The Unholy Trio Demand "Justice" (Full Version)

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DaddySatyr -> The Unholy Trio Demand "Justice" (3/14/2012 8:30:00 AM)

Forbes Online

quote:



Imagine this scenario: you are a lifelong liberal. You pretty much hate everything Rush Limbaugh stands for, and says. You are really glad that the times have finally seemed to have caught up to him, and that people are outraged by his callous, gross comments. So what do you do next? You do the one thing that will make him a sympathetic figure. You call on the FCC to remove him.

Think this is just not-very-good satire? If only. Nope, I draw from this example because in an opinion piece just published on CNN.com Jane Fonda, Gloria Steinem, and Robin Morgan did exactly this. In the process they seem to have played into the exact stereotype of the thin-skinned, hypocritical liberal. One who supports the First Amendment and freedom of speech … except for when they don’t.

Here is the lame excuse they offered for why the heavy hand of government sponsored censorship should come down on Limbaugh, a guy who seemed to be doing a pretty good imitation of a man hoist on his own petard anyway.

“Radio broadcasters are obligated to act in the public interest and serve their respective communities of license. In keeping with this obligation, individual radio listeners may complain to the FCC that Limbaugh’s radio station (and those syndicating his show) are not acting in the public interest or serving their respective communities of license by permitting such dehumanizing speech.”

Umm, okay. But isn’t there something called ratings that are a truer indication of what these respective communities already want? And shouldn’t that count the most? Don’t ratings (i.e. “popularity”) in fact tell the FCC just whom the public thinks serves their interest? Whether we like it or not?

Either Limbaugh serves a large demographic or he doesn’t, it’s pretty simple. As long as he doesn’t violate any laws I don’t see what argument there is to be made to remove him based on serving some imaginary definition of the public interest. It seems to me the public has spoken quite clearly about what it likes. A large portion of it still likes Rush, although fewer than before this flap began.

Then they argued that while Limbaugh is “is indeed constitutionally entitled to his opinions … he is not constitutionally entitled to the people’s airways.”

I just don’t understand this line of reasoning. Just at the very moment when the public has come alive to the fact that Limbaugh has long since crossed over the line of decency, when the system, in fact, is working, along come these three to say that “the people” need to remove Limbaugh via the FCC. Even as “the people” seem to be doing a pretty good job of it already.

No. That is the wrong way to do it. The “people” need to get rid of Limbaugh the old fashioned way, by not listening to his show. By offering strong counter-arguments to his diminished pulpit. By telling his sponsors they’ve had enough. By proving that the First Amendment still protects all speech, even Limbaugh’s, but that it cuts both ways.

As long as liberals argue that government should protect us from upsetting opinions they are never going to win, and shouldn’t. Begging the FCC to do what listeners have yet to do—get rid of Limbaugh—both looks and is weak.

I am not a fan of Rush Limbaugh’s show. So I don’t listen to it. He hasn’t gotten one Nielsen rating from me, and his sponsors have missed me too. And in the past few weeks many more people who used to be on the fence about Limbaugh have come around to my point of view, it seems. If enough people argue back against his ill-informed spew, using facts, a real, meaningful change will have taken place in this country.

Liberals and Democrats either need to make their case better than Limbaugh does, or, just as effectively, sit back and watch as his hate machine continues to eat its own tail. Eventually, though, you run out of tail. And that’s when the fun really starts. In fact, you could say the past two weeks have offered a pretty great argument as to why Limbaugh and his kind don’t deserve your vote, by any definition of that word. So let them talk.



For those of you that don't remember ...

quote:

ORIGINAL: Gloria Steinem

on Texas Sen. Kay Bailey Hutchison
She's a female impersonator. You know, someone who looks like us but thinks like them



No war on women there ... well, obviously, even women make war on the women that don't advance their femme-agogue agenda.

As for Robin Morgan, it would almost be fair to say that as editor-in-chief of Ms. magazine she is somewhat akin to the captain of a ship in that she's responsible for everything that eminates from the rag but, I will be fair and just give a quote that's attributed to her ...


quote:

ORIGINAL: Robin Morgan

I feel that "man-hating" is an honorable and viable political act, that the oppressed have a right to class-hatred against the class that is oppressing them.



