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RE: President Obama says "The private sector is do... - 6/10/2012 8:03:09 PM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		Nope, no editing at all... yet not part of his speech either.

However, as to the smirk you contend was present.... 2 seconds isnt enough time to say what he said and deliver a smirk. I am thinking you saw what you wanted to see there.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to TheHeretic)
Profile   Post #: 41
RE: President Obama says "The private sector is do... - 6/10/2012 8:17:51 PM   
TheHeretic


Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline 		Tazzy was kind enough to post the full comment, Muse. Since the President came back out later to say the economy was not doing fine after all, there is no point seeking an argument there.

The President then went on to argue that our attention needed to be elsewhere, and I explained what was wrong with that premise to Owner59.

Make sense now?

(in reply to Musicmystery)
Profile   Post #: 42
RE: President Obama says "The private sector is do... - 6/10/2012 8:30:19 PM   
TheHeretic


Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

Nope, no editing at all... yet not part of his speech either.

However, as to the smirk you contend was present.... 2 seconds isnt enough time to say what he said and deliver a smirk. I am thinking you saw what you wanted to see there.



What wasn't part of his speech, Tazzy? Was he off teleprompter or something? That isn't a good excuse.

It's quite possible for a human to simultaneously have a little expression on their face, and speak. You can say I'm seeing something I want to see, and I can say that you are looking through the wrong kinds of eyes. The video is there for people to see what they will. Were you expecting a big pantomime, or something?

(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 43
RE: President Obama says "The private sector is do... - 6/10/2012 8:35:52 PM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline
quote:

Keep in mind that the private sector has been hiring at a solid pace over the last 27 months. But one of the biggest weaknesses has been state and local governments, which have laid off 450,000 Americans. These are teachers and cops and firefighters. Congress should pass a bill putting them back to work right now, giving help to the states so that those layoffs are not occurring.


quote:

And the most important thing I think we can do is make sure that we continue to have a strong, robust recovery. So the steps that I've outlined are the ones that are needed. We've got a couple of sectors in our economy that are still weak. Overall, the private sector has been doing a good job creating jobs. We've seen record profits in the corporate sector.



quote:

THE PRESIDENT: The truth of the matter is that, as I said, we’ve created 4.3 million jobs over the last 27 months, over 800,000 just this year alone. The private sector is doing fine. Where we’re seeing weaknesses in our economy have to do with state and local government -- oftentimes, cuts initiated by governors or mayors who are not getting the kind of help that they have in the past from the federal government and who don’t have the same kind of flexibility as the federal government in dealing with fewer revenues coming in.



Compared to the public sector, the private sector is doing a damn fine job.

(CBS News) The political debate over the economy and the role of the private and public sectors continued Sunday on "Face the Nation." Maryland Governor Martin O'Malley said public sector job loss "puts a drag on the economy."

O'Malley came to the president's defense after Mr. Obama said Friday that the private sector is "doing fine." He latter clarified his remarks saying that it is "absolutely clear that the economy is not doing fine," saying that compared to the public sector - which continues to lose jobs - the private sector is increasing jobs.

O'Malley expanded on the president's clarification, telling host Bob Schieffer, "No one can deny that we've had 27 months in a row of private sector job growth. Fact of the matter is, that the public sector continues to be a drag on the economy, because in 16 of the last 18 months we've had public sector job losses."

He added: "It's as if we take two or three steps forward and one or two steps back. For every three jobs created by the private sector we eliminate a public sector job - teachers, firefighters, police - and that puts a drag on the economy.

"I think that most economists would agree with the president that the private sector is doing better and the public sector is doing worse," O'Malley said.


http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-3460_162-57450069/dem-gov.-public-sector-job-losses-are-dragging-economy/


_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to TheHeretic)
Profile   Post #: 44
RE: President Obama says "The private sector is do... - 6/10/2012 8:43:58 PM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic


quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

Nope, no editing at all... yet not part of his speech either.

However, as to the smirk you contend was present.... 2 seconds isnt enough time to say what he said and deliver a smirk. I am thinking you saw what you wanted to see there.



What wasn't part of his speech, Tazzy? Was he off teleprompter or something? That isn't a good excuse.

It's quite possible for a human to simultaneously have a little expression on their face, and speak. You can say I'm seeing something I want to see, and I can say that you are looking through the wrong kinds of eyes. The video is there for people to see what they will. Were you expecting a big pantomime, or something?


