Plastic bag industry wages war against 12 year old (Full Version)

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erieangel -> Plastic bag industry wages war against 12 year old (6/19/2012 6:04:31 PM)

Help 12 year old Abby convince her governor to veto a bill that would prevent towns like her own from banning plastic bags and reducing plastic litter.

http://www.change.org/petitions/governor-quinn-don-t-let-big-plastic-bully-me#




LookieNoNookie -> RE: Plastic bag industry wages war against 12 year old (6/19/2012 6:13:03 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: erieangel

Help 12 year old Abby convince her governor to veto a bill that would prevent towns like her own from banning plastic bags and reducing plastic litter.

http://www.change.org/petitions/governor-quinn-don-t-let-big-plastic-bully-me#


It's about damn time someone explained the facts of life to these kids.

Plastic is the future. The Great Pacific Garbage Patch proves that!




kalikshama -> RE: Plastic bag industry wages war against 12 year old (6/19/2012 6:26:55 PM)

Signed!

http://environment.about.com/od/reducingwaste/a/whole_foods.htm

The Whole Foods Market chain plans to stop using plastic bags in time for Earth Day 2008 (April 22). In place of plastic bags, Whole Foods customers will carry their groceries home in either recycled paper bags or reusable bags.

Whole Foods officials estimate the chain currently distributes 150 million plastic bags annually through its 270 stores.

Whole Foods Joins Other Businesses and Governments That Ban Plastic Bags

The new Whole Foods policy brings the store in line with a growing trend, as many governments and retailers ban plastic bags or discourage their due to environmental concerns. Nations and municipalities from China to San Francisco have banned certain types of plastic bags while others are requiring retailers to offer plastic bag recycling.

Although Whole Foods has been interested in ending the use of plastic bags for some time, store officials were never sure how to make such a policy work. When San Francisco banned plastic bags in 2007, it provided a test case for Whole Foods.

After the company stopped using plastic bags in its San Francisco stores, the use of paper bags increased only 10 percent. Clearly, most Whole Foods customers switched to reusable bags instead.

The company conducted additional tests in Toronto and Austin, and then decided to extend the ban on plastic bags to all Whole Foods stores.

Plastic Bags are Commonplace—and Damaging to the Environment

Although a relatively new phenomenon in consumer convenience, plastic bags have become a standard solution for everything from shopping to food storage. Unfortunately, they also have become an environmental scourge. Here’s why:

Plastic bags that end up in landfills may take up to 1,000 years to break down. And plastic bags aren’t biodegradable. They actually go through a process called photodegradation—breaking down into smaller and smaller toxic particles that contaminate both soil and water, and end up entering the food chain when animals accidentally ingest them.

Plastic bags are made from petroleum. Producing plastic bags consumes millions of gallons of oil that could be used for fuel and heating.

According to the Environmental Protection Agency, more than 380 billion plastic bags are used in the United States every year and only about 1 percent to 3 percent are ever recycled.

Worldwide, people use nearly 1 trillion plastic bags every year. According to various estimates, Taiwan consumes 20 billion plastic bags annually (900 per person), Japan consumes 300 billion bags each year (300 per person), and Australia consumes 6.9 billion plastic bags annually (326 per person).

Plastic bags are so lightweight that they are easily blown into trees, roads and waterways. Plastic litter is now found everywhere on the planet—even in remote places such as Antarctica. In the Pacific Ocean, there is a floating morass of plastic garbage that is twice the size of Texas and growing daily.

Hundreds of thousands of whales, dolphins, sea turtles and other marine mammals die every year after eating discarded plastic bags they mistake for food.




kalikshama -> RE: Plastic bag industry wages war against 12 year old (6/19/2012 6:28:29 PM)

Wow, CHINA is more progressive:

China Bans Production, Sale and Use of Plastic Bags

In a move that surprised many consumers and businesses, the Chinese government has banned the production, sale and use of thin plastic bags (those under 0.025 mm thick), and has forbidden supermarkets and shop owners from handing out free plastic bags to customers.

The new regulations will be in force beginning June 1, 2008, and companies that fail to comply could face heavy penalties, including fines and confiscation of goods and profits.

