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Taking an afternoon off for the Marathon Thought I'd sa... - 4/16/2012 4:31:35 PM   
SternSkipper


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Status: offline 		Bring you up to date on the latest suppressed news out of Boston... This one I witnessed with my own two baby blues... Yesterday my son and I were headed up to meet the Tax Dodgers (An Occupy theater group who appear in fairly convincing old style Natl league costume) Anyway, they were at Fenway outside the site of today's Mitt Romney event rehearsing their skits. I decided to hop off the T at Park Station and take the kiddo on the Swan Boats since it was basically their first or second day of the season, it's fun, and loaded with Soccer Moms.
As we came out we could see a bunch up on a stage with all kinds of "Tea Party Patriots" signs and a bunch that were a WHOLE LOT LESS SAVORY. There was a guy standing up on something like a pile of coolers or something who had a confederate flag menacing a group of people across from him as if it was a spear. There was also a group of counter-protesters basically lined up 2 - deep about 40 -50 feet from the edge of the Tea Party Crowd. I at first thought they were occupy folks till I had a feel for the scope of their signs. They were apparently an ad-hoc LGBT group there to stand up for their side. And from the demeanor of the speaker up on stage (he was using words like "Faggots" a lot more than ya see these days... well ...ANYWHERE.
Turns out these guys were major fringe elements of the Tea Party, but dues payin teabaggers none the less. And during the brief portion of the festivities (I mean, the language was a little foul for my thirteen year old), the woman wearing the flag came over to the LBGTs and was really mouthy and was actually getting kind of physically too close to some of the young ladies in that group. Still nobody did much more than tell her to get lost. Then, and I was distracted because they were introducing a guy named Scott Lively (who I remembered had some kind of negative connotation, but have to be candid and tell ya I didn't really figure out what the connection was till this afternoon.. I won't spoil the surprise, but teabaggers not in the know may want to chug a handful of n baby aspirin just in case)...
So anyway, in the moment I was distracted the guy sitting on the park bench next to ours commented that the woman in the flag had pushed and swung to slap one of the girls but missed. This tall young man wearing a bandana started shouting at this black policeman to "do your job and arrest that bitch". The cop got up in this cop's face and started yelling.
Now at that point the crowd kind of clumped around the woman in the flag who was running around calling anybody she could make eye contact with a "faggot". But we could no longer see the cop and the young man. I will say that before the crowd gathered round, the kid was just holding a bright pink wig and really hadn't been very noticeable. And since more cops started showing up and my son and I were only about 100 feet away, I decided it was time to back way off. The sce3ne got louder and louder and we made our way to down to Charles street and crossed over to the Swan Boat side of the park.
Within a short time, the whole crowd was gone and the cops were standing around looking pissed (standing with folded arms pointing at the ground to and Tea Partiers running around picking up styrofoam cups and crap like that... they SURE AS HELL DIDN'T LOOK AS TOUGH AS THEY DID WHEN THEY WERE SHOUTING EPITHETS AT THE OTHER CROWD ... pussies maybe? 8-) ).
So we hit the swan boats, skip fenway and go home. NO NEWS AT 11?????????? Come on... this was as big a deal confrontation-wise I have seen since the Occupy raid of early October last year. But go to face book and it's literally gone wild... all kinds of info, but all a good bit short of reality.
Today, I found a number of things ,... and what the Daily KOS printed even looked extraordinary to me I mean, as a a proud liberal I would think this is simply too good to be true. I mean they (Tea Party) staged an 'Anti-Gay' rally and then have a 'star speaker' to be fair and balanced who happens to be the pro-gay governor of new mexico (who thankfully, along with others pulled out)
And if it weren't Christmas enough, Daily KOS links you within the article to the Mass Resistance Group, which is basically the name Red Mass goes under when they are going to cause trouble.
So anyway, I got to see the Tea Party at what I can only hope is THEIR VERY WORST.





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RE: Taking an afternoon off for the Marathon Thought I'... - 4/16/2012 4:34:56 PM   
SternSkipper


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Status: offline 		And just in case there's some question as to what's right and wrong with choking suspects....

http://youtu.be/r-_6aY-afS0

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RE: Taking an afternoon off for the Marathon Thought I'... - 4/16/2012 4:38:24 PM   
kalikshama


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Status: offline 		I heard about the choking on the way home but appreciate your first hand account :)

http://southend.patch.com/articles/photos-of-police-officer-choking-counter-protester-create-controversy

A controversial photo showing a Boston police officer with his hand on the neck of a protester, taken at Sunday’s Massachusetts Tea Party Coalition "Tax Day Rally" on Boston Common, has sparked outrage and caused some to again question the tactics employed by police at events such as this.

