Being uninsured is a mandate, too......

Being uninsured is a mandate, too...... (Full Version)

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Owner59 -> Being uninsured is a mandate, too...... (4/3/2012 6:53:05 PM)
http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0412/74779.html "They tell it like it is at the beauty shop or barbershop. I went for a haircut on Saturday. My hairdresser Carmelita and I got to talking about health care and the decision now in the hands of the Supreme Court “Do you have health insurance?” I asked. “No,” she said softly. “Why not?” “Are you kidding? It’s just too expensive. No way can I afford it.” “Would you buy it if you could?” “Of course!” she said, her brow furrowed at the idiocy of the question. “I’m still paying off a $3,000 health care bill from last year when I had walking pneumonia and finally went to see the doctor. They ordered an X-ray of my chest, and my life hasn’t been the same since, trying to pay that medical bill. Of course, I’d have health insurance if I could afford it! Anybody would.” And then she said something that turned the “individual health care mandate” opponents’ argument on its head: “I’m already forced to buy health care – but it’s in the emergency room. It’s almost bankrupting me. Do these guys think that’s my choice?” A “health care mandate,” it seems, is in the eye of the beholder And let’s be honest about where the pre-“Obamacare” emergency-room mandate is coming from. That mandate comes from congressional acts, too — for example, the 1986 Emergency Medical Treatment and Active Labor Act, which requires hospitals to treat anyone needing emergency care regardless of ability to pay. Indeed, Congress has enacted over the years a complex web of authorizing statutes and rules that regulate health care and allow insurance companies to price people out of the market

tazzygirl -> RE: Being uninsured is a mandate, too...... (4/3/2012 11:53:48 PM)
No one is demanding free health care. What we are demanding is affordable health care. Last time I checked, stitches were 600 a piece in the ER. Thats to pay for the new wing, the redecorated offices, the lovely paintings people see when they walk by too distracted over loved ones to bother to look, the nice water fountains on the outside, ect ect ect.

Real0ne -> RE: Being uninsured is a mandate, too...... (4/4/2012 12:16:21 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Owner59 Indeed, Congress has enacted over the years a complex web of authorizing statutes and rules that regulate health care and allow insurance companies to price people out of the market oh but if they are going to fix that problem they want a piece of everyones ass by forcing them to buy services provided by the gub. I cnat wait to see what they will force us to buy 50 years from now in the name of repairing their assinine negligence and disregard to their duty to PROTECT rights not abolish them.

Real0ne -> RE: Being uninsured is a mandate, too...... (4/4/2012 12:19:17 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl No one is demanding free health care. What we are demanding is affordable health care. Last time I checked, stitches were 600 a piece in the ER. Thats to pay for the new wing, the redecorated offices, the lovely paintings people see when they walk by too distracted over loved ones to bother to look, the nice water fountains on the outside, ect ect ect. if you think that is high wait till they get done fucking that all up. what has the gub EVER done that ran in the black?

joether -> RE: Being uninsured is a mandate, too...... (4/4/2012 4:25:10 AM)
The part I get a chuckle at is when I hear some moron say "I dont want to pay for someone else's healthcare!". It shows just how dumb the person is on the subject of 'US Goverment 101". When you pay taxes to the US Goverment, that money is no longer your money, its the US Goverment's money. That money is used on a wide range of things from bullets, toilet paper, road construction, to paying medical doctors. $3.2 Trillion was the budget for 2012. Only a subsection of that total funding was applied towards medicine. Its misleading when people say "Last year, Americans paid, through the US Goverment 'X' dollars", because some whacko simply took how much was paid for medicine and divided by the total number of taxpayers. You and I, did not pay for Farmer Bob's health care; the US Goverment did. Now, you as the individual taxpayer can contact your representative and senator(s) to plead that you dont want your money being spent "on someone else's healthcare". But once the money is in the US Goverment's hands, its the US Goverment's money.

farglebargle -> RE: Being uninsured is a mandate, too...... (4/4/2012 4:26:11 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Real0ne quote: ORIGINAL: Owner59 Indeed, Congress has enacted over the years a complex web of authorizing statutes and rules that regulate health care and allow insurance companies to price people out of the market oh but if they are going to fix that problem they want a piece of everyones ass by forcing them to buy services provided by the gub. I cnat wait to see what they will force us to buy 50 years from now in the name of repairing their assinine negligence and disregard to their duty to PROTECT rights not abolish them. Do you have to insure your car?