Not at all. The video cut off almost immediately after his words. His expression is not clear. 2 seconds of video isnt enough to declare what you might consider a smirk, there wasnt even a clear follow through. Sorry, doesnt pass the smell test with me. But thats just my opinion

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to TheHeretic)
Profile   Post #: 45
RE: President Obama says "The private sector is do... - 6/10/2012 9:02:44 PM   
TheHeretic


Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline 		I caught that show this morning, Tazzy, on a little getaway. It sparked a nice political argument with family, while we drank our coffee, and then we all went out for breakfast in an uncrowded restaurant, then shopping for bargains at a nearly deserted street fair.

The recovery is weak, and anemic at best. Lurching, and insecure, more realistically. When we see that rolling forward again, at least part of the other will self-correct. Then we deal with the pension bombs, as best we can.

(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 46
RE: President Obama says "The private sector is do... - 6/10/2012 9:03:49 PM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		I agree the recovery is weak.... the question people should be asking is why.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to TheHeretic)
Profile   Post #: 47
RE: President Obama says "The private sector is do... - 6/10/2012 9:04:59 PM   
Musicmystery


Posts: 30259
Joined: 3/14/2005
Status: offline 		You're not gonna grow your way out of this one. Structural realities and the size of the problem are too great.

Wishful thinking. This will take the actual planning that was absent when the pension deals were signed.

(in reply to TheHeretic)
Profile   Post #: 48
RE: President Obama says "The private sector is do... - 6/10/2012 9:19:13 PM   
TheHeretic


Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

I agree the recovery is weak.... the question people should be asking is why.



I'll take, "lousy leadership," for $1600, Alex.

(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 49
RE: President Obama says "The private sector is do... - 6/10/2012 9:21:38 PM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		The same leadership that brought unemployment numbers down from 17.2 to 14.8?

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to TheHeretic)
Profile   Post #: 50
RE: President Obama says "The private sector is do... - 6/10/2012 9:21:55 PM   
TheHeretic


Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

You're not gonna grow your way out of this one. Structural realities and the size of the problem are too great.

Wishful thinking. This will take the actual planning that was absent when the pension deals were signed.



Are you missing the places in my posts where I indicate that the long-term issues need to be addressed as well, Muse, and saying that I'm only talking about one aspect of the problem here?

(in reply to Musicmystery)
Profile   Post #: 51
RE: President Obama says "The private sector is do... - 6/11/2012 6:59:29 AM   
Musicmystery


Posts: 30259
Joined: 3/14/2005
Status: offline 		You also said after growing out the current situation.

That isn't going to happen.

(in reply to TheHeretic)
Profile   Post #: 52
RE: President Obama says "The private sector is do... - 6/11/2012 6:00:19 PM   
TheHeretic


Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

You also said after growing out the current situation.

That isn't going to happen.



Funny thing, Muse. You offered the perfect reply to this, over on your little, "look at me, and how sensible I can pretend to be," thread.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery
I. Q - "So what you're saying is __________"
A - Fuck you. Read my actual position, instead of making one up.

(in reply to Musicmystery)
Profile   Post #: 53
RE: President Obama says "The private sector is do... - 6/11/2012 7:58:43 PM   
Owner59


Posts: 17033
Joined: 3/14/2006
From: Dirty Jersey
Status: offline 		 
How about obstruction and sabotage.....like the j-boner lowered credit rating debacle for $1800.....





And...um..ehem......

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/11/19/opinion/19romney.html

"IF General Motors, Ford and Chrysler get the bailout that their chief executives asked for yesterday, you can kiss the American automotive industry goodbye. It won’t go overnight, but its demise will be virtually guaranteed.

Without that bailout, Detroit will need to drastically restructure itself. With it, the automakers will stay the course — the suicidal course of declining market shares, insurmountable labor and retiree burdens, technology atrophy, product inferiority and never-ending job losses. Detroit needs a turnaround, not a check."


Man....how fucking wrong can one be?

And this guy wants to be our president?!!



< Message edited by Owner59 -- 6/11/2012 8:00:45 PM >

_____________________________

"As for our common defense, we reject as false the choice between our safety and our ideals"

President Obama

(in reply to TheHeretic)
Profile   Post #: 54
RE: President Obama says "The private sector is do... - 6/11/2012 8:01:49 PM   
Musicmystery


Posts: 30259
Joined: 3/14/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic


quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

You also said after growing out the current situation.

That isn't going to happen.



Funny thing, Muse. You offered the perfect reply to this, over on your little, "look at me, and how sensible I can pretend to be," thread.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery
I. Q - "So what you're saying is __________"
A - Fuck you. Read my actual position, instead of making one up.