And then, of course, there's good ol' "Hanoi Jane" the treasonous palin that went to North Vietnam, a country with who we were at war and ...

quote:

Snopes

The most prominent example of a clash between private citizen protest and governmental military policy in recent history occurred in July 1972, when actress Jane Fonda arrived in Hanoi, North Vietnam, and began a two-week tour of the country conducted by uniformed military hosts. Aside from visiting villages, hospitals, schools, and factories, Fonda also posed for pictures in which she was shown applauding North Vietnamese anti-aircraft gunners, was photographed peering into the sights of an NVA anti-aircraft artillery launcher, and made ten propagandistic Tokyo Rose-like radio broadcasts in which she denounced American political and military leaders as "war criminals." She also spoke with eight American POWs at a carefully arranged "press conference," POWs who had been tortured by their North Vietnamese captors to force them to meet with Fonda, deny they had been tortured, and decry the American war effort. Fonda apparently didn't notice (or care) that the POWs were delivering their lines under duress or find it unusual the she was not allowed to visit the prisoner-of-war camp (commonly known as the "Hanoi Hilton") itself. She merely went home and told the world that "[the POWs] assured me they were in good health. When I asked them if they were brainwashed, they all laughed. Without exception, they expressed shame at what they had done." She did, however, charge that North Vietnamese POWs were systematically tortured in American prison-of-war camps.



These are the "ladies" that have decided to put their name to a public attack on the 1st amendment wherein they ask the FCC to silence Rush Limbaugh.

Once again, Limbaugh was absolutely wrong for the words he used, a couple of weeks ago and I fully the support the people, doing what they feel is right by pressuring advertisers but the people launching this attack have proven themselves to be anti-(some)women and in one case, down-right un-American.

The hypocrisy and almost ironic failed memory of their own history is laughable.

What is not a laughing matter is that these "ladies" hold some sway in this country and could get some attention.

Forget Limbaugh. Forget Hanoi Jane. Forget Gloria. If you defend the right to free speech for some, you must defend the right to free speech for all or your words are empty and shallow and you place yourself next to people like the unholy trinity of Gloria, Robin, and Hanoi Jane.

I can certainly understand some agreeing with one or even two but, if you take a position with the third, I can only say this: "If you don't want to stand behind the fine men and women that defend our freedom - including your freedom to call them "war criminals" for doing their job - please feel free to stand in front of them while they're locked and loaded."



Peace and comfort,



Michael




xssve -> RE: The Unholy Trio Demand "Justice" (3/14/2012 8:35:22 AM)

Yeah, I think there are probably more substantive issues, get over it already, it was a clear victory, and keeping on at it just looks obsessive.

Liberals apparently don't know when to quit either, and this is already hurting us among swing voters - we could make up for it right quick if we could get some slutwalkers up there to own it. [:D]

National energy policy is going to the be thing that makes or breaks us as a country in the next 20 years, the war between the sexes will grind on forever.




Hillwilliam -> RE: The Unholy Trio Demand "Justice" (3/14/2012 8:35:41 AM)

What's the difference between Sean Hannity, Rush Limbaugh, Bill clinton, Glenn Beck, George Bush (the junior one) and "Hanoi Jane" Fonda?


Fonda was the only one that had the guts to go to Vietnam.




DaddySatyr -> RE: The Unholy Trio Demand "Justice" (3/14/2012 8:38:58 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam

What's the difference between Sean Hannity, Rush Limbaugh, Bill clinton, Glenn Beck, George Bush (the junior one) and "Hanoi Jane" Fonda?


Fonda was the only one that had the guts to go to Vietnam.


I hope you're trying to be funny because if you think what she did in Vietnam was "gutsy", I hold you in a lot less esteem than I have, in the past.

(Sean was too young for Vietnam, by the way. He's 50)




Peace and comfort,



Michael




Musicmystery -> RE: The Unholy Trio Demand "Justice" (3/14/2012 8:41:32 AM)

quote:

If you defend the right to free speech for some, you must defend the right to free speech for all or your words are empty and shallow


I will point out once again---this is entirely the role of the FCC, beyond an almost antequated role of assigning bandwidth, and it has been for quite some time--thanks to conservative pressure to have government police decency. Where were you then?

Otherwise, I'm on the same page about censorship as you....but the fauxrage here requires you find a mirror.




Iamsemisweet -> RE: The Unholy Trio Demand "Justice" (3/14/2012 8:42:00 AM)

So three women are exercising their right to free speech by writing a letter to the FCC. This is news?




DaddySatyr -> RE: The Unholy Trio Demand "Justice" (3/14/2012 8:44:53 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

quote:

If you defend the right to free speech for some, you must defend the right to free speech for all or your words are empty and shallow


I will point out once again---this is entirely the role of the FCC, beyond an almost antequated role of assigning bandwidth, and it has been for quite some time--thanks to conservative pressure to have government police decency. Where were you then?

Otherwise, I'm on the same page about censorship as you....but the fauxrage here requires you find a mirror.


I marched with Howard Stern, a guy I can't fucking stand, for his right to broadcast his brand of "humor".



Peace and comfort,



Michael




xssve -> RE: The Unholy Trio Demand "Justice" (3/14/2012 8:45:46 AM)

On the flip side, it's still not a lawsuit, yet, and if Rush can call women sluts, I ought to be able to see Janet Jackson's tits.