The Chinese people use up to 3 billion plastic bags daily, and China must refine 37 million barrels of crude oil every year to manufacture plastics used in packaging—including those plastic bags, according to reports by China Trade News and Reuters.

In a notice posted on the central government website, the State Council (China’s cabinet) said the crackdown on plastic bags was necessary because the production and use of the bags wastes valuable resources and creates a hug litter problem in China.

"Our country consumes huge amounts of plastic bags every year. While providing convenience to consumers, they have also caused serious pollution, and waste of energy and resources, because of excessive use and inadequate recycling," the notice said. "We should encourage people to return to carrying cloth bags, using baskets for their vegetables."

The State Council also urged finance officials in China to consider using their taxing authority to promote more effective plastics recycling.




erieangel -> RE: Plastic bag industry wages war against 12 year old (6/19/2012 7:20:26 PM)

Wow!! Didn't know China was going so progressive.

That's some good for the environment as a whole.




servantforuse -> RE: Plastic bag industry wages war against 12 year old (6/20/2012 5:06:10 AM)

We should our EPA over to China. That would solve two problems..




Aim2Plea -> RE: Plastic bag industry wages war against 12 year old (6/20/2012 5:14:33 AM)

I haven't used plastic bags unless I've had no choice for a couple of years now. Use re-usable bags.




servantforuse -> RE: Plastic bag industry wages war against 12 year old (6/20/2012 5:19:45 AM)

I always use paper to support the lumber industry in the United States. It is a renewable resource..




fucktoyprincess -> RE: Plastic bag industry wages war against 12 year old (6/20/2012 1:05:35 PM)

Well this so absurd on so many levels.

First of all, another example of how business is perfectly happy to have the government intervene when it protects business and profit. It's only when government intervenes to protect other types of rights that the right wingers get themselves worked up.

Second, wow, we are less environmentally conscious than the Chinese government. How bad does that make us look?

My favorite reusable shopping bag is the following, as it folds neatly into a very small and light thing that can be easily tossed into a handbag.

http://www.envirosax.com/




MasterSlaveLA -> RE: Plastic bag industry wages war against 12 year old (6/20/2012 2:18:32 PM)

Given parts of LA/California fairly recently jumped on the plastic bag "ban", it was a topic that had been kicked about.  As such, here are some FACTS to counter the MYTHS...

. . . . .

Proponents give three reasons for the bag ban. They claim it will reduce the amount of waste entering landfills, reduce litter on streets, and “help protect the environment.”

But banning free grocery bags will not achieve those lofty goals. 

First, banning free plastic grocery bags won’t reduce waste. California’s Statewide Waste Characterization Study [pdf] shows that “Plastic Grocery and Other Merchandise Bags” consistently make up just 0.3 percent of the waste stream in the state. That’s three-tenths of 1 percent. In comparison, organic waste such as food and yard clippings makes up 32 percent while construction debris comprises about 30 percent. The effect of eliminating free grocery bags on the amount of waste generated in the city would be insignificant.

Second, despite misleading claims from environmental groups and the L.A. Bureau of Sanitation, banning free plastic grocery bags won’t do much to reduce litter in the public commons. Litter studies from across the country demonstrate that, on average, plastic retail bags make up about 1 percent to 2 percent of all litter. 

Even that small amount of litter doesn’t decline when bans are enacted. In San Francisco, plastic bags comprised 0.6 percent of litter before the city banned plastic bags and 0.64 percent a year after the ban took effect [pdf, pg. 35]. Since plastic grocery bags make up less than 2 percent of roadside trash, banning them will affect neither the total amount of litter nor the cost of cleaning it up.

Third, banning free plastic grocery bags won’t reduce our consumption of foreign (or domestic) oil. L.A.’s Bureau of Sanitation claims [pdf] that “approximately 12 million barrels of oil go into the US supply of plastic bags.” But plastic bags made in the U.S. are not derived from oil; they’re made from a byproduct of domestic natural gas refinement. Manufacturing plastic grocery bags does not increase our need to import oil, and banning them in Los Angeles or anywhere else will not reduce US oil consumption.

