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Slavery [submission] and Strength....... - 6/3/2006 4:43:27 PM

slaverosebeauty

Posts: 1941
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From: Cali
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I have heard from more than a few people saying that being a slave or submissive means that one is 'weak.' It's actually the opposite, it takes a stronger person to give up control, choices, will, among other things to another person.

Don't submission and strength go hand in hand??
or
Is it true that submissives, slaves, kajira, etc are just 'weak' and meant to be controlled??

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RE: Slavery [submission] and Strength....... - 6/3/2006 4:49:45 PM

Calandra

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I don't attribute weakness to submission or Dominance... the strength is simply expressed differently...

Maybe some of the ones who miss that idea are simply not seeing the forest for the trees.

My cubby is one of the strongest people I've ever known. Hell, he puts up with me 24/7 which is more than you guys hafta do.... LOL

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RE: Slavery [submission] and Strength....... - 6/3/2006 4:50:54 PM

Vancouver_cinful

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Sure, ALL submissives are weak. Especially those who are single parents, work hard, raise kids on their own, have battled domestic abuse and walked away and rebuilt their lives, are doctors, firefighters, CEOs...

::rolling my eyes::

Generalizations are never accurate. Subs are human. Some are stronger than others, some are weaker. Some have issues, some don't. Some want to be rescued, some fight tooth and nail to retain their independance.

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RE: Slavery [submission] and Strength....... - 6/3/2006 4:51:00 PM

cuddleheart50

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I am a sub and by no means am I weak.

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RE: Slavery [submission] and Strength....... - 6/3/2006 4:52:51 PM

Reflectivesoul

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submissives/slaves are not weak and those that percieve them this way need to go on about their business honestly. Just because someone enjoys the power exchange from the bottom side of the D/s doesnt mean that they have no back bone. It irritates the shit out of me when people assume that because someone is submissive/slave that they cant have a rational thought or arent capable of doing for themselves. The majority of the submissives/slaves I know are soooo ( for the lack of better word.. sorry brain sludge...) deep. They are also (usually) so expressive in their mannerisms and a delight to get to unwrap...

I think its all too often that people like to think and percieve submissives as weak because they gain some kind of gratification in making themselves appear to be the better half.... Those that come here ( into BDSM) with a warped ( ha ha I know we are all warped but use it in context please) view on submissives/slaves, saying they are weak and less of a person for being submissive, should really wear a nametag that says "Caution, idiot on parade" because submissives deal with and handle so much responsibility in WIITWD and without a strong foundation submissives/slaves wouldnt be able to handle much of that at all...

<end rant>

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RE: Slavery [submission] and Strength....... - 6/3/2006 5:06:39 PM

feastie

Posts: 1793
Joined: 6/4/2004
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There are plenty of people that obviously believe a submissive person with backbone, an intelligent mind and opinions of her own is not submissive, she must be dominant. Those are all dominant traits, right? *snorts* If I had a dollar for every time I've been told I'm not submissive, I'm dominant. Yes, I have a strong personality. Yes, I am opinionated. Yes, I am passionate about many things. No, I'm not dominant. I've been asked by a submissive male to spank his ass and take pictures because he wants them to post on his profile (can't figure that one out), but it's just not something I have in me. So, I'm not even a top. He argues with me, tells me that I should be able to, because I've spanked my children...but...they are children...

Anyway, there is no correlation between weakness and being submissive. It's the weak dominant, that would venture such a thing, because a weak person is easy to manipulate and that, in his mind, is control.

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RE: Slavery [submission] and Strength....... - 6/3/2006 5:13:26 PM

Padriag

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quote:

ORIGINAL: slaverosebeauty

I have heard from more than a few people saying that being a slave or submissive means that one is 'weak.' It's actually the opposite, it takes a stronger person to give up control, choices, will, among other things to another person.

Don't submission and strength go hand in hand??
or
Is it true that submissives, slaves, kajira, etc are just 'weak' and meant to be controlled??