Photographer Paul Weiskel, a junior at UMass Boston, snapped the controversial photographs while on the scene to document the Tea Party rally, and he says it is his belief police acted inappropriately during the action.

While he was photographing a counter-protest, which he says was largely LGBT activists protesting the “homophobic,” anti-gay speakers included in the event by the Tea Party, he turned around to see a uniformed Boston Police officer with his hands around the neck of a counter-protester, who did not appear to be resisting or demonstrating any other signs of belligerence.

“I turned around and saw the cop had the guy by the neck,” said Weiskel during a telephone interview, “I don’t know exactly what happened [to provoke the incident]... The cop had the kid by the neck, and then he pushes him and pushes another photographer ...”

According to a report in the Boston Occupier, Occupy Boston’s official free publication, the man in the photo is a counter-protester who was physically assaulted by a Tea Party supporter. During the ensuing exchange, the counter-protester was shoved out of the way by the officer in the photo, who then appeared to aggressively grab the man by the neck.

Weiskel was able to snap multiple shots that detail the actions of the officer, but, he said, when police saw him taking photos their attention immediately turned his way.

According to Weiskel, the officer approached him and “took two swipes at my camera, knocking it out of my hands.”

The UMass Boston student said it appeared police were only concerned with his camera, and he did nothing to provoke them other than taking pictures.

“He had no grounds for coming at me,” Weiskel said. “I was nowhere near the incident. He didn’t go after me, he went after my camera.”

When asked if he felt the actions of Boston Police were overly aggressive and unwarranted he answered unwaveringly in the affirmative.

A total of three arrests were made during the Tea Party’s Tax Day Rally, and none of the people photographed by Weiskel were arrested.

Tensions at the rally flared due to the inclusion of anti-gay speakers Scott Lively, of anti-LGBT group Abiding Truth and Brian Camenker of similar group Mass Resistance. Former presidential candidate Rick Santorum was also scheduled to speak at the event, but ended up being a no-show.

According to the Boston Occupier, the rally of roughly 150 people turned on the counter-protesters with chants of “Get A Job!” to counter the refrain of “Racist, Sexist Anti-Gay, Tea Party Go Away!”

Perhaps the most damning photographs, apart from those depicting a police officer with his hands on a man’s neck, are of the same officer allegedly attempting to take Weiskel’s camera away. A clear violation of a recent court ruling that allows photographers to take picture of police officers in public.

The Boston Police Department responded to the photo flap this morning.

“The department will need an appropriate amount of time to properly determine the context of the photo and what took place before and after,” Boston police spokeswoman Elaine Driscoll told the Boston Globe in an e-mail this morning.

She characterized the counter-protesters as an “unruly” and “combative” group who were trying to disrupt a permitted protest.

“The aggressive nature of these individuals required officers to call for numerous additional units to respond,” Driscoll said. “As we always do after a day of aggressive protests, the department will review all of the activity that took place during the course of the day including the photos that have surfaced from the event.”

The photos were posted to the picture sharing website Flickr, and captured the moments when counter-protesters rushed the stage at the Tea Party sanctioned event.

Weiskel said he does not personally know the man in the photos, and plans to contact the ACLU regarding the officer's conduct.

We here at Patch want to know what you think about the actions of the Boston Police in this matter. Click here to take our poll and let us know!

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RE: Taking an afternoon off for the Marathon Thought I'... - 4/16/2012 4:54:40 PM   
JstAnotherSub


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Status: offline 		http://southend.patch.com/articles/photos-aggressive-police-tactics-on-boston-common#photo-9603520

The protester was not arrested.

As much as I hate to admit it, to my self especially, I feel like these folks are going out, looking for confrontation, then bitching when they find it.

This mode of protest is not working, and, if they are too dumb to figure that out, they are gonna keep getting the same results that this article shows.

:::::dons flame retardant suit and waits::::



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RE: Taking an afternoon off for the Marathon Thought I'... - 4/16/2012 5:07:22 PM   
SternSkipper


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quote:

The protester was not arrested.

As much as I hate to admit it, to my self especially, I feel like these folks are going out, looking for confrontation, then bitching when they find it.

This mode of protest is not working, and, if they are too dumb to figure that out, they are gonna keep getting the same results that this article shows.


I hate to Bum ya out dude, but the LGBT community, pretty much around the country, has been doing counter protests like this for years. It's how they do it. And Oh look... they keep knocking off a new gay marriage or civil union state every couple of months.
Not working.
You don't need a flame proof suit. You probably could do with a better understanding of their political behavior... I mean, if you even care to. I hear it's not mandatory.


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RE: Taking an afternoon off for the Marathon Thought I'... - 4/16/2012 5:11:55 PM   
JstAnotherSub


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Status: offline 		Well, chickie, thanks for the reply.

