Taliban supporter in U.S.: 'Moral Equivalent of Founding Fathers' (Full Version)

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Musicmystery -> Taliban supporter in U.S.: 'Moral Equivalent of Founding Fathers' (4/16/2012 9:21:25 AM)

[image]http://www.legitgov.org/graphics/reagan_taliban_1985.jpg[/image]

NEVER NEGOTIATE, right?

[:D]



Deleted User -> [Deleted] (4/16/2012 11:21:12 AM)

[Deleted by Admins]



Musicmystery -> RE: Taliban supporter in U.S.: 'Moral Equivalent of Founding Fathers' (4/16/2012 11:29:32 AM)

Kind of like your profile. Just sprung up from nowhere, and suddenly you're posting in P&R. When I post something, it's me, not a sock-puppet.

Your demonstrated difficulties in spelling perhaps indicate a wider problem with cognition. The Taliban didn't spring from nowhere either.

Here's a history lesson for you, filling you in on the background.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mujahideen

Note Reagan's own admissions.




fucktoyprincess -> RE: Taliban supporter in U.S.: 'Moral Equivalent of Founding Fathers' (4/16/2012 11:45:46 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: bellagio

Yet in reality, not a single one of those men are Taliban.

And in 1985 The Taliban did not exist.


What orginization gives you such cute, yet factually incoprrect political propoaganda?




Today's Taliban and related groups have their roots in the mujahideen who fought against the Soviets in Afghanistan. And the mujahideen were absolutely 100% supported by the the U.S. government including the CIA during the mid-80s. So while technically, the term "Taliban" probably doesn't emerge until 1989, the group is rooted in the mujahideen. I don't see a lot of difference in terms of the overall goals of these groups and the global terrorism that they have wrought.

If you are trying to deny that Reagan had anything to do with the mujahideen and the rise of the Taliban in Afghanistan, then it is you who need to consider from where you get your incorrect political propaganda.

The policies of the Reagan administration have directly led to some of the terrorist threats that we currently live with today. Anyone who thinks otherwise continues to have their head in the sand....



Deleted User -> [Deleted] (4/16/2012 12:05:47 PM)

[Deleted by Admins]



mnottertail -> RE: Taliban supporter in U.S.: 'Moral Equivalent of Founding Fathers' (4/16/2012 12:20:02 PM)

You better brush up on what Al-Queda is, because you are using them interchangeably and that ain't quite crikket.

Pakistan started their nuclear program in 1972.    India had theirs about 1967 and Pakistan started theirs in response to India (who we helped considerably in the Nixon years.  It may have escaped your attention that Pakistan has had the ass at India since the 40s when the country was created, though I am sure it still makes the papers occasionally.   

Try to get something right.



DomKen -> RE: Taliban supporter in U.S.: 'Moral Equivalent of Founding Fathers' (4/16/2012 12:20:29 PM)

FR

The Taliban != Mujahideen

The Taliban was created by the ISI (Pakistan's intelligence service) from actual taliban (religious students) in Pakistan nearly a decade after the Soviet pullout.



Moonhead -> RE: Taliban supporter in U.S.: 'Moral Equivalent of Founding Fathers' (4/16/2012 12:35:02 PM)

Yep, but there are rather more leftovers from the the Muhjahadeen within the Taliban thean bellagio is willing to admit. After all, if you're setting up an islamicists terrorist movement and there's a few of the pashtun islamicist terrorists who drove the soviets out of the country still knocking about, you're going to want them inside your tent pissing out, aren't you?



Hillwilliam -> RE: Taliban supporter in U.S.: 'Moral Equivalent of Founding Fathers' (4/16/2012 12:37:09 PM)

Don't forget Mullah Omar who was one of St Ronnie's pet Russkie fighters.



DomKen -> RE: Taliban supporter in U.S.: 'Moral Equivalent of Founding Fathers' (4/16/2012 12:53:29 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam

Don't forget Mullah Omar who was one of St Ronnie's pet Russkie fighters.

Mullah Omar is a fiction of the ISI.

His hieght, weight, and other features change between sightings. This includes on which eye he wears a patch.



Moonhead -> RE: Taliban supporter in U.S.: 'Moral Equivalent of Founding Fathers' (4/16/2012 12:57:44 PM)

The independent schools inspectorate?
I didn't think counter terrorism was part of their bag. Obviously state schools have got a lot rougher since I finished my a levels...