Fair is fair. [:D]




Hillwilliam -> RE: The Unholy Trio Demand "Justice" (3/14/2012 8:49:05 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: DaddySatyr

quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam

What's the difference between Sean Hannity, Rush Limbaugh, Bill clinton, Glenn Beck, George Bush (the junior one) and "Hanoi Jane" Fonda?


Fonda was the only one that had the guts to go to Vietnam.


I hope you're trying to be funny because if you think what she did in Vietnam was "gutsy", I hold you in a lot less esteem than I have, in the past.

(Sean was too young for Vietnam, by the way. He's 50)




Peace and comfort,



Michael


No, just pointing out that the "party of patriotism" is poorly named (yes, I tossed Clinton in there as well). They should more rightly be named the "party of Chickenhawks".
There's some interesting info here about which party did what they saw as their duty and which just talks about it. http://www.electoral-vote.com/evp2011/Info/military-service.html
Personally, I think it took guts to do what she did but I also think it's a damn shame there wasn't a properly timed bombing raid. That would have solved a lot of problems.




DaddySatyr -> RE: The Unholy Trio Demand "Justice" (3/14/2012 8:49:48 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: xssve

On the flip side, it's still not a lawsuit, yet, and if Rush can call women sluts, I ought to be able to see Janet Jackson's tits.

Fair is fair. [:D]


I agree with you to a degree as I have always said that if you make me choose between "gratuitous sex" or "gratuitous violence" (the catch-phrases, commonly thrown around), I would absolutely rather have children, even see the former rather than the latter.

I do have to admit that certain things are better suited to adults or, more appropriately: certain things should be judged as "age appropriate" and should not air, at certain times.

Ultimately, when it comes to the likes of Limbaugh, Stern, that palin Maher, or any of their ilk, we as adults have a simple choice; turn them off.



Peace and comfort,



Michael




RacerJim -> RE: The Unholy Trio Demand "Justice" (3/14/2012 8:50:31 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam

What's the difference between Sean Hannity, Rush Limbaugh, Bill clinton, Glenn Beck, George Bush (the junior one) and "Hanoi Jane" Fonda?


Fonda was the only one that had the guts to go to Vietnam.

Jane HANOI Fonda was the only one who committed TREASON by aiding and abeting Communist North Vietnam.

Vietnam Veteran




DaddySatyr -> RE: The Unholy Trio Demand "Justice" (3/14/2012 8:54:36 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: RacerJim


quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam

What's the difference between Sean Hannity, Rush Limbaugh, Bill clinton, Glenn Beck, George Bush (the junior one) and "Hanoi Jane" Fonda?


Fonda was the only one that had the guts to go to Vietnam.

Jane HANOI Fonda was the only one who committed TREASON by aiding and abeting Communist North Vietnam.

Vietnam Veteran


Thank you for your service and huah!



Peace and comfort,



Michael




MrBukani -> RE: The Unholy Trio Demand "Justice" (3/14/2012 8:59:22 AM)

If advertisers want to be identified with Rush LimpLog , let them.
Stupid is as stupid does.
Its a dying breed anyway and we need stupidity to feed comedy.




DaddySatyr -> RE: The Unholy Trio Demand "Justice" (3/14/2012 9:06:16 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: MrBukani

If advertisers want to be identified with Rush LimpLog , let them.
Stupid is as stupid does.
Its a dying breed anyway and we need stupidity to feed comedy.


While I "appreciate" your input, this isn't about the advertisers. It's about an attack on part of our constitution; on a right that many of us invoke on a daily basis (especially here). I have already said that the advertisers have every right to do what they do and I applaud people who pressure the advertisers because that's the only "vote" that we have that really counts, anymore.



Peace and comfort,



Michael




Musicmystery -> RE: The Unholy Trio Demand "Justice" (3/14/2012 9:10:39 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: DaddySatyr

quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

quote:

If you defend the right to free speech for some, you must defend the right to free speech for all or your words are empty and shallow


I will point out once again---this is entirely the role of the FCC, beyond an almost antequated role of assigning bandwidth, and it has been for quite some time--thanks to conservative pressure to have government police decency. Where were you then?

Otherwise, I'm on the same page about censorship as you....but the fauxrage here requires you find a mirror.


I marched with Howard Stern, a guy I can't fucking stand, for his right to broadcast his brand of "humor".



Peace and comfort,



Michael


Then we agree on that much (about Stern as well).

Two separate issues here--Rush and the hypocrisy of the FCC.

If someone is finally going after the later, about time. If the former is the reason, so be it.

The trio's claims are over the top, of course, and not going to happen. Even if they had a case, it would be settled with a fine, not removal from the air.

