:14 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl Exactly, how many politicians got lucky? How many are known to have used drugs? How many headlines do we see about politicians who got caught? Probably far less than the number of welfare recipients who use drugs and manage to not get caught. So I guess it's even, isn't it?

tazzygirl -> RE: Glass houses and stones don't mix (1/17/2012 12:07:06 AM)
According to the results in Florida, only 2% "got caught". Bet its about the same for politicians. So, why are they treated differently?

DarqueMirror -> RE: Glass houses and stones don't mix (1/17/2012 12:08:17 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Lucylastic I put forward that it was unconstitutional, because people actually more qualified than you have actually said it is looking that way. That isnt from emotional defense that is a verifiable FACT. Ahhhh silly silly. What you "put forth" was that I was full of hate for wanting to help those on welfare get used to what it's like in the working world. When it's you that hates the poor so much you'd rather see them perpetually on government assistance forever as opposed to getting help finding work and taking care of themselves. That was your emotional response getting the best of you.

tazzygirl -> RE: Glass houses and stones don't mix (1/17/2012 12:08:28 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: DarqueMirror quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl Nope. You get an income. You can cover expenses until you get that money. People signing up for welfare, for the most part, have no income. Do you disagree? I absolutely disagree. When you bring in less than $2K per month and have almost $3K going out... Money is beyond tight. It's practically non-existent. Yet somehow I pay my school costs and wait to be "reimbursed" later. Uh huh... while they have nothing coming in, have to borrow enough to get a drug test, then wait to be approved and for reimbursement.. for a great sum total of less than 400 dollars a month for a family of four.

DarqueMirror -> RE: Glass houses and stones don't mix (1/17/2012 12:11:53 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl According to the results in Florida, only 2% "got caught". Bet its about the same for politicians. So, why are they treated differently? And according to the story you posted, only that one politician has gotten a DUI...(unless you have more verifiable stats on that). So if only 2% have been caught, and we're all well aware of the many ways to beat a test, the 2% is inherently a flawed statistic and thus not worth anything.

DarqueMirror -> RE: Glass houses and stones don't mix (1/17/2012 12:16:50 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl Uh huh... while they have nothing coming in, have to borrow enough to get a drug test, then wait to be approved and for reimbursement.. for a great sum total of less than 400 dollars a month for a family of four. Nothing coming in vs. negative. I learned in math class in grade school that a negative number is always smaller than zero. They have zero, spend $40 and get $400. If they pass that test, they get the $40 returned to them. That's a net of $400. (Let's ignore for a moment the test us only paid for once.) My household on the other hand has $3K going out, and less than $2K coming in. So each month I'm already at negative $1K. Sounds like someone who's up $400 is a bit ahead of me, doesn't it?

Lucylastic -> RE: Glass houses and stones don't mix (1/17/2012 12:18:20 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: DarqueMirror quote: ORIGINAL: Lucylastic I put forward that it was unconstitutional, because people actually more qualified than you have actually said it is looking that way. That isnt from emotional defense that is a verifiable FACT. Ahhhh silly silly. What you "put forth" was that I was full of hate for wanting to help those on welfare get used to what it's like in the working world. When it's you that hates the poor so much you'd rather see them perpetually on government assistance forever as opposed to getting help finding work and taking care of themselves. That was your emotional response getting the best of you. fem hominem

DarqueMirror -> RE: Glass houses and stones don't mix (1/17/2012 12:24:07 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Lucylastic fem hominem I understand that you now realize your position is indefensible. But given that, you still make strange, off-topic posts? Why?

tazzygirl -> RE: Glass houses and stones don't mix (1/17/2012 12:34:22 AM)
California State Senator Roy Ashburn (R) of Bakersfield was arrested on two counts of DUI. He was sentenced to two days in jail and three years probation. (2010) [2][3] Massachusetts State Senator Anthony Gallucio (D) was given one year in prison after failing a sobriety test and violating his probation from a previous hit and run accident. (2010) [4] Rhode Island State Representative Daniel P. Gordon (R) of Porstmouth when arrested for drunk driving told police it was due to PTSD from being wound in the gulf war. A check reveiled he was never in combat, but did reveal an extensive arrest record in Massachusetts for assault and attempted murder. (2011) [20] Michigan State Representative David Jaye (R) was expelled from the house in 2001 after allegations of wife beating and three drunk driving convictions.[59][60] South Carolina State Treasurer Thomas Ravenel (R) convicted on cocaine charges. (2007) [107] New York State Senator Randy Kuhl, Jr. (R) of the 29th District, was arrested and convicted of drunk driving in 1997. His driver's license was revoked for six months. [132] District of Columbia Mayor Marion Barry (D-DC) caught on videotape using drugs in an FBI sting (1990) [145] 41 admitted to drug use when they ran for office... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_politicians_who_admit_to_cannabis_use http://www.fox2now.com/ktvi-matthew-matt-bass-drugs-110509,0,3418182.story www.tuscaloosanews.com/article/20111206/NEWS/111209859 It doesnt even stop with politicians... A federal judge... http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-504083_162-20018641-504083.html I mean, come on. Admit that your belief is that people on welfare are wasting their money on drugs... all of them. That is what you believe, isnt it?