Not at all. You were specific about it. Go re-read your post.

(in reply to TheHeretic)
Profile   Post #: 55
RE: President Obama says "The private sector is do... - 6/11/2012 8:28:28 PM   
TheHeretic


Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery
Not at all. You were specific about it. Go re-read your post.



Yes, Muse, I was quite specific about the drop in revenue being but one piece of the problem.

I said it this:

quote:

A portion of problems in the public sector are a direct reflection of that. Bad policy, and bad deals, such as Governor Walker has been dealing with in Wisconsin are another bit, but for this, let's set that aside.


And I said this:

quote:

The recovery is weak, and anemic at best. Lurching, and insecure, more realistically. When we see that rolling forward again, at least part of the other will self-correct. Then we deal with the pension bombs, as best we can.


And I even said this:

quote:

Are you missing the places in my posts where I indicate that the long-term issues need to be addressed as well, Muse, and saying that I'm only talking about one aspect of the problem here?



Yep. Some locations are too far gone, already. Read up on what happened with the city government in Bell, California, before you expect me to get too worried about the dumbasses at the leading edge. Parts of what is going to need to happen are flat going to suck, and the basket cases that go bankrupt will serve as an example to be avoided.

More money is more money, any way you slice it.


(in reply to Musicmystery)
Profile   Post #: 56
RE: President Obama says "The private sector is do... - 6/11/2012 8:33:33 PM   
Musicmystery


Posts: 30259
Joined: 3/14/2005
Status: offline
quote:

When we see that rolling forward again, at least part of the other will self-correct. Then we deal with the pension bombs, as best we can.


This is not worth the time we're spending on it.

The above is where you're waiting for the economy to improve first, then deal with structural matters.

It's got to be the other way around--especially in the mess that is California.

If you disagree, fine.

(in reply to TheHeretic)
Profile   Post #: 57
RE: President Obama says "The private sector is do... - 6/11/2012 8:40:26 PM   
TheHeretic


Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

This is not worth the time we're spending on it.




Complete agreement at last.

Gonna let me have a go at converting you on marijuana policy, now?

(in reply to Musicmystery)
Profile   Post #: 58
RE: President Obama says "The private sector is do... - 6/12/2012 5:41:34 AM   
vincentML


Posts: 9980
Joined: 10/31/2009
Status: offline 		~FR~

Public sector jobs are a key component to the nation’s overall jobs picture, and while previous recessions experienced a percentage growth in public sector employment once the economy started to turn around, the same cannot be said this time around. America has added nearly 3 million private-sector jobs since the recovery started to gain its footing in June of 2009; however, here’s a notable point: public-sector jobs (the combined employment in federal, state, and local governments) are down by 584,000. According to analysis from the Economic Policy Institute, “The current recovery (out of the last 4) is the only one that has seen public-sector losses over its first 31 months.”

Reportedly the previous three recoveries saw an average of 2.8 percent growth in the public sector while in the most recent recession public-sector employment shrunk by 2.5 percent. If the nation had benefited from the type of public sector growth experienced after previous recessions, then it is estimated the nation would currently have an extra 1.2 million jobs. That being said, the pace at which the public-sector has lost jobs has begun to slow.

Business Insider points out the following tidbit: “Which president’s economic recovery benefited most from an increasing number of government jobs? Oddly enough, it was President Ronald Reagan, who successfully ran for re-election in 1984 by proclaiming it was “morning in America.” Reagan, running in a year when unemployment fell over a percentage point to 7.5 percent, is generally (and incorrectly) remembered as the first conservative president to dramatically shrink the size and role of government.”

Article linked here

(in reply to TheHeretic)
Profile   Post #: 59
RE: President Obama says "The private sector is do... - 6/12/2012 5:49:48 AM   
Musicmystery


Posts: 30259
Joined: 3/14/2005
Status: offline
quote:

Gonna let me have a go at converting you on marijuana policy, now?


That's fine. It's not a hard position. It's just that I've read so much complete bullshit about it by way of attempted justification. The conclusion precedes the argument, tainting the logic from the start.

Additionally, there are a lot of industrial changes we could/should look at; hempers pick just this one. On the face of it, again, conclusion assumed, justification built, and only on this aspect of industry. Corn is good for everything too--sugar, fuel--if you're in the corn lobby.

< Message edited by Musicmystery -- 6/12/2012 5:53:55 AM >

(in reply to TheHeretic)
Profile   Post #: 60
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