I was not clear in my post, I mean the entire Occupy thing is a failure, not the LGBT counter protest. Sorry to not have been clear.

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RE: Taking an afternoon off for the Marathon Thought I'... - 4/16/2012 5:25:17 PM   
SternSkipper


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Status: offline 		Watching the news tonight they painted the vaguest BS story in which they went down "There Two Sides Lane", yet could offer NOTHING short of vague assertions that "well since the Occupy Movement and all these protests started, with all the amateur camera work, it's very difficult to tell what's really happening".
Please, allow me to educate the audience a bit. Since the first march out of Dewey Square into the financial district late last September, the Boston PD has had at EVERY SINGLE public assembly of humans that was in any way political, 1 - 2 Officers armed with solid state video cameras trained not on the speakers, but rather, at the crowd. And believe me they are good videographers. And at any time their behavior is called into question, out comes the exonerative or at least confusing enough to cloud accusations video. The exception being those cases where they are so dead wrong, that they know it will make their position look worse. I saw one of those video cops there yesterday and they were working the crowd with their usual thoroughness. But nope... no video.
I saw a guy when we were headed back up through the common after everyone cleared and he and his friends (they were maybe late teens) gathered round a small hand held and there was a lot of excited commentary. And I wouldn't be surprised if that was footage of the event and it surfaced before long. But it would be a reach for me to say his video was even OF the event, since we never got close enough to see what they were going on about. Fact is though. The cops have been Johnny on the spot when they could use the video to get a cop off the hook. That apparently ain't the case this time.


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RE: Taking an afternoon off for the Marathon Thought I'... - 4/16/2012 6:02:03 PM   
SternSkipper


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quote:

Well, chickie, thanks for the reply.

I was not clear in my post, I mean the entire Occupy thing is a failure, not the LGBT counter protest. Sorry to not have been clear.


Hahahahaha ... The Occupy movement wasn't present AT ALL, but I would have to say you're mistaken. Right now for instance in Massachusetts they are the ONLY people standing between the state wide mass transportation system MBTA and a 25 - 35% increase in fairs, decreased service on nights and weekends (close to 30% of the greater Boston area is reliant on those services), and decreased services for the handicapped. Because of "Camp Charlie" the issue is at least going to the statehouse for debate. Camp Charlie has gone on for almost three weeks and last week the State Police invoked that new anti-protest trespass law, to get the protesters off the statehouse steps, in preparation for a visit by the head of state of Brazil. And THINGS ARE SO "WORKING" here, the state police were told by the Governor's office to "be cordial, and assure the protesters they could return to their post at 5:30pm the following day.
The Boston cops are actually both a little more respectful of the Occupy folks this year and it's for two reasons. 1) They really DON'T "go looking for trouble" as many people say from their couches. And 2)N on-violence and their performance in service to the community over the winter has shown them to be the exact opposite.
In March I was at a foreclosure sale which we effectively ended (and no, not postponed... it ended... The loan renegotiation which had been ignored, was suddenly scheduled on a fast track and the family makes their first restructured mortgage payment May 1st). But anyway, the constables hate our guts cause they can't get as many of the big paying henchman work completed as they used to. And on that particular day, the constable was yelling at Boston Cops telling them to arrest us. And he merely asked the owner if we were "invited guests" and told the constable "Hey, the law says nothing about the home owner having a witness or two or fifty. And they aren't preventing you from walking onto the property. I see no issue here. .....". To me, that's a better "mission accomplished" than Dubyah was ever able to give himself credit for.
Call it whatever you want. And sorry to have to interject actual facts.
And by the way, when you're not called names, it's common courtesy for you not to do the same. It certainly didn't add anything to your presentation, except a degree of incredulity.



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RE: Taking an afternoon off for the Marathon Thought I'... - 4/16/2012 6:06:54 PM   
JstAnotherSub


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Status: offline 		I only have knowledge of things here in Atlanta, from a few friends who started out in support of the Occupy movement, and became disgusted with the actions of the ones who got all the press, so, that, and news reports, are what I base my opinion that it is a failure on. I stand by that opinion.

As for name calling, you called me dude, I called you chickie. I aint a dude, so, technically, you started it.

;o)

damn flying f's!

< Message edited by JstAnotherSub -- 4/16/2012 6:07:25 PM >

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RE: Taking an afternoon off for the Marathon Thought I'... - 4/16/2012 6:21:14 PM   
kdsub


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Status: offline 		One...he is not squeezing...two his hand is not around the larynx it is to the subjects left side. Three the subject is not grimacing so no pressure is being applied.

Maybe

Butch

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RE: Taking an afternoon off for the Marathon Thought I'... - 4/16/2012 6:38:14 PM   
Hillwilliam


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Status: offline 		I've seen much worse than the picture. Pretty terrible technique but that is typical.