Hillwilliam -> RE: Taliban supporter in U.S.: 'Moral Equivalent of Founding Fathers' (4/16/2012 1:00:08 PM)

http://www.nctc.gov/site/profiles/mullah_omar.html

Tell that to the CIA and National Counterterrorism Center.



FatDomDaddy -> RE: Taliban supporter in U.S.: 'Moral Equivalent of Founding Fathers' (4/16/2012 1:45:39 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

[image]http://www.legitgov.org/graphics/reagan_taliban_1985.jpg[/image]

NEVER NEGOTIATE, right?

[:D]



OK... straight question because I'd like to know for my own edification.

I am not going to assume you just put this up because its kinda of a funny "gotcha" internet picture, which in all honesty, it could be (and if so, it would be funny.) But did you research it in any way? Can you actually identify any of the Afghan men and can you source where they are now members of the Taliban?



mnottertail -> RE: Taliban supporter in U.S.: 'Moral Equivalent of Founding Fathers' (4/16/2012 1:56:31 PM)

The video of reagan doing it and saying it is out there.   Can you identify the men and prove that none of these muhadjeen were translated to taliban proving Reagan a fucking idiot repeatedly?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zo17biJzRtc

There have been out here many times hysterical accusations presented as fact with far more tenuous cause and effect.

However, the Muhadjeen leaders decide to up and quit because they renamed it 'taliban'?

Yup, fuck it, Russians are gone, Americans are in, get a whole new set of generals in here?

see that all the time. 



DomKen -> RE: Taliban supporter in U.S.: 'Moral Equivalent of Founding Fathers' (4/16/2012 2:07:45 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam

http://www.nctc.gov/site/profiles/mullah_omar.html

Tell that to the CIA and National Counterterrorism Center.

Don't know bout the NCTC but the CIA were the ones to first point out the fact that the Taliban kept trotting out different people as Omar.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/afghanistan/1366159/Who-is-the-real-Mullah-Omar.html



Anaxagoras -> RE: Taliban supporter in U.S.: 'Moral Equivalent of Founding Fathers' (4/16/2012 2:34:21 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead
After all, if you're setting up an islamicists terrorist movement and there's a few of the pashtun islamicist terrorists who drove the soviets out of the country still knocking about, you're going to want them inside your tent pissing out, aren't you?

Sorry, who are these "pashtun islamicist terrorists" you are speaking of who drove the Soviets out? The same people who were fighting the invasion force propping up a Soviet puppet government? BTW one of the defining characteristics of terrorism is hitting soft civilian targets. Only 100 Russian civilians were killed in the entire eight/nine year conflict.



mnottertail -> RE: Taliban supporter in U.S.: 'Moral Equivalent of Founding Fathers' (4/16/2012 2:44:19 PM)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charlie_Wilson_(Texas_politician)

This happened; our end.



Anaxagoras -> RE: Taliban supporter in U.S.: 'Moral Equivalent of Founding Fathers' (4/16/2012 3:03:38 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charlie_Wilson_(Texas_politician)

This happened; our end.

Yeah, saw the T. Hanks film about it. It treated the American assistance to Afghanistan as a good thing but was critical of the US not helping to rebuild Afghanistan after the Soviet pull-out.



mnottertail -> RE: Taliban supporter in U.S.: 'Moral Equivalent of Founding Fathers' (4/16/2012 3:04:46 PM)

It may have, but here we are, wasn't a good thing before, after or since.



Anaxagoras -> RE: Taliban supporter in U.S.: 'Moral Equivalent of Founding Fathers' (4/16/2012 3:14:30 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail
It may have, but here we are, wasn't a good thing before, after or since.

Wilson, Reagan et al didn't have a crystal ball. If we look at the situation at the time with the Soviets fighting an especially dirty war by systematically putting down the civilian population then the decision of the US to help was a good thing if just taken in isolation. Did the defeat of the Soviet Union encourage Islamist terrorism? Possibly but the Soviet Union was beginning to crumble anyway, and a few more years in there would have brutalised the population more, and still led to an eventual civil war leading to the death of a few hundred thousand. Either way things wouldn't be pretty and perhaps would lead to a fair bit of radicalisation...



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