Neither statement is universally true.

Certainly there are those submissives who choose to submit out of nothing more than personal desire. Its the type of relationship they choose for themselves because doing so appeals to them. In it they find happiness, rewards, satisfaction, etc.

Just as certainly there are those who do so because they feel they are unable to do anything else. They seek in submission to find some kind of self worth for themselves because they feel incapable of developing their own self worth independantly.

Western society tends to view both as "weak", regardless of the actual facts chiefly because western society places such a high value on independence, specifically personal independence. Since submissives choose to place themself in a subordinant and (to varying degrees) dependant position in relation to someone else, Western society reflexively sees that as weak. It is a misperception on the part of society, and nothing more. If Western society valued teamwork more than personal independence, submissive would likely be seen with a great deal more respect (but then if that were true the entire history of the western world would be drastically different... and not necessarily better... it is what is).

Being submissive does not make one a stronger or weaker person. Why you choose to submit, however, may.

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RE: Slavery [submission] and Strength....... - 6/3/2006 5:21:18 PM

slaverosebeauty

Posts: 1941
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Thanks for the backup ladies.

I am a single mother, works full-time, works with an international non-profit, survived a LOT of hell and I am currently waiting to see if I have cancer, so I guess that makes me weak.

I agree that being a slave or submissive does not make one 'weak;' what I am trying to find out is if people [others] think that being a 'bottom' [general term used] means that one is 'weak' for the 'fact' [I cannot think of another term] that they bottom to another.

Does submission = weak??

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RE: Slavery [submission] and Strength....... - 6/3/2006 5:24:50 PM

LuckyAlbatross

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Subs are just like everyone else- some strong, some weak.

IMO a lot of subs enjoy playing on their weaknesses to get attention/protection/guidance/feel desired, but get ruffled when someone actually treats them like they are weak.

But subs are just normal people- some are really strong and some are really weak.

It takes strong people to make strong relationships, but there's a heck of a lot of weak relationships in bdsm and Ds.

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RE: Slavery [submission] and Strength....... - 6/3/2006 5:29:58 PM

pinkee

Posts: 487
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quote:

ORIGINAL: slaverosebeauty

I have heard from more than a few people saying that being a slave or submissive means that one is 'weak.' It's actually the opposite, it takes a stronger person to give up control, choices, will, among other things to another person.

Don't submission and strength go hand in hand??
or
Is it true that submissives, slaves, kajira, etc are just 'weak' and meant to be controlled??

Amen, sister.

pinkee

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RE: Slavery [submission] and Strength....... - 6/3/2006 6:14:07 PM

LadiesBladewing

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Every act that we undertake in life, including acts of yielding (submission) and acts of accepting responsibility for another human being (dominance) takes on the characteristics that we bring to it. If we are strong in other aspects of our lives, we will come to these things and bring strength to them. If we are weak, we will approach these choices from a position of weakness, and weaken them accordingly.

Neither dominance nor submission is inherently weak, strong, good, bad, beneficial or destructive. Each depends on the individual who is practicing the act to impart the particular tone that it will have in any given situation.

Yet another aspect that needs to be taken into consideration is the realization that some choices that a person makes may be made from what they believe to be a 'strong' position, but others observing the action may interpret or define the choice as "weak". We cannot define concepts for someone else. Each concept is colored by the perceptions of the acting principal or any given observer. All we can do is know for -ourselves- how we are approaching things, and not let ourselves be distracted by other people's perceptions and comments about -their- definitions or interpretations of our actions.

Da'Avatar ZWD

quote:

ORIGINAL: slaverosebeauty

I have heard from more than a few people saying that being a slave or submissive means that one is 'weak.' It's actually the opposite, it takes a stronger person to give up control, choices, will, among other things to another person.

Don't submission and strength go hand in hand??
or
Is it true that submissives, slaves, kajira, etc are just 'weak' and meant to be controlled??

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