Moonhead -> RE: Being uninsured is a mandate, too...... (4/4/2012 4:33:21 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: joether The part I get a chuckle at is when I hear some moron say "I dont want to pay for someone else's healthcare!". It shows just how dumb the person is on the subject of 'US Goverment 101". When you pay taxes to the US Goverment, that money is no longer your money, its the US Goverment's money. That money is used on a wide range of things from bullets, toilet paper, road construction, to paying medical doctors. $3.2 Trillion was the budget for 2012. Only a subsection of that total funding was applied towards medicine. Its misleading when people say "Last year, Americans paid, through the US Goverment 'X' dollars", because some whacko simply took how much was paid for medicine and divided by the total number of taxpayers. You and I, did not pay for Farmer Bob's health care; the US Goverment did. Now, you as the individual taxpayer can contact your representative and senator(s) to plead that you dont want your money being spent "on someone else's healthcare". But once the money is in the US Goverment's hands, its the US Goverment's money. It would be quite simple to include a checklist and tick boxes on the back of the tax return forms. Just have the people paying the taxes mark where they want the money going. I'd suspect more of them will be happy with it going on social programmes (including other people's medical care) than being pissed away on military spending that doesn't produce anything useful (that bloody comanche helicopter and the chimp's attempt to relaunch the SDI programme are cases in point here).

kalikshama -> RE: Being uninsured is a mandate, too...... (4/4/2012 5:16:09 AM)
Good article. Here's more: Walk the streets of D.C. and ask people who are working for minimum wage at the coffee shops whether they “choose” to not have insurance or whether the system essentially mandates it for them. Being forced out of the insurance market doesn’t mean one is absent from the health care market. In fact, a person without insurance is arguably a disproportionately oversized player in the marketplace of health care, most likely having more impact on commerce — uncompensated care, debt, bankruptcies, collections, cost shifting — than the person with an insurance policy. Read more: http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0412/74779_Page2.html#ixzz1r4bVMmB1

Musicmystery -> RE: Being uninsured is a mandate, too...... (4/4/2012 7:31:01 AM)
I don't want to be mandated to contribute to defense spending through the IRS either. Americans should rail against that--we could afford all kinds of stuff then, including tax cuts.

DesideriScuri -> RE: Being uninsured is a mandate, too...... (4/4/2012 7:35:11 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: farglebargle quote: ORIGINAL: Real0ne quote: ORIGINAL: Owner59 Indeed, Congress has enacted over the years a complex web of authorizing statutes and rules that regulate health care and allow insurance companies to price people out of the market oh but if they are going to fix that problem they want a piece of everyones ass by forcing them to buy services provided by the gub. I cnat wait to see what they will force us to buy 50 years from now in the name of repairing their assinine negligence and disregard to their duty to PROTECT rights not abolish them. Do you have to insure your car? Not until I want to drive.

DesideriScuri -> RE: Being uninsured is a mandate, too...... (4/4/2012 7:38:54 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Musicmystery I don't want to be mandated to contribute to defense spending through the IRS either. Americans should rail against that--we could afford all kinds of stuff then, including tax cuts. Agreed, except for the "we could afford all kinds of stuff then" part. Close our foreign bases. Bring our troops home. Slash the shit out of the Defense budget. Stop being World Cop. Just don't take that money and spend it somewhere else. That doesn't help the budget at all. It is still spending more than we have.

Musicmystery -> RE: Being uninsured is a mandate, too...... (4/4/2012 7:45:18 AM)
I meant "afford" as opposed to "borrowing."

Iamsemisweet -> RE: Being uninsured is a mandate, too...... (4/4/2012 8:01:23 AM)
Do you mean " not until I am in a car wreck" DS? Because that is a more apt analogy to the health care situation. quote: ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri quote: ORIGINAL: farglebargle quote: ORIGINAL: Real0ne quote: ORIGINAL: Owner59 Indeed, Congress has enacted over the years a complex web of authorizing statutes and rules that regulate health care and allow insurance companies to price people out of the market oh but if they are going to fix that problem they want a piece of everyones ass by forcing them to buy services provided by the gub. I cnat wait to see what they will force us to buy 50 years from now in the name of repairing their assinine negligence and disregard to their duty to PROTECT rights not abolish them. Do you have to insure your car? Not until I want to drive.