Despite claims that plastics threaten our oceans and sea life, there is no evidence that free plastic grocery bags make up any significant portion of the plastic waste found on beaches or in the ocean. In fact, reports from environmental groups doing beach and ocean clean-ups show that plastic bags make up only about 2 percent of the debris.

Furthermore, reusable bags being touted as a “green” alternative carry their own environmental costs.  Unlike locally manufactured plastic bags, reusable woven bags are primarily produced in China and imported to the U.S. on cargo ships which burn millions of gallons of dirty low-grade fuel oil. Because they’re made of mixed materials, these reusable bags can’t be recycled and will eventually end up in landfills, unlike plastic grocery bags which are fully recyclable. 

Bags made of canvas have an even greater impact on the environment due to the natural resources required to grow cotton and manufacture bags. Frequently, reusable bags often carry more than just groceries. In a recent study by the University of Arizona, almost every bag sampled contained large amounts of bacteria including coliform, E. coli, and other opportunistic pathogens. The public is being instructed to wash these bags after each use, which, over time, will require huge amounts of energy and waste precious water. 

So if banning free plastic grocery bags won’t save the planet, what will it do? For one thing, it will lead to the loss of American jobs. More than 30,000 people in the U.S. are directly employed by the plastic bag manufacturing and recycling industry, and thousands more are indirectly employed. 

If passed, the L.A. bag ban could potentially lead to the loss of manufacturing jobs that support more than 1,000 families in the Los Angeles area alone, according to Pete Grande, CEO at Command Packaging, a recycler and producer of environmentally friendly plastic bags.

Source: http://reason.com/archives/2012/05/23/plastic-bag-ban-will-put-los-angeles-in





Musicmystery -> RE: Plastic bag industry wages war against 12 year old (6/20/2012 2:22:06 PM)

quote:

China must refine 37 million barrels of crude oil every year to manufacture plastics used in packaging—including those plastic bags, according to reports by China Trade News and Reuters.


This. China can see the writing on the wall, especially as it's the country with the fastest growing demand.




fucktoyprincess -> RE: Plastic bag industry wages war against 12 year old (6/20/2012 4:27:21 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterSlaveLA

Given parts of LA/California fairly recently jumped on the plastic bag "ban", it was a topic that had been kicked about.  As such, here are some FACTS to counter the MYTHS...

First, banning free plastic grocery bags won’t reduce waste. California’s Statewide Waste Characterization Study [pdf] shows that “Plastic Grocery and Other Merchandise Bags” consistently make up just 0.3 percent of the waste stream in the state. That’s three-tenths of 1 percent. In comparison, organic waste such as food and yard clippings makes up 32 percent while construction debris comprises about 30 percent. The effect of eliminating free grocery bags on the amount of waste generated in the city would be insignificant.



Current scientific estimates say that plastic grocery bags could take anywhere from 500-1000 years to degrade.

Surely you are not comparing plastic bags to organic waste which is BIODEGRADABLE within a short period of time?

Surely you would not have made such a blatant....mistake....[sm=rofl.gif]




MasterSlaveLA -> RE: Plastic bag industry wages war against 12 year old (6/20/2012 6:43:35 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: fucktoyprincess


Surely you're not so dumb as to have made such a blatantly stupid mistake of attributing one person's words to another?!!  Then again... [8|][sm=rofl.gif] LOL!!!


Oh, and I see you missed this little tid-bit...

quote:



...recycler and producer of environmentally friendly plastic bags



Reading and comprehension are your friends!!! [8|] 







erieangel -> RE: Plastic bag industry wages war against 12 year old (6/20/2012 7:33:23 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterSlaveLA

quote:

ORIGINAL: fucktoyprincess


Surely you're not so dumb as to have made such a blatantly stupid mistake of attributing one person's words to another?!!  Then again... [8|][sm=rofl.gif] LOL!!!