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RE: Taking an afternoon off for the Marathon Thought I'... - 4/16/2012 6:38:42 PM   
SternSkipper


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quote:

As for name calling, you called me dude, I called you chickie. I aint a dude, so, technically, you started it.

;o)


My apologies ... I forgot you were a woman. I'll do better to remember. As for Occupy Atlanta... I'm not sure how 'for real' they were in the first place. I joined a video chat one night through LiveStream trying to get some basic information and was accosted by a lunatic shouting biblical quotes into the camera.... I know they were generally uncommunicative and liked to fire up college kids a little too much.
But that's really all I know.


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RE: Taking an afternoon off for the Marathon Thought I'... - 4/16/2012 6:52:48 PM   
SternSkipper


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quote:

One...he is not squeezing...two his hand is not around the larynx it is to the subjects left side. Three the subject is not grimacing so no pressure is being applied.
Maybe


Butch, I'm gonna presume you might very well be an expert at getting choked. But it is HARDLY a lens through which you can diagnose the world. I just had a chat with an attorney in Boston who says she was on the statehouse steps with Camp Charlie (who had taken a vote not to get involved as they suspected it could possibly become a riot situation)
Deb says she talked to that kid and several others who'd been manhandled and not arrested. She also said the kid has marks on his neck and was scared. Deb is a reliable witness and is currently volunteering at the state house as a liaison between Camp Charlie and the legislature. She also reflected that she was impressed yet again at the Occupy folks and their ability to pick their battles.
I have to say though I am amazed that you can see where the cop's thumb is. Cause it sure looks like it's pushing that bandana up under his chin, which would mean your eyesight is so precise it can see a "comfort zone" protecting his larynx. You will just never cease to amaze me. Whether it's crowd counting, expertise on the art of choking, or even your creative use of the San Jose Mercury.

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RE: Taking an afternoon off for the Marathon Thought I'... - 4/16/2012 7:17:37 PM   
SternSkipper


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A little more ... Plus... The greater boston tea party coalition's disclaimer of the event. GREAT EXCEPT THEY KNOW ALL ABOUT THIS BUNCH OF KOOKS, NEVER SAID A WORD BEFOREHAND, AND HAVE HAD LIVELY AND OTHERS INVOLVED IN THE REALLY SPEAK AT THEIR RED MASS ENGAGEMENTS... FFFFFFFFFFFFAil!

http://bostonoccupier.com/2012/04/16/counter-protest-against-tea-party-rally/


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RE: Taking an afternoon off for the Marathon Thought I'... - 4/16/2012 8:54:02 PM   
kdsub


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Status: offline 		I had that technique applied to me once...I was a boot in the Corps. I forgot to say sir aye aye sir on my first night and the DI closed his hand around my larynx and lifted me against a wall... Believe me it is a shock and I could not breath and had bruises on my throat. So if it was done to him there would be proof.

Butch

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RE: Taking an afternoon off for the Marathon Thought I'... - 4/16/2012 9:41:43 PM   
SternSkipper


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quote:

Believe me it is a shock and I could not breath and had bruises on my throat. So if it was done to him there would be proof.


Yeah, and I got the night stick pulled back against larynx at the Dead at the Stanley Theater when Tom Ridge (way before HSA) told his state troopers to go shut those hippies down.
But what part of this statement didn't you see:

"Deb says she talked to that kid and several others who'd been manhandled and not arrested. She also said the kid has marks on his neck and was scared."

The kid obviously wasn't lifted off the ground or anything close. Lemme clue you in on something though... the police aren't supposed to use the 'technique' mas you call it. It's not called police brutality in the armed forces cause they aren't cops and you are a civilian. Please don't even try to apply military standards of treatment to civilians, because it's just not valid. I will be happy to ping my brother on the subject and ask if choking is a matter of degree with regard to conduct of officers when interacting with the public.
My guess is that if you are yelling at a cop to arrest someone you've just seen assaulting another, there is no amount of choking that is appropriate. But if you like, I'll happily ask him... and believe me, his politics are a lot more like yours than mine. He just won't ever bend the rules with regard to his practice, so I can trust what he says implicitly as being expert in nature.


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RE: Taking an afternoon off for the Marathon Thought I'... - 4/17/2012 6:41:07 AM   
thishereboi


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quote:

ORIGINAL: JstAnotherSub

Well, chickie, thanks for the reply.

I was not clear in my post, I mean the entire Occupy thing is a failure, not the LGBT counter protest. Sorry to not have been clear.



I don't see how it was a failure. They want to be painted as victims. Seems like a successful day. The only thing that would have made them happier is if the guy had gotten some serious injuries or been arrested.

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RE: Taking an afternoon off for the Marathon Thought I'... - 4/17/2012 5:03:31 PM   
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