Truthiness -> RE: Being uninsured is a mandate, too...... (4/4/2012 10:21:41 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Iamsemisweet Do you mean " not until I am in a car wreck" DS? Because that is a more apt analogy to the health care situation. I think it's safe to assume he meant exactly what he said, seeing as that's kinda how the law works and all.

Musicmystery -> RE: Being uninsured is a mandate, too...... (4/4/2012 11:08:06 AM)
The law governing car wrecks?

Arturas -> RE: Being uninsured is a mandate, too...... (4/4/2012 12:26:41 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: farglebargle quote: ORIGINAL: Real0ne quote: ORIGINAL: Owner59 Indeed, Congress has enacted over the years a complex web of authorizing statutes and rules that regulate health care and allow insurance companies to price people out of the market oh but if they are going to fix that problem they want a piece of everyones ass by forcing them to buy services provided by the gub. I cnat wait to see what they will force us to buy 50 years from now in the name of repairing their assinine negligence and disregard to their duty to PROTECT rights not abolish them. Do you have to insure your car? Yup. Because I wanted to drive. I choose to drive therefore I must pay what it takes to do so. With Obamacare I must pay even if I do not have the money or do not want health insurance or do not want health care. We clear on the dramatic difference yet? Here is it again: Free person chooses. Un-free person must. Constitution keeps us free. Obamacare removes freedom. Therefore, Obamacare un-Constitutional. Simple. This is why it will be a slam dunk. THis is why Obama must attack the Supreme Court who he oviously knows have made a decision the mandate is un-Constitutional, because he knows this failure will destroy him and he will go down in the history books as the President who was a Constitutional law professor who also spent two years enacting an un-Constitutional law and then tried to intimidate the Supreme Court with no success and then lost the election in November by a landslide, because who wants to vote for an obvious incompetent and a loser? Not you I imagine.

mnottertail -> RE: Being uninsured is a mandate, too...... (4/4/2012 12:31:17 PM)
Yeah, other than all the other foolishness you wrote, who will he lose to in November? Who don't we know about on the horizon?

Iamsemisweet -> RE: Being uninsured is a mandate, too...... (4/4/2012 12:36:30 PM)
So, Aturas, are we to believe that the anti individual mandate people who don't want insurance or health care will refuse medical treatment if they need it? If they are in a car wreck, for example, and in an ambulance on the way to the ER, will they croak out with their last breath that they want to be left on the street corner instead? I doubt it. I think the more likely scenario is that their dumb ass will get hauled into an ER, and if they don't have insurance, the hospital will be mandated to care for them, with the costs passed on to other patients, like me. That doesn't sound so free to me. quote: ORIGINAL: Arturas Yup. Because I wanted to drive. I choose to drive therefore I must pay what it takes to do so. With Obamacare I must pay even if I do not have the money or do not want health insurance or do not want health care.

Arturas -> RE: Being uninsured is a mandate, too...... (4/4/2012 12:55:30 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Iamsemisweet So, Aturas, are we to believe that the anti individual mandate people who don't want insurance or health care will refuse medical treatment if they need it? If they are in a car wreck, for example, and in an ambulance on the way to the ER, will they croak out with their last breath that they want to be left on the street corner instead? I doubt it. I think the more likely scenario is that their dumb ass will get hauled into an ER, and if they don't have insurance, the hospital will be mandated to care for them, with the costs passed on to other patients, like me. That doesn't sound so free to me. quote: ORIGINAL: Arturas Yup. Because I wanted to drive. I choose to drive therefore I must pay what it takes to do so. With Obamacare I must pay even if I do not have the money or do not want health insurance or do not want health care. I don't know, but they are certainly free to not take healthcare or not pay for something they don't want. You are free not to pay for something you don't want and you are free to refuse treatment. You are taxed for what the founders called the "common good" and Congress thinks hospitals should not refuse treatment for extreme injuries for those who have no money and thinks this is a "common good" use of taxes. Does this make me "not free' since I pay taxes and so does that support making me 'not free' some more by forcing me to pay for insurance with the Obama mandate? You bet. And if your example is wrong, two wrongs don't make a right. (pun not intended).

Arturas -> RE: Being uninsured is a mandate, too...... (4/4/2012 12:59:14 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: mnottertail Yeah, other than all the other foolishness you wrote, who will he lose to in November? Who don't we know about on the horizon? I also said by a landslide. Obama's presidency just collapsed. I saw it on nationwide TV last night. Remember my post warning about the left coming unglued in November after the election? I was wrong. It is starting now. I said by a landslide. Don't forget that.

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