Oh, and I see you missed this little tid-bit...

quote:



...recycler and producer of environmentally friendly plastic bags



Reading and comprehension are your friends!!! [8|] 







Just because a CEO claims his product is environmentally friendly doesn't make it so. And of course this CEO is going to provide all the arguments for why banning plastic grocery bags is a bad idea--his bottom line is at stake!! Here's a good idea for banning free plastic grocery bags--when a store doesn't have to buy bags, their prices tend to be a little bit lower because their overhead is a little bit lower. We have 3 grocery store chains in my city that do not offer free bags and their prices are amazing compared to other stores (I still prefer Wegman's though because of selection of organic products).

The argument that banning plastic bags will cost jobs is factitious. If this same CEO wanted to move his plant to another country where producing his plastic bags would be cheaper would you be quoting his arguments for doing so?













MasterSlaveLA -> RE: Plastic bag industry wages war against 12 year old (6/20/2012 7:47:29 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: erieangel


quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterSlaveLA

quote:

ORIGINAL: fucktoyprincess


Surely you're not so dumb as to have made such a blatantly stupid mistake of attributing one person's words to another?!!  Then again... [8|][sm=rofl.gif] LOL!!!


Oh, and I see you missed this little tid-bit...

quote:



...recycler and producer of environmentally friendly plastic bags



Reading and comprehension are your friends!!! [8|] 




Just because a CEO claims his product is environmentally friendly doesn't make it so.



Well... surely you MUST have PROOF to the contrary to make such an allegation.  So by all means, please do provide your VERIFIABLE PROOF to support your allegation that this company's bags are NOT "environmentally friendly" -- or was this just more wildly ignorant blathering on your part?!! [8|]





erieangel -> RE: Plastic bag industry wages war against 12 year old (6/20/2012 7:54:07 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterSlaveLA

quote:

ORIGINAL: erieangel


quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterSlaveLA

quote:

ORIGINAL: fucktoyprincess


Surely you're not so dumb as to have made such a blatantly stupid mistake of attributing one person's words to another?!!  Then again... [8|][sm=rofl.gif] LOL!!!


Oh, and I see you missed this little tid-bit...

quote:



...recycler and producer of environmentally friendly plastic bags



Reading and comprehension are your friends!!! [8|] 




Just because a CEO claims his product is environmentally friendly doesn't make it so.



Well... surely you MUST have PROOF to the contrary to make such an allegation.  So by all means, please do provide your VERIFIABLE PROOF to support your allegation that this company's bags are NOT "environmentally friendly" -- or was this just more wildly ignorant blathering on your part?!! [8|]




I'm sure you have proof that they are environmentally friendly. Or were you just quoting some CEO who is looking after his bottom line?





Hillwilliam -> RE: Plastic bag industry wages war against 12 year old (6/20/2012 7:57:24 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterSlaveLA

Despite claims that plastics threaten our oceans and sea life, there is no evidence that free plastic grocery bags make up any significant portion of the plastic waste found on beaches or in the ocean. In fact, reports from environmental groups doing beach and ocean clean-ups show that plastic bags make up only about 2 percent of the debris.



I have personally performed necropsies on marine mammals that starved to death with a full stomach because their intestines were blocked by a plastic bag.

Plastic bags are also documented as a cause of death for most species of sea turtles, especially leatherbacks, because they feed on jellyfish and can't tell the difference in murky water
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-1369438/Dead-turtle-ingested-100s-pieces-plastic-highlights-sea-pollution.html




erieangel -> RE: Plastic bag industry wages war against 12 year old (6/20/2012 8:03:05 PM)

I find that so sad when an animal dies because of our wasteful ways.





Hillwilliam -> RE: Plastic bag industry wages war against 12 year old (6/20/2012 8:05:12 PM)

The world's largest manufacturer of paper bags is in Florence, KY. Paper Bags = American jobs.
http://durobag.com/

International Plastics which appears to be the major player in plastic bags has plants in China and Taiwan.




LookieNoNookie -> RE: Plastic bag industry wages war against 12 year old (6/20/2012 8:16:38 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: erieangel

I find that so sad when an animal dies because of our wasteful ways.




Always remember, for every cow that dies for our hamburgers....and angel gets its wings.

(That's true).




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