tazzygirl -> RE: Glass houses and stones don't mix (1/17/2012 12:36:23 AM)
quote: They have zero, spend $40 and get $400. If they pass that test, they get the $40 returned to them. What part of this arent you getting. In Georgia, they arent getting reimbursed. And, out of 400, they pay rent, utilities, clothing. You are the self professed math wizard, you figure it out.

Lucylastic -> RE: Glass houses and stones don't mix (1/17/2012 12:40:17 AM)
http://www.miamiherald.com/2011/10/24/2470519/florida-welfare-drug-testing-halted.html That happens to be Florida’s experience so far. A Florida television station, WFTV, reported that of the first 40 applicants tested, only two came up positive, and one of those was appealing. The state stands to save less than $240 a month if it denies benefits to the two applicants, but it had to pay $1,140 to the applicants who tested negative. The state will also have to spend considerably more to defend the policy in court. Drug testing welfare applicants does not seem to meet the Chandler test since there is no particular safety reason to be concerned about drug use by welfare recipients. In 2003, the U.S. Sixth Circuit Court of Appeals struck down Michigan’s drug testing of welfare applicants as a Fourth Amendment violation. Read more: http://ideas.time.com/2011/08/29/drug-testing-the-poor-bad-policy-even-worse-law/#ixzz1jhcWDEgG http://www.aclu.org/blog/criminal-law-reform/victory-florida-no-illegal-drug-testing-welfare The judge ruled that the compelled drug testing is a search under the 4th Amendment, and that individuals retain a right of privacy against such intrusive, suspicionless searches by the state, even when applying for temporary assistance. your position is indefensible according to the judge Stay on the topic, drugs/piliticans / DUI My positon is more than defensible Just facts something you have little of. but keep making it about MY hate and emotion please

DarqueMirror -> RE: Glass houses and stones don't mix (1/17/2012 12:48:35 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl I mean, come on. Admit that your belief is that people on welfare are wasting their money on drugs... all of them. That is what you believe, isnt it? Not even remotely close, though that is what your side in the debate will often insinuate. However, after seeing this long list of yours, I'd like you to admit you think all politicians are drugged up, drunken fools who shouldn't be in office. That is what you believe, isn't it?

Lucylastic -> RE: Glass houses and stones don't mix (1/17/2012 12:52:36 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl quote: They have zero, spend $40 and get $400. If they pass that test, they get the $40 returned to them. What part of this arent you getting. In Georgia, they arent getting reimbursed. And, out of 400, they pay rent, utilities, clothing. You are the self professed math wizard, you figure it out. he is batting 1000 tonite on guessing what we mean and want, he hasnt been RIGHT yet on any of his strawmen, except in his opinion LOL

DarqueMirror -> RE: Glass houses and stones don't mix (1/17/2012 12:53:30 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl What part of this arent you getting. In Georgia, they arent getting reimbursed. Fine. So instead of being up $400, they're only up $360. That's still more than negative $1k, isn't it? Again, using basic math skills here. quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl And, out of 400, they pay rent, utilities, clothing. Oh come now. You can't really believe that. If they qualify for welfare, they also qualify to get food stamps and government housing as well. In government housing, most don't pay utilities, so that's out as well. quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl You are the self professed math wizard, you figure it out. Did the words "math wizard" ever leave my keyboard? No. I said basic math skills used in grade school. I know you think such an emotional outburst garners your side support, but it doesn't.

tazzygirl -> RE: Glass houses and stones don't mix (1/17/2012 12:57:23 AM)
Lawmakers have introduced a number of bills in both the House and Senate requiring drug tests for various types of benefits. Courts have ruled similar measures to be unconstitutional. Judges struck down a Michigan law in 2003 and stayed one in Florida last year over concerns it violated the Fourth Amendment on unreasonable searches and seizures. Even so, similar bills have been filed in more than two dozen states over the past year, according to The Associated Press. In Florida, nearly 1,600 applicants refused to take the test between July, when testing began, and the stay in October, but they aren’t required to say why, the AP reported. Thirty-two applicants failed the test, and more than 7,000 passed, according to the Department of Children and Families. The majority of positives were for marijuana. http://onlineathens.com/local-news/2012-01-16/mckillip-signs-drug-testing-bills Amazing how less than 0.5% failed in the end. I guess illegal search is perfectly fine as long as you are poor and on public assistance.

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