But politics is played by theater these days. Remember the swift boaters? Or Willie Horton? Or the Muskee letter? All bullshit, and everyone knew it, but they also knew bullshit works.

I used to point out the Democratic leadership had no backbone. Now the Republican leadership is spineless as well. They've kowtowed to Rush's program for years, and to the fanatic portion of the religious right, to see their party ripped apart and turned into a mockery of what it was four decades ago. If the leadership can't do it, ultimately the players will.





RacerJim -> RE: The Unholy Trio Demand "Justice" (3/14/2012 9:13:45 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Iamsemisweet

So three women are exercising their right to free speech by writing a letter to the FCC. This is news?

It is to the lamestream-media. Anything to divert "We the people..." from the real news...Obama, via Obamacare, violating the Catholic Church's right to freedom of religion by requiring it to provide contraceptive AND abortive products free of charge to female employees.




DaddySatyr -> RE: The Unholy Trio Demand "Justice" (3/14/2012 9:18:34 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery
Then we agree on that much (about Stern as well).

Two separate issues here--Rush and the hypocrisy of the FCC.

If someone is finally going after the later, about time. If the former is the reason, so be it.

The trio's claims are over the top, of course, and not going to happen. Even if they had a case, it would be settled with a fine, not removal from the air.

But politics is played by theater these days. Remember the swift boaters? Or Willie Horton? Or the Muskee letter? All bullshit, and everyone knew it, but they also knew bullshit works.

I used to point out the Democratic leadership had no backbone. Now the Republican leadership is spineless as well. They've kowtowed to Rush's program for years, and to the fanatic portion of the religious right, to see their party ripped apart and turned into a mockery of what it was four decades ago. If the leadership can't do it, ultimately the players will.




To be completely selfish; I don't care about the Democratic or the Republican parties. As a matter of fact, my position is: If they keep going the way they're going, the ranks of my party will swell.

Seriously, my concern here is for the constitution and the fact that for over a decade (at least and closer to four decades) we have given away our liberty like sheep give up their lives to the slaughterhouse.

To me, anymore, any slight move against any of our freedoms needs to be exposed and beaten down to bowels of the hell from which it ascended. I am sick to death of people only defending rights when they affect them, directly and fail to see the big picture: If the government hasn't fucked with your rights, yet, it's just because they're fucking with mine, right now. They'll get to yours.



Peace and comfort,



Michael




MrRodgers -> RE: The Unholy Trio Demand "Justice" (3/14/2012 9:19:17 AM)

You obviously have a point on the matter of free speech. It is used and has been used to further greater political freedom of the west.

My problem is 'hired' or 'scripted' speech. Most of the talking heads mentioned in your OP are paid...to lie and right straight through their teeth.

Fox even scripts for its 'reporters.' [sic]

(Let's just SAY, the reverend was the ghost writer of Obama's 'autobiography.' Let's just...SAY it ? The debate then ensues based on what debaters know is a blatant lie)

I ask that while it is 'free speech' to what extent does free speech in the form of both govt. and broadcast information as lies begin to step outside the bounds and of there are no bounds...then all bets are off as to the future of relevant free speech. Speech will turn to nothing more than a means to inflame. Inciting a riot comes to mind.

Most ALL of what the talking right wingnuts talk about, is...based on a ridiculous lie.

What we've seen in 30-40 years, is the hypocrisy and corruption of our govt....hitting the airwaves. The right is winning the war OF propaganda...the dems are just rank amateurs.




MrBukani -> RE: The Unholy Trio Demand "Justice" (3/14/2012 9:24:12 AM)

Dutch MP acquitted in 'hate' trial

posted this in the other first amendment thread too, post#34
same difference.
Like they said here its a win win situation for the accused.
Loose - and they will cry about killing free speech
Win - we can call eachother names and public figures are allowed to spread hatred.
Better?




erieangel -> RE: The Unholy Trio Demand "Justice" (3/14/2012 9:24:37 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: RacerJim


quote:

ORIGINAL: Iamsemisweet

So three women are exercising their right to free speech by writing a letter to the FCC. This is news?

It is to the lamestream-media. Anything to divert "We the people..." from the real news...Obama, via Obamacare, violating the Catholic Church's right to freedom of religion by requiring it to provide contraceptive AND abortive products free of charge to female employees.



Eh?? Excuse me. As pointed out on other threads, the contraceptive mandate has been in place since 2000, the only change in that it will have no co-pay...that's hardly "free of charge" as you claim because we still pay for our insurance. Also, the Catholic Church is exempt from this mandate, as are any other houses of worship. Catholic hospitals, on the hand, are not exempt, because not everybody who works at Catholic hospital is Catholic.


Back to the topic...This is a matter for the FCC, but they won't pull Rush off the air. He won't even get the hefty fine the network got after Janet Jackson's "wardrobe